1984Echoes

More of this please. Trade assets to me and nothing more, at this point. Add in Harris and Holland and lots of 1sts... I'd like to think we could add 1 or 2 key guys that make this team better/ more suited to Cade and the other young talent/ 3 & D (or at least top-notch defenders) on this team... with what we should have available to trade...

And only 1 turnover. Great ratio.

He'll be an RFA this summer, same as Duren... But because of the injuries my guess is Ivey will want to sign a short-term (1 or 2 years...) contract to try and rebuild any value that he may or may not have. On that basis, I believe Detroit/ Langdon/ JB will want him resigned to try and grow him to as high a play-level as possible, and then cross that next contract bridge when they get there... Is it more valuable to us to see if Ivey can develop to a much higher level on a cheap 2-year RFA, or to use him as the key player in acquiring TM3? And save all our (late round) 1sts (if we keep him for now) along the way...? I have mixed feelings on that... But I'm leaning towards bringing in another dynamic player or two right now to maximize THIS version of the Pistons...

Also: Is Ivey/ Holland attractive? or at least attractive enough, along with the 1sts... And Harris/ Lavert at least mildly attractive enough as salary filler...?

What if it is two 1sts and one swap each? Is that feasible?

I'm not worried about Danielson at all. Just like MBN and so many other young kids that get sent down to the AHL for more "seasoning"... I'm just going to attribute this to the "learning curve" that he is going to have to go through to get up to top NHL speed. He's not there yet... But... He's also still only 21. So... We'll see. That's all we can do is... wait. And see if he can come back stronger, faster, better. Even if that isn't until the 2026-27 season.

Here is a question: Multiple 1sts (actual picks + swaps) plus multiple players for Giannis = yes. What if it were multiple 1sts (less then ALL of them as in Giannis) that swing both Trey Murphy III and Michael Porter Jr.? A core of Cade-Ausar-Stew-Duren-Duncan R. is protected, but anyone else could be included. How many 1sts does it take to get TM3? How many 1sts for MPJ? Is that a yes if it could be swung? Multiple 1sts, protecting our core as I outlined? Equals = Cade-Ausar-TM3-MPJ-Duren as starting 5... Duncan-Stew + (Daniss? Lanier? Sasser? Green? Reid?) coming off the bench. Thoughts?

It wouldn't bother me if Campbell had "input" the first several games of 2026 until he is certain Goff and Blough (or whomever is the new OC) and himself, are all on the same page with what they feel the offense should be.

I agree with this. And if they hire him as our OC... One additional point would be: Our O-Line will be in transition next year. No matter how they try to fix it... there will be new guys, and already-Lions at new positions... IMO. Which means it may take a few games for our reconstructed O-Line to gel. That also means, to me, that Blough would have a few games to refine his playcalling before this "new offense" got up to full speed. Call it... "working out the kinks". Both for the new guys/ new positions O-Line and for the new OC, Blough or otherwise...

Yeah... It's not lunacy or looney... I'm on board with you... IMO, I think it is just simple impatience.

Caught this at M-Live: Cossa’s career-high saves helps Griffins extend points streak Published: Jan. 03, 2026, 10:54 a.m. By Ansar Khan | akhan1@mlive.com Sebastian Cossa recorded a career-high 47 saves and stopped both shooters in the shootout Friday to lead the Grand Rapids Griffins to a 3-2 victory over the Chicago Wolves at Van Andel Arena. The Griffins’ 27-1-1-1 record, good for 56 points, is the best in the AHL history through 30 games. They extended their points streak to 17 games, the third-longest in franchise history. John Leonard and Dominik Shine scored in the shootout. Cossa, the AHL’s goaltender of the month for November and December, improved to 15-1-1. Antti Tuomisto tied the game at 2-2 with 2:14 remaining in regulation with his career-high sixth goal. Michael Brandsegg-Nygard opened the scoring at 14:34 of the first period with his eighth goal of the season and extended his points streak to six games. The Griffins are 20-0 when scoring first. The teams meet again tonight in Chicago (8 p.m.). (Postava won this game too (his first game in two months0 to extend the Griffins streak to 17-0-1… (not 47 saves plus two shootout saves though…)).

Maduro's REGIME is still in place. Try again.

I've already stated specifically why I want the "big kids" called up. And you and I are already in complete agreement on one specific move (NOT GR related...): Swapping Kasper and Finnie because at least Kasper won't get knocked on his ass like Finnie is... And Kasper needs to be challenged, on the 1st line, in both our opinions... And... Finnie can just as easily spark a 3rd line with Danielson and Ras, in protected minutes, as he has (earlier) done on the 1st line for Larkin and Raymond... by doing dirty work and making smart IQ plays. Only not against other teams' top, bigger, tougher, more experienced lines. I'm not saying Wallinder Tuomisto MBN Cossa are "better" than Johansson Hamonic Talbot Soderblom... But they have size, youth, speed, reach... and even if NOT NHL playoff-level toughness, they still at LEAST have size and youth to absorb more punishment than several of the players on the current Wings roster. Like Johansson, Hamonic, and Talbot. Trial by fire. You can be upset by that if you want to... But I cold-heartedly want to toss those kids into the fire. What a Sadist am I...

I believe he's an RFA... right? Which means... they don't have to max him. They can tell him "go out and check your market..." I don't know if anyone would offer him because they know we'd just match. But if he did get an offer, I don't think it's $30 mill per. His market will be much lower than that because other teams can obviously see the same shortcomings you've outlined... The short story is... maybe he costs less than we think. Not a max player. But I don't know what those numbers/ years would be. Or if it could be structured advantageously...? NBA contracts = I know nothing.

I started to look this up not even pertaining to your reference... But multiple ideas started popping up in my head... Mel Blanc? The voice actor for Barney in the Flintstones? ... Nah! Rick Moranis from the Flintstone movies...? Nah!!! (Rick Moranis... what an actor!!!) HOLY CRAP!!! I LOVED Night Shift when I was a kid and barely even remember that movie. Michael Keaton TORTURED Henry Winkler in that! Great fun! Hilarious! I'm going to have to watch that again... And it HAD to be Keaton that uttered that line...!

Excuse me? Which numbers did I pull out of my ass? There were no formulas in my post. Are you talking about my WAG? My WILD ASS GUESS? Do you not know what a WAG is? Because yes, I feel you are being very rude to me in your post.

He hasn't done that. And I don't expect him to. But I DO expect him to evaluate all players on the team, in Detroit and throughout the Org, regardless whether he pulled them into the Org or Avila did... on his OWN set of expected parameters. If he expects his top 5 players to average a .340 OBP or better, and have some HR pop (they don't have to be 50 HR guys in my mind, especially in Comerica) but more line-drive pop (lots of doubles & triples...) then I expect him to populate the top of the order, and to search for, these types of players. He wants hitters that "command the strike zone", and pitchers. I've also seen from most of his draftees that he is searching for and values fielding capability. Not everyone, he traded for Sweeney and JHM and drafted Anderson. But his top draftees seem to all have that ability. So... Maybe Tork sticks. Or doesn't. Same with Greene. Same with Keith. Same with Dingler. I expect those players to... meet Harris's expectations. He very well may keep them if they do. Or at least if they come damn close to what he expects. I expect Hinch and he will have lots of conversations on whether each of these guys can step it up... or not. And if they don't meet his expectations, and he does move on from them... it ain't because they are attached to Avila. It's because they proved themselves not good enough and he found someone better. Or at least I hope that's how it goes.

They're going to start getting pushed around, if they aren't already. I want all the "big kids" called up from GR. Just throw them into the fire... I don't care. Let them learn EXACTLY how difficult NHL hockey is. But that's just me. I know Stevie Y won't do that.

This (and Lee) are correct.

Ummm, yeah... Context matters here. And IIRC, the context was SPECIFICALLY: "How are you going to handle the innings needed to get through the season after trading away these pitchers?" That has NOTHING to do with the playoffs. That is simply Harris calling up minor league kids (for the most part... and they were Avila AAA guys... for the most part: Brieske, Wentz, Olson, Montero, Faedo, Foley, Hurter, Hanifee... did I miss anyone?) to fill innings or grabbing a waiver wire guy to fill some innings. Sorry, but that is NOT "Harris leading the Tigers into the playoffs the past two years" (I think chas has put it exactly like that at least a few times...); which, IMO, is completely ridiculous. Harris was simply trying to fill innings. By supplying minor league call ups that Hinch/Fetter needed. That Hinch & Fetter used those guys to the effect that those players got us into the playoffs is a credit to Hinch/Fetter, NOT Harris. IMO. Harris's "plan", with Hinch/Fetter, was pitching chaos because we were basically out of starters (after Skubal), and they all agreed that was the only way to get through the innings... But Hinch & Fetter had to successfully manage those players and put them into positions to succeed. Harris doesn't get credit for that... he only gets credit for supplying the pitchers needed (all those Avila guys they called up from AAA...) for Hinch and Fetter to implement chaos. It's not zero (for Harris). but it certainly isn't "LEADING them into the playoffs." Again, that's ridiculous, IMO. 2024 (just on a WAG) was 98% Hinch/Fetter, 2% Harris. IMO.

That would be Tucker and Bregman, this year. And he made one of those offers last year to Bregman. But maybe this year he feels he needs to back off of that and wait for more of "his" type of players to percolate into the majors before he takes another swing. Or he's "once bitten, twice shy" with Boras/Bregman and doesn't want to get burned two years in a row by the same combination... Dunno... I'm just guessing.

Inside those parentheses belongs ("the least damaging spot... IE: LF or 1B, or if necessary, simply DH even though there can be only 1 in a game...")

The flipside of that is... Maybe Harris feels this is not HIS team, not yet. It might be a contender (Harris could believe so) but he still doesn't feel the team is at a high enough level to make major commitments yet... not until they are molded more closely to his expectations (not much different from what you're saying, but... slightly). Let's say in 2 years McGonigle, Clark, Hao Yu Lee & Briceno are up starting for the Tigers. Harris decides to keep Dingler and Keith and Wenceel Perez (4th outfielder)... Jobe, Melton, and several other pitchers... Rainer is in AA or AAA and on the cusp... What holes are still left on the team? Has he already moved on from Tork/ Carpenter/ Greene? He likes high contact/high OBP/with whatever power can be gained from those types of players... Would it now be HIS team (with several of those players graduated to Detroit?) I think chas was pointing this out specifically a little bit earlier on the thread... NOW if Tucker or Bregman or another "missing piece" to the team is available... Do Ilitch and Harris say "Let's go for it" and offer the BIG contract? THIS is the tell, to me, on Harris and Ilitch's future plan for the team. When it is HIS team and he's just missing "one guy", who is available in trade or FA. Also, or alternatively... if he moves on from Carpenter/ Skubal/ Mize/ Tork... I'm not squeamish about that. ThI think that is much more telling on what this Org's philosophy will be. I think at this point in time it's too early to say definitively one way or the other...

I still think Jung has an outside chance at 2B... Maybe for only a cup in 2026... Unless Torres gets nicked up a couple week or so... Jung may or may not get that period for a shot but I want to at least have that in the back of my mind as a possibility... But then Torres leaves so does Jung get a fair shot at 2B in 2027? I'm of the belief that he would...

How Skubal is handled will tell us nothing. He's on the wrong timeframe. If we pay him according to Boras, we'll be paying for his 30+ years (age), for too long (10 years), and for future injured years. So... No thanks. Wrong timeframe. Most of Avila's players are on the wrong timeframe. Dingler and Keith most likely would join in the Harris-McGonigle-Clark timeframe, possibly Jobe if he can stay healthy and reach his potential... But I think a lot of Avila players are going to be shunted off the team when Harris finds better options more akin to his philosophy.