2023 Detroit Tigers Regular Season Discussion Thread

[Jim Cowan]

It's pretty obvious that Avila wasn't losing on purpose tp improve his draft position.  He tried to improve the team every year, and wasn't any good at it.

If the plan was to lose every year, why did Ausmus get fired?

Here's what was said when Gardenhire replaced Ausmus - he would be a calm, wise, veteran presence to guide the core of good young players who were arriving.

[casimir]

10 hours ago, Edman85 said:

Things were on the rise two weeks ago, then two starting pitchers and three outfielders went down and the team is in a tailspin. Jonathan Davis's opt out was... poorly timed.

Things fell apart after April ended.  17-9 in March/April, 6-20 in May, 3-7 so far in June.

[Edman85]

16 minutes ago, casimir said:

Things fell apart after April ended.  17-9 in March/April, 6-20 in May, 3-7 so far in June.

I was talking about the Tigers. Everything was hunky dory Memorial Day before the wave of injuries. Davis was brought up because he is an upgrade on Marisnick as an emergency CF.

[casimir]

1 minute ago, Edman85 said:

I was talking about the Tigers. Everything was hunky dory Memorial Day before the wave of injuries. Davis was brought up because he is an upgrade on Marisnick as an emergency CF.

Sorry, the Johnathan Davis talk switched me to the Mud Hens.

[Motor City Sonics]

If Torkelson had a better lineup around him............

[alex]

   All IMHO: I am beginning to wonder why is this management so concerned about getting spots 20-26 on the roster filled. They need top talent. More everyday types. All the utility guys that maybe do not K so much and walk a bit are 'not' going to make up for the lack of stronger talent. Yes, some combo of McKinstry, Vierling, Maton, Skolak, Rizzo, Ibanez, Nevin, Short, etc. are 'ok' - and it is a good thing that they play multiple positions (however so could Goodrum, Jones, Castros, etc.) but this team needs 'Talent'.

If the team is so consistently bad, talented players will not want to come here FA wise. There is a difference between a 65 win team and a 75 win team -  10 games. The point is things can change fast. Heck 2 weeks ago we were thinking of competing for the division, now to avoid a 100 losses. Who knows in two weeks again (seriously).

FA and trades are not the answer (but a couple can help). Drafting and developing young talent IS a big part of the answer. Yes, the past administration did 'not' draft very well. Too many SPs. That mindset has hopefully changed and all teams this day and age need apx 10 SPs between the MLB staff, AAA/AA and long relief on hand (Q - what do Mize, Manning, Skubal, ERod, Turnbull, Faedo & Jobe have in common right now?).

I have mentioned repeatedly the days of 3 SP on a team throwing 200+ innings are loooong gone! (note: perhaps an outlier staff or two may occur.) Crazy, we used to think in the 90's to early 2000's how could any of those previous decade SPs toss 250-300+ innings...

I do not see the point of A.J. talking about McKinstry now being thought about for some games in CF. We heard all this before (again Goodrum, Jones, Castros, Reyes, etc.). Forget that. He can play 2B, 3B and sometimes a corner OF spot.

FAs? There is a difference here with position players and Ps. Ps will more likely come here as they know Comerica has a reputation as a 'pitchers park'. Still, a team can try to get '0ne' position player a year that could be a longer term fit (easier said than done of course).

Trades? This is where scouting really comes in hand. This list was posted by SeattleMike:
https://www.mlb.com/news/mlb-trade-candidates-change-of-scenery-2023

These type of players may be worth 'calculated risks'.

Drafting and development are the key and supplementing from there. You do not have to wait for a core to 'develop'. We have Greene, Tork, Carpenter, Keith, Malloy, PMeadows, JJung, Campos, Dingler, etc. If this developmental staff cannot get 3 'good' players out of that group, well then... We will have 3 of the top 46 picks this year.

Let's start adding now - as things in baseball (esp this division) can change very quickly.

On another note: I am not sure what has happened to Haase. Seems he is now, and has been, in the very low production area (with the exception of 2-3 games this year). C is an area that may need more attention. Go Tigs.

 

[buddha]

13 hours ago, Tiger337 said:

I didn't think the Athletic would keep growing.  I got a subscription for a short time and there were some good articles here and there, but not enough for me to keep the subscription. I think most people would prefer to subscribe to a site with a narrow focus rather than a site that tries to cover everything.     

the nytimes bought them so they must be doing something profitable.

i like the athletic a lot.  lots of coverage for a lot of different sports.

[Tiger337]

I pay for Fangraphs (to limit the ads) and Baseball Reference (in order to get stathead).  That is the extent of my baseball subscriptions.  I used to subscribe to Baseball Prospectus and Baseball America.  Baseball Prospectus wasn't giving me much that I wasn't already getting at FG and BREF and their stats pages are an embarrassment.  I used to like BA because of the hard copy magazine, but it's not as extensive as it used to be and their Tigers writer is terrible.  

[gehringer_2]

40 minutes ago, buddha said:

the nytimes bought them so they must be doing something profitable.

the Times or the Athletic? At the time of the purchase Athletic was operating at a loss.

Quote

The Athletic brought in about $65 million in revenue last year, with operating losses of roughly $55 million, Ms. Levien told analysts Thursday. Ms. Levien said The Athletic would eat into The Times’s profitability over the next three years, before adding to the bottom line, as it adds new subscribers and more advertising revenue - https://www.nytimes.com/2022/01/06/business/new-york-times-the-athletic.html

and of course, there was this from the same article.

Quote

When asked about potential layoffs at The Athletic, she said, “at this point, that’s not our plan.”

Edited June 13, 2023 by gehringer_2

[Jim Cowan]

1 hour ago, Tiger337 said:

I pay for Fangraphs (to limit the ads) and Baseball Reference (in order to get stathead).  That is the extent of my baseball subscriptions.  I used to subscribe to Baseball Prospectus and Baseball America.  Baseball Prospectus wasn't giving me much that I wasn't already getting at FG and BREF and their stats pages are an embarrassment.  I used to like BA because of the hard copy magazine, but it's not as extensive as it used to be and their Tigers writer is terrible.  

I liked the hard copy of BA 30 years ago because they had minor league stats leaders for every organization. 

[gehringer_2]

Brieske rehab relief appearance at Toledo: 1 IP, 0H 1K 1BB. 14 pitches/8 strikes.

[bobrob2004]

23 hours ago, Tiger337 said:

I pay for Fangraphs (to limit the ads) and Baseball Reference (in order to get stathead).  That is the extent of my baseball subscriptions.  I used to subscribe to Baseball Prospectus and Baseball America.  Baseball Prospectus wasn't giving me much that I wasn't already getting at FG and BREF and their stats pages are an embarrassment.  I used to like BA because of the hard copy magazine, but it's not as extensive as it used to be and their Tigers writer is terrible.  

I used to subscribe to Baseball Reference's Play Index.  Very useful tool when you want to get a list of players under very specific circumstances.  

[LongLiveMaroth]

13 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:

Brieske rehab relief appearance at Toledo: 1 IP, 0H 1K 1BB. 14 pitches/8 strikes.

 

[chasfh]

2 hours ago, bobrob2004 said:

I used to subscribe to Baseball Reference's Play Index.  Very useful tool when you want to get a list of players under very specific circumstances.  

I really hate how they are just going after the money now. They more than doubled the cost, reduced the functionality in key ways, and removed access to the other sports. Just this past year for the first time, instead of charging $80 flat, they charged $88.40, because sales tax I guess. But it’s still useful, so I’ll still subscribe, I guess. 

[oblong]

I don't subscribe to any of it because I figure all of you will do the work and I can just read about it and stand on the shoulders of geniuses.

[Tiger337]

1 hour ago, chasfh said:

I really hate how they are just going after the money now. They more than doubled the cost, reduced the functionality in key ways, and removed access to the other sports. Just this past year for the first time, instead of charging $80 flat, they charged $88.40, because sales tax I guess. But it’s still useful, so I’ll still subscribe, I guess. 

I haven't noticed loss in functionality for I what use it for, but I noticed the increased cost.  They all get that way eventually.  I don't like the increased cost, but I think I use it enough to justify it for myself.

[chasfh]

1 hour ago, Tiger337 said:

I haven't noticed loss in functionality for I what use it for, but I noticed the increased cost.  They all get that way eventually.  I don't like the increased cost, but I think I use it enough to justify it for myself.

One key change they made a few years ago was to remove the functionality where you could run a query, then run a second query based on the results of the first query. For example, one run on all the players who played on the Tigers from, say, 2014-2022, and then a second run against the resulting list to see how they are all doing this season.

I’ve been working on a research piece where I could use that capability, so I wrote to Sean and asked if I could get that kind of custom query. One of his staff replies, sure we can. Cost: $1,500. That’s fifteen hundred dollars. For a single, small custom query. You know, as though I am ESPN and I’m going to be trading off that information.

I’ll see him at the Palmer House next month and make nice, but I’m a little sore that he’s taken the business in that direction.

Edited June 14, 2023 by chasfh

[bobrob2004]

7 hours ago, chasfh said:

I really hate how they are just going after the money now. They more than doubled the cost, reduced the functionality in key ways, and removed access to the other sports. Just this past year for the first time, instead of charging $80 flat, they charged $88.40, because sales tax I guess. But it’s still useful, so I’ll still subscribe, I guess. 

Wow, that's a lot. I only subscribed when I had a discount code. I never paid more than $20 for a year. 

[gehringer_2]

Jake Rogers has 9 HR in 115 AB. 45% of his hits have left the yard.

[chasfh]

1 hour ago, bobrob2004 said:

Wow, that's a lot. I only subscribed when I had a discount code. I never paid more than $20 for a year. 

Which he's got a right to do, it's his business. And it's not even the money that bothers me—it's the reduction in functionality that galls me. The PC age has conditioned me to expect that functionality and options will increase, not decrease.

[casimir]

9 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:

Jake Rogers has 9 HR in 115 AB. 45% of his hits have left the yard.

The Tigers are 0-8 in games that Rogers hits a HR.  I hate that statistic.

[oblong]

23 minutes ago, casimir said:

The Tigers are 0-8 in games that Rogers hits a HR.  I hate that statistic.

He's like Tony Clark. Only hits HR when it doesn't count.

[Shinzaki]

I like the Athletic...great NHL coverage.

 

[casimir]

43 minutes ago, oblong said:

He's like Tony Clark. Only hits HR when it doesn't count.

Small sample size, obviously.  Rogers' SLG rises with his pulse.

[RandyMarsh]

If Rogers keeps up this play for another 15-20 years we may break even on the JV trade after all.