2023 Detroit Tigers Regular Season Discussion Thread

[bobrob2004]

37 minutes ago, casimir said:

Sure.

I guess my point was more along the lines of questioning what kind of offense is this?  Its kind of weird that SO% and BB% both dropped several percentage points from month to month.  Is it simply the result of becoming more aggressive at the plate?  Is it just baseball being baseball?  Will we see them be more like April or more like May or maybe somewhere in between?

There's been a few changes too.  Baddoo replacing Meadows.  McKinstry getting more playing time over Schoop.  I don't think Ibanez has suddenly figured out how to hit at the age of 30.  

 

Detroit Tigers Player Splits: May

Rk	Name	G	GS	PA	AB	R	H	2B	3B	HR	RBI	SB	CS	BB	SO	BA	OBP	SLG	OPS	TB	GDP	HBP	SH	SF	IBB	ROE	BAbip	tOPS+	sOPS+
	Team Total	97	81	340	314	44	84	20	0	10	43	8	1	19	69	.268	.318	.427	.744	134	4	5	0	2	0	3	.312	126	104
1	Andy Ibáñez	9	8	28	27	6	11	4	0	1	4	0	0	1	0	.407	.429	.667	1.095	18	1	0	0	0	0	0	.385	159	198
2	Eric Haase	8	7	30	28	7	11	1	0	2	7	1	0	2	8	.393	.433	.643	1.076	18	0	0	0	0	0	1	.500	184	193
3	Javier Báez	9	9	40	35	7	11	1	0	3	5	1	0	2	4	.314	.400	.600	1.000	21	1	3	0	0	0	0	.286	185	172
4	Riley Greene	9	8	37	34	5	12	3	0	1	8	3	0	3	9	.353	.405	.529	.935	18	0	0	0	0	0	0	.458	167	156
5	Spencer Torkelson	9	9	38	36	4	12	4	0	1	6	0	0	1	7	.333	.368	.528	.896	19	1	1	0	0	0	0	.393	169	144
6	Akil Baddoo	6	5	22	21	2	7	2	0	0	2	1	1	1	5	.333	.364	.429	.792	9	0	0	0	0	0	0	.438	141	119
7	Zach McKinstry	9	6	30	22	5	6	0	0	0	2	1	0	7	3	.273	.433	.273	.706	6	0	0	0	1	0	1	.300	89	102
8	Jake Rogers	7	6	20	20	1	2	1	0	1	4	0	0	0	8	.100	.100	.300	.400	6	0	0	0	0	0	0	.091	11	5
9	Matt Vierling	8	8	34	32	3	4	0	0	1	2	1	0	1	6	.125	.177	.219	.395	7	1	1	0	0	0	1	.120	23	9
10	Nick Maton	8	5	24	22	1	3	2	0	0	2	0	0	1	9	.136	.167	.227	.394	5	0	0	0	1	0	0	.214	33	8
11	Miguel Cabrera	4	4	16	16	1	3	0	0	0	1	0	0	0	4	.188	.188	.188	.375	3	0	0	0	0	0	0	.250	66	5
12	Zack Short	6	3	10	10	1	1	1	0	0	0	0	0	0	6	.100	.100	.200	.300	2	0	0	0	0	0	0	.250	-36	-20
13	Jonathan Schoop	5	3	11	11	1	1	1	0	0	0	0	0	0	0	.091	.091	.182	.273	2	0	0	0	0	0	0	.091	9	-27

[gehringer_2]

2 minutes ago, bobrob2004 said:

I don't think Ibanez has suddenly figured out how to hit at the age of 30.  

 

Truly. OTOH, in his limited MLB AB he's holding a 700 OPS. That not anything to get excited about and even that may not be sustainable,  but for now it is at least in the ball park of major league. Compared to what we are getting out of a Schoop or Cabrera that's a big improvement!

[bobrob2004]

17 minutes ago, mtutiger said:

Honestly, ERod would need to be extended for sure just because the AAV of his current deal is too low for how he's pitching, but maybe the same could be said for him in that the org did stand behind him last year when he was away and when the fan base was agitated by whatever personal problems were going on in his life. Not sure that's a guarantee in other orgs.

I wouldn't be surprised to see him traded for a hitter or 2 at the deadline.  His motivation is based purely on how much money he can make and if there is even a slim chance of him making more money elsewhere, he's going to opt out.

I don't know how much Harris would want him on the team anyway.  Loyalty and teammanship isn't something that Rodriguez posses.  

[mtutiger]

14 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

Truly. OTOH, in his limited MLB AB he's holding a 700 OPS. That not anything to get excited about and even that may not be sustainable,  but for now it is at least in the ball park of major league. Compared to what we are getting out of a Schoop or Cabrera that's a big improvement!

He came into last year as the Rangers Opening Day 3B, iirc.... some of that is a reflection of the Rangers not being the best ballclub in 2022, but they also weren't exactly down on him as a contributor going into last year either.

[gehringer_2]

4 minutes ago, bobrob2004 said:

Loyalty and teammanship isn't something that Rodriguez posses.  

There's a balance to strike though - you have to keep a good clubhouse, but if you throw every athlete that's only in it for themselves overboard, you're going to have a whole team of James McCanns and lose a lot of games with it. There are a lot of selfish players out there with a lot of rings.

[mtutiger]

Just now, gehringer_2 said:

There's a balance to strike though - you have to keep a good clubhouse, but if you throw every athlete that's only in it for themselves overboard, you're going to have a whole team of James McCanns and lose a lot of games with it. There are a lot of selfish players out there with a lot of rings.

I'm not sure it's a narrative that I buy either.... especially with all the talk from DD/Petry about how ERod has been working with / talking with Wentz and some of the other starters and trying to mentor some.

[RatkoVarda]

this is probably too light, but a one year extension at 31M, makes it a 4/80M deal from 2024-27, through age 34 season

18, 16, 15, 31

[bobrob2004]

2 minutes ago, mtutiger said:

I'm not sure it's a narrative that I buy either.... especially with all the talk from DD/Petry about how ERod has been working with / talking with Wentz and some of the other starters and trying to mentor some.

I take a lot of things that announcers say with a grain of salt.  Most of the time they are saying things that the audience wants to hear and not what's actually happening.  Not that I don't think Rodriguez hasn't been talking to Wentz, but I do question the "mentor" part.  

[bobrob2004]

3 minutes ago, RatkoVarda said:

this is probably too light, but a one year extension at 31M, makes it a 4/80M deal from 2024-27, through age 34 season

18, 16, 15, 31

I think if they do anything it'll be a reconstruction of the whole deal instead of years being tacked on.  

[Dan Gilmore]

No offense, but I take an internet poster’s opinion of ERod’s “loyalty and teamsmanship” with a huge grain of salt. It may be very accurate, but is still just an opinion.

[gehringer_2]

5 minutes ago, Dan Gilmore said:

No offense, but I take an internet poster’s opinion of ERod’s “loyalty and teamsmanship” with a huge grain of salt. It may be very accurate, but is still just an opinion.

The least you can say about ERod is that whatever motivates him, it may be more complex than the average jock. A guy interested only in money or his own success doesn't walk away for a season = for whatever reasons he did.

Edited May 11, 2023 by gehringer_2

[oblong]

These issues are so ripe for rumor and speculation and the "employer" really can't say anything.  I've dealt with it as a manager and it's frustrating when people insist on knowing more than I could legally divulge.  It's private.  There's rules.

Remember that time when Magglio was going thru stuff and it turns out his wife had a cancer scare?

 

[mtutiger]

18 minutes ago, oblong said:

These issues are so ripe for rumor and speculation and the "employer" really can't say anything.  I've dealt with it as a manager and it's frustrating when people insist on knowing more than I could legally divulge.  It's private.  There's rules.

Remember that time when Magglio was going thru stuff and it turns out his wife had a cancer scare?

 

This is 100% accurate. Fans will read whatever they want onto it, but the Occam's Razor explanation is that Eduardo had to deal with something absolutely hellish in nature family wise last year and, whatever that issue is, it has been dealt with and he's back performing and contibuting.

And it's not just DD or Petry either, his actual teammates are currently heaping praise onto him (such as Riley Greene yesterday)... I'm pretty sure I have seen quotes from the other starters (Wentz for sure) about how they are learning from him as well. Scott Harris had an appearance on MLB Network yesterday where he was praising him. It's not like this is "fans seeing what they want to see", he legitimately looks like he's in a better place and contributing this year.

That doesn't mean that he's gonna stick around or that Harris won't use him as a trade chip, but just as Eduardo appears to have moved on from whatever happened last year, maybe the fanbase should as well.

[RandyMarsh]

According to ESPN's WAR E-Rod now leads all pitchers in baseball and is 3rd among all players only trailing Acuna and Franco by .1 and .2 respectively.

Edited May 11, 2023 by RandyMarsh

[RandyMarsh]

1 hour ago, mtutiger said:

This is 100% accurate. Fans will read whatever they want onto it, but the Occam's Razor explanation is that Eduardo had to deal with something absolutely hellish in nature family wise last year and, whatever that issue is, it has been dealt with and he's back performing and contibuting.

And it's not just DD or Petry either, his actual teammates are currently heaping praise onto him (such as Riley Greene yesterday)... I'm pretty sure I have seen quotes from the other starters (Wentz for sure) about how they are learning from him as well. Scott Harris had an appearance on MLB Network yesterday where he was praising him. It's not like this is "fans seeing what they want to see", he legitimately looks like he's in a better place and contributing this year.

That doesn't mean that he's gonna stick around or that Harris won't use him as a trade chip, but just as Eduardo appears to have moved on from whatever happened last year, maybe the fanbase should as well.

I did enjoy seeing him mess around with Boyd the other day when Matt was doing the in game interview. Like ERod interrupted the interview to put the WIngs HR helmet on Boyd as they both shared a laugh. Seemed to really be fitting in as "one of the boys."

[Jim Cowan]

I am surprised that the writer of that puff piece mentioned the game when Ibanez started in right field, that almost caused a loss.  And without looking it up I think that since then he has started every game at third base, which is what should happen whether the pitcher is lefthanded or righthanded.  Not a chess piece in other words.

The difference this year is that he isn't playing chess with Harold, Willi, Reyes and Barnhart.

[SoCalTiger]

Harris has definetly raised the "floor" and only Tork -Green- EROD (has already)- Baez and Skuball have the skill sets to raise the ceiling in my opinion and one already is who unfortunately will be pitching elsewhere in 2024. But its much better for sure. 

[mtutiger]

2 hours ago, Jim Cowan said:

I am surprised that the writer of that puff piece mentioned the game when Ibanez started in right field, that almost caused a loss.  And without looking it up I think that since then he has started every game at third base, which is what should happen whether the pitcher is lefthanded or righthanded.  Not a chess piece in other words.

The difference this year is that he isn't playing chess with Harold, Willi, Reyes and Barnhart.

Tucker Barnhart.... can't believe that trade/signing got so much hype in retrospect.

[Shinzaki]

It's not just the fact that Reyes and the Castros were pretty bad...they were pretty bad for years...it just got...tiring.

[RandyMarsh]

1 hour ago, mtutiger said:

Tucker Barnhart.... can't believe that trade/signing got so much hype in retrospect.

Yeah I remember when we acquired him and I heard some hype around it I thought to myself "I didn't think he was that good?" so then I checked his bref page and I'm like "maybe I'm missing something?" so I check his savant and FG pages and still nothing so I finally came to the conclusion that the people that hyped him up must have had a REALLY low bar or put way too much stock in his supposed receiving abilities behind the plate. 

[Motor City Sonics]

Who is this Michael Caberna guy hitting .188 in May?

[casimir]

9 hours ago, Motor City Sonics said:

Who is this Michael Caberna guy hitting .188 in May?

At least he's been limited to pretty much lower third of the lineup vs LHP.

[chasfh]

So, basically, what’s being derided as Hinch playing “chess” was moving players in and out of lineups and situations was apparently to figure out who could do what where, as he did the first several weeks of the season to a chorus of complaints, and when he’s found someone who could do a job consistently, he has stuck with them, such as Ibanez starting at third base three of the last four games.

Innnnnteresting …

[mtutiger]

18 minutes ago, chasfh said:

So, basically, what’s being derided as Hinch playing “chess” was moving players in and out of lineups and situations was apparently to figure out who could do what where, as he did the first several weeks of the season to a chorus of complaints, and when he’s found someone who could do a job consistently, he has stuck with them, such as Ibanez starting at third base three of the last four games.

Innnnnteresting …

Again, my thing is that he knows enough to adjust when a particular player isn't doing well or when a particular lineup configuration isn't working. There are a lot of managers out there you cannot say that about.

He isn't perfect, he does make mistakes, but the Tigers are still lucky to have him in the grand scheme of things.

[mtutiger]

Random thought, but I wonder the degree to which the AL Central landscape in 2023 (ie. a slappy fight between mediocre-to-bad baseball teams) influenced the degree to which Scott Harris thought this was an attractive job to take.

Clearly the Tigers have a ways to go toward respectability, but from Harris' perspective, it may have looked like an easier turnaround to work with this club and all of its issues than holding out for another job in a much tougher division. Particularly if he did get some assurances about payroll from Pizza Jr if this team started to show itself being closer to contention.