1984Echoes

I wouldn't worry about depleting resources. With a lot of kids coming up our payroll should be able to handle a few vets, even if they are costly. But Skubal isn't signing a free agent contract this offseason with us. So this isn't even relevant until offseason 2026. Any FA's that sign with Detroit aren't signing because Skubal is here ONLY in 2026, or HAS an extension or DOESN'T have an extension. There are only two reasons a FA will sign with Detroit this offseason, and neither have anything to do with Skubal: 1) Money 2) They WANT to be here.

So... Worth a shot in spring training. If nothing else he can be a 6th/7th/8th starter for Detroit (in Toledo) pending 2026 seasonal/ injury needs.

And here it is again. UNMITIGATED DISASTER!!! Holy FATALISM Batman!!!

PS: In Black and White: (I picked a starting point just to pick a starting point... (Starting with OUR offseason around Oct 22nd or so...) and there is NO way I can continue piling up the FATALISTIC versus OPTIMISTIC viewpoints in this thread...). It's endless. This isn't spin. It's pure fatalism versus optimism. And it's all over this thread in pure black and white ("We WON'T CONTEND UNTIL 2030 if we trade Skubal!!") Omigosh... there is just so much OVER the TOP fatalism I had to stop. Here is just a small sampling (my comments are in italics and brackets...): Fatalism: On 10/22/2025 at 8:49 AM, chasfh said: I think you’re right that trading Skubal … could have an impact on their psyche and thus performance afterward that … (Because trading Skubal means the rest of the team will just give up.) Optimism: On 10/22/2025 at 10:25 PM, Tiger337 said: In 2024, the Tigers gave their team the message that they were giving up on the season and then they couldn't stop winning! So, maybe they needed that message… Fatalism: On 10/23/2025 at 8:45 AM, chasfh said: Then maybe we should trade all our good players and pitchers for bags of balls and give up on 2026 so we can finally win our ring! … Fatalism: On 10/31/2025 at 8:46 AM, chasfh said: We should probably remember if the Tigers were to trade Skubal, they could kiss Bichette or Bregman or Tucker or Cease or just about any other halfway decent free agent goodbye. There’s no way any good player is going to want to come to a team … DOUBLE Fatalism!!!: On 10/31/2025 at 8:46 AM, chasfh said: And this doesn’t even take into account the effect such a trade …would have on the rest of the guys who are already here, as well as the guys who are due to come up. Who’s going to gladly bust their ass for a team that purposely trades their way out of playoff contention? (Because trading Skubal means the rest of the team will just GIVE UP!!! New kids coming up from the minors are NOT going to bust their ass to make MLB... they’re just going to give up! Hinch is just going to give up! EVERYBODY on the Tigers is just going to GIVE UP because we traded Skubal!!! OMIGOSH!!! The END of the WORLD!!!) Optimism: On 11/4/2025 at 6:20 AM, oblong said: ... If you think you have a good system in place you should be able to replace him. You don't need back to back Cy Young pitchers to replace him but a couple of players who might finish top ten. Fatalism: On 11/4/2025 at 8:27 AM, chasfh said: If we trade Skubal, our trajectory will go backward... Optimism: On 11/4/2025 at 1:25 PM, TcFlint said: Wrong! With Jobe, McGonigle, Anderson, Clark, Olson, Melton, Bicerno, Hamm, Green, Torkelson, Dingler, free agent signings, and whatever prospects we get for Skubal (if he is traded) we will NOT go backwards!!! One more year only for Skubal and a prospect in 2030 is malpractice IMO and is more than likely what we are going to get. Optimism: On 11/4/2025 at 10:51 AM, AlaskanTigersFan said: … I also think next year would be an adjustment anyways while waiting for McGonigle, Clark, Briceno and Liranzo to make their debuts and break in. Not to mention, hopefully Jobe should be back in August (fingers crossed). There's your true core to add to Greene, Dingler, Keith and Carpenter (hopefully Tork too but we'll see). … Tigers could make plenty of trades with Meadows, Max Anderson …, Lee, Wenceel Perez etc... to add to their pitching. There's a logjam there which could get us some decent pitchers. ... So yes, if I could trade Skubal and get all of those (multiple players in ATF’s trade proposals…) in the top 10-15 range... I'd do it. ... Fatalism: On 11/4/2025 at 11:51 AM, chasfh said: … position his team to get back to that same place no sooner than three years from now, which is 2028, at best, and probably more like 2029 or even 2030 (!!!). (HOLY FATALISM BATMAN !!!) For one thing, the fans would go absolutely ape**** (!!!) after … But what is arguably even worse is that Harris would lose the players in the organization … Riley Greene or Spencer Torkelson, Dillon Dingler, or a Jackson Jobe, or Kevin McGonigle or Max Clark or a dozen other ranked young talents (IT’S the END OF THE WORLD!!! JUST GIVE UP!!!) … but also, the free agents outside of this organization. What halfway decent free agent in his right mind is going to sign with a team operating with the expressed intent of going backward the year they come aboard? Who on god's green earth would want to sign up for that? And not only free agents this year, but free agents every single year Scott Harris is running this team. No top-tier free agent would ever want to devote … at any given moment, they are willing to blow it all up and go backwards because it might pay out four or five years now. Trading Tarik Skubal this winter is practically guaranteed to limit our prospective free agent pool to guys who are willing to sign one-year prove-it deals, and nothing more, for the rest of Harris's tenure with us. … (HOLY HYPERBOLE BATMAN!!!) (Like I said… END OF THE WORLD FATALISM!) After the Tigers win 3 straight World Series (Following the above theory: “But SCOTT HARRIS is running that team! I will NEVER sign with a team run by Scott Harris because…” Because Why?) In black and white. Fatalism: On 11/4/2025 at 1:08 PM, 4hzglory said: … Trading Skubal would all but guarantee the Tigers would be only getting FA's who need to rebuild their value, and that once homegrown players reach FA, if they are any good, they are likely gone. … (Because trading Skubal means ALL our pending FA’s will be traded. … NOT. There is NO PROOF that ALL future pending FA’s will just be traded. Where is this fatalism coming from? Especially since Harris has yet to have HIS team on the field, these are still mostly Avila’s players. I trust Harris to make GOOD judgements on which Avila players he wants to keep long term (I start with Dingler and Keith, plus…?), and which of his own players are good enough to sign to long-term extensions. Skubal is just too old to sign to a 10 year $400 mill contract, and is two years too early for a true Harris team. Plus pitchers like to blow out their arms and, again, he’ll be 30 years old at the START of any new contract in 2027… IMO. Again, IMO, I think trading Skubal means ZILCH for future extension/trade decisions. But maybe I’m being too Optimistic and should be more Fatalistic?)

What spin? Read the thread. It's all in here, black and white.

There's another dividing line, between those who: A) Believe that we can both trade Skubal AND sign other FA's or make other trades, and B) Those who believe that if we trade Skubal that that is the end of the Tigers. No one will want to sign with the Tigers. We will no longer be able to be a competitive team, starting in 2026. Nothing else counts or matters. Trade Skubal and it's the end of the Tigers.

So you believe Skubal should be traded for only players that suck?

100% I think the hyperventilating over what a terrible season in 2026 we'll have (ZERO chance at the playoffs!) if we trade Skubal... Is quite a bit overdone. And is severely myopic (to yours and several others' points, including mine... that OTHER moves ARE allowed by the Tigers) ... as if the Tigers aren't even allowed to make any other transactions once we trade Skubal because...? Because why? I don't know. Why aren't we allowed to make any other moves after we trade Skubal? I don't get it. Myopia is the only thing I can think of. And it shows a complete and absolute lack of faith in Scott Harris. IMO.

The Clash: "Should I Stay or Should I Go?" Interesting and excellent point...!

... break with the Tigers right out of Spring Training. Another thought: The Twins might POSSIBLY be open to trading Byron Buxton. I would be perfectly fine with trading Meadows and an extra AAA middle IF'er or two, for him. He's signed for 2026-28. The perfect guy, IMO, to bridge until Clark is ready. And when Clark does break into MLB... between the two of them they can slide around to create the best possible defensive OF. Greene can fit into whatever corner works best between those 3.

This is another good point. It means that 2026 is either UP or DOWN, all dependent on only ONE player (Skubal) that makes or breaks our season. I don't think that's a good place to be in, for any team. Also along those lines... I would think that we want to have 3 or 4 upper echelon stars on our team in order to have annual playoff hopes. At least. As a starting point. IMO. (These comments are not directed at you SoCal but at the general forum populace...) Which means... If Harris is looking at Clark-McGonigle as true top stars (sorry, I know this is only "potential"), and Tork/ Greene/ Carpenter/ Mize/ Keith? etc., etc., only as support players... and a team offers Harris what he believes can be an additional future (potential) top star or two or three... Shouldn't he take that offer? In order to have the requisite number of upper echelon stars that lead to annual playoff hunts? IMO... I believe he should be looking at exactly that.

Sorry Chas... but I gotta quote your post as it's the most apt for the following thoughts... After listening to Olney: I now 100% disagree with the sentiment in your post... And there are quite a few on here that have the same sentiments so to all who feel this way... Skubal's getting traded this offseason. 100% (IMO). The biggest detractive points are what has been outlined: Noone wants to empty their farm system. For only 1 year of a pitcher, no matter how good he is. And they're certainly not going to include any MLB talent. I mostly agree with this. EXCEPT... There is another way to think about this (I started thinking about this other thought-stream after listening to Buster), and it actually has been posted in this thread previously: And it's not just Cohen. There are others that are perfectly comfortable working with Boras. Dombrowski is another. The Dodgers are another. I'm not certain about the Red Sox. Maybe? Probably? The Blue Jays? Mariners? Dunno. But there are several with the "balls" to do just that. Trade for Skubal even without an immediate extension in place... That team is still going to be cocky enough to say "We'll sell him on us. He'll love this team and city. We'll do whatever it takes to keep him. We've worked with Boras before and we can do it again." What risk does that team take? The same as Detroit, with where we are at right now. One year of Skubal and only a Comp pick in 2027 to show for it. But there ARE teams that will take that risk... just as Hongbit pointed out. One other thing as Buster points out: After the 2026 season... who knows what happens with the new CBA negotiations. Teams in fact, right now, are shying away from major commitments in 2027. So... there is the real possibility that a team will WANT to take a big swing in 2026, even at the cost of quite a lot in prospect/ future control terms... for ONLY the one year of Skubal. They will try to re-sign him... but are PERFECTLY willing to wait until the new CBA is resolved. Meaning... not add in the cost of a new Skubal contract until then. And... That may actually HURT Boras/Skubal in free agency next year. Not that he WON'T get that massive offer... but that no one will get them offers until the new CBA. They, and all other 2027 FA's, may get stuck waiting for that to be resolved first. At least that's what I am getting from what Olney is saying...

He's not going to the bullpen. He's going on the roster as the 5th starter OR he's going to Toledo as the 6th/7th/8th starter... How ever that plays out. But... No, he's not going to the bullpen.

Bucks site says it is only a calf strain. Out a few weeks. So not serious. Although with age... The injuries, even minor ones, start to pop up more frequently...

Cade should give him a quick call...

This was my second thought. My first thought was: "Looks like a Herschel Walker trade... to me." So... no. But another thought occurred to me during tonight's game... as KP was throwing up 32 points... Milwaukee will say no to these changes... But here I go anyways: Harris, Ivey, Holland, LeVert for Giannis & Kevin Porter Jr. Plus (4) 1sts and the (3) 1st round swaps... plus we have 12-14 2nd rounders over the next 7 years... In the years we lose our 1sts in this trade we keep our highest 2nd rounder, they get all the remaining 2nd rounders. If they say no, c'est la vie. If that trade actually gets done (a shock to mine and everyone's system?): Looking at it from the Piston's Roster: Cade-KPJ-Ausar-Giannis-Duren start. I would take that starting 5 over any in the NBA. Pushed to the bench: Stew-Duncan-Paul Reed at PF?, maybe KPJ has to run all the bench PG minutes so is a little bit staggered with either Cade or KPJ always on the floor? And somehow, some additional guard minutes needed between Lanier-Jenkins-Sasser-Javonte Green? Bench might be a bit of work-in-progress but I think we could get it to a serviceable level... But that's the Giannis trade I would sign off on. Would Milwaukee? EDIT (Just some minor grammar changes...)

There are several points I disagree with... 1) I don't think the Mets are the only outlier. 2) Has everyone forgotten that Dave Dombrowski likes shiny toys? 3) Anyone who wants to take down the Dodgers has their eyes on Skubal. And Tucker or others, etc... But... Skubal. 4) When we traded for Miggy with one year left before FA... We immediately signed him to a long-term extension if memory serves. I believe Boras was his agent? (although I have a faulty memory... was it Rosenhaus?) 5) Boras HAS signed players before getting them to FA before... Not his MO or preference... but meet his and his client's price... And the deal gets done. 6) The Red Sox would be willing to meet their price if they traded for Skubal. So would the Mets. So would the Phillies. Even the Dodgers would do that, as a blocking measure, just to ensure the Mets or Phillies do NOT get Skubal (IMO...). 7) I AGREE that Harris doesn't want to trade Skubal. However, as the top guy for the Tigers, he is going to make the BEST DECISION for the TIGERS ORG. Not the fans. Not the media. Not Boras. Not Skubal. I think his FIRST want is to sign Skubal to an extension... but at a price and term that he believes is in the Org's best interest. If they are pricing themselves higher than what he believes is good for the Org (and Boras definitely will have that price too high), then I am going to guess that Harris, IN THE BEST INTERESTS of the TIGERS ORG... will absolutely accept a Godfather offer. In the interests of the Tigers Org, and NOT just for 2026 and ONLY 2026... He will rightly have concluded that a Godfather offer is superior to having Skubal in 2026 and then a Comp pick in 2027. This may upset everyone on this board. But Harris doesn't answer to any of us. We are ONLY fans. He has a responsibility to the ORG, NOT just for 2026, but for this year and multiple years to follow. If he receives a Godfather offer, he WILL pull the trigger. He will have correctly concluded that 4 (or 3 or 5 or whatever) very highly talented players that he receives in return for Skubal is greater value to the Tigers Organization. ATF and I are correct. Even if that upsets everyone else on this board. Sorry everyone.

I agree with all of this. Which is why I said he will get his shot in spring training. He may end up as being nothing more than a 6th 7th starter in Toledo. Or he may be better than that and grab a 5th spot. It's all up to him, even if he's a long shot. And I also agree with this. It's perfectly fine, by me and I'm guessing a few others here, that Harris is looking for those long shot 5th / 6th / 7th / 8th starters for 2026... because that's what it takes to get through today's 162 game season. But I hope he gets ahold of at least one 2nd or 3rd starter type on a multi-year contract. I'd be happy with Suarez, or Valdes, or King, or Imai... We all have our preferences... I'd like at least one high-level starter though...

He'll have just as fair a shot at opening day as anyone else not named Skubal. I wouldn't bet my life savings on him... He'll just be an interesting story to follow in spring training. And... Somehow, some way... If he's blowing the doors off in ST... Well... Let's just see what happens. I wouldn't recommend holding breath... Although stranger things have happened...

That's easy. Sign Bregman, sign Tucker, sign Imai. McGonigle makes opening day SS. And we are EASILY a better team than they were last year.

I can easily see a big trade helping the Tigers this year. I'm not saying the same impact as having Skubal... Nor that every guy they get in return... But a couple guys who just broke into MLB or are in AA or AAA and ready to break through... Can help the Tigers. Whether they are top 100 guys or close to it... I think Harris will demand that.

Buster Olney says Tigers are listening to Skubal offers. Not shutting talks down at this point. At any point they can do that, shut down the talks and say "we're keeping him". But they haven't done so yet. I'm still on the Sign him to an extension OR get a Godfather offer. Olney says the Tigers' asking price is very, very high at this point. To be continued...

For some reason... I've always been extremely attracted to petite, beautiful women. Not married ones that is. But my Ex is 5' 2". Now if I could only talk Eva Longoria into a date...

I would kill for 5' 10" All my family is there or better. But alas... I think I got all the brains instead of height and... Well, I'll just have to live with that...

I'd turn Glasnow into our closer. And ask for one more high-end prospect.