04/09/2023 1:10 pm EDT Boston Red Sox vs Detroit Tigers

[Motor City Sonics]

Welp, that sucked.   

[Dtrain72]

Nothing like ending the game like a fart in a elevator

[chasfh]

Well, that sucked. 

[Motor City Sonics]

The 2023 Detroit Tigers

We hate our fans!

[SeattleMike]

  On 4/9/2023 at 7:33 PM, Dtrain72 said:

Hopefully by the end of season there's at least 2-3 players Harris wants to keep on this roster.

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Why would you be rooting for this? 

[Tenacious D]

https://www.prospectslive.com/prospects-live/2022/1/15/2024-mlb-draft-top-100

[SeattleMike]

Oh now I get it. You are suggesting there may be no players he will want to keep.

[Dtrain72]

Like I've been saying since 2017: 2027 is our year!

[Dtrain72]

  On 4/9/2023 at 7:52 PM, SeattleMike said:

Oh now I get it. You are suggesting there may be no players he will want to keep.

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Yep

[SoCalTiger]

  On 4/9/2023 at 6:34 PM, Tenacious D said:

Not defending Miggy, although he is my AAT, but almost everyone else in the lineup is an automatic out these days.  You have to start 9 guys in the lineup.

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You are right and Miguel's double today confirms it. And the result confirms your overall thesis as well. How come I don't feel better ?

[kdog]

Maton with the golden sombero. Haase and Baez both with terrible starts.

[lordstanley]

  On 4/9/2023 at 7:54 PM, Dtrain72 said:

Like I've been saying since 2017: 2027 is our year!

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You're delusional, 2027 is way too optimistic 🙂

[Motor City Sonics]

This is what it's like to be a Tigers fan in the 2020s.    LOTS OF SWEARING IN THIS - YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED 

 

NO, NOT THE B's................NOT THE B's....................AAAAHHHH.............THEY'RE IN MY EYES........MY EYES.............AHHHHHHH

 

 

[SeattleMike]

  On 4/9/2023 at 8:35 PM, Motor City Sonics said:

This is what it's like to be a Tigers fan in the 2020s.    LOTS OF SWEARING IN THIS - YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED 

 

NO, NOT THE B's................NOT THE B's....................AAAAHHHH.............THEY'RE IN MY EYES........MY EYES.............AHHHHHHH

 

 

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It's been like this through most of the Illitch family ownership. Two thirds of the seasons have been below .500, usually well below the mark. The Tigers had the second most wins of any AL franchise prior to 1990. Not many great teams but usually competitive. 

[lordstanley]

  On 4/9/2023 at 9:03 PM, SeattleMike said:

It's been like this through most of the Illitch family ownership. Two thirds of the seasons have been below .500, usually well below the mark. The Tigers had the second most wins of any AL franchise prior to 1990. Not many great teams but usually competitive. 

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And a World Series championship roughly once a generation: 1935 + 10 years = 1945 + 23 years = 1968 + 16 years = 1984. A title in 2006 (22 years after 1984) or 2012 (28 years) would have satisfied me for awhile. 

[casimir]

  On 4/9/2023 at 6:18 PM, Crazy Cat Gentleman said:

Tork needs to figure out where the bag is. again.

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The irony is that last season we wouldn't be as critical because the bases were smaller and neither play would be as close as they were today.

On offense, it looked like he short strided the base.  This one is just inexcusable.

On defense, I get what he was doing to bait Refsnyder into a lull, but I wonder if he underestimated the distance of the throw from the base and that led to a missed out?  Helluva play by Baez which maybe the odds of completing the double play are pretty remote anyway.  Of all the throws to make pretty much on line, its this one?  

[casimir]

Maybe this has been mentioned before and I missed it.  But BSD is showing OPS rather than the traditional AVG for the starting lineups, and also including the league average OPS for reference.  I like it.

[Jim Cowan]

I was hoping to start the season at 8 and 12.  That would meaning winning 6 out of the next 11.

[KL2]

  On 4/9/2023 at 7:51 PM, SeattleMike said:

Why would you be rooting for this? 

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Well cause a few a young and a full 25 man rebuild takes decades and can't be fixed overnight.

[chasfh]

  On 4/9/2023 at 11:37 PM, casimir said:

The irony is that last season we wouldn't be as critical because the bases were smaller and neither play would be as close as they were today.

On offense, it looked like he short strided the base.  This one is just inexcusable.

On defense, I get what he was doing to bait Refsnyder into a lull, but I wonder if he underestimated the distance of the throw from the base and that led to a missed out?  Helluva play by Baez which maybe the odds of completing the double play are pretty remote anyway.  Of all the throws to make pretty much on line, its this one?  

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A major league first baseman should always position himself for the double play, every time.

[kdog]

i think Ilitch and Harris were ok with losing 100+ games if things went south with the returning players from 2022. We have already seen Meadows get ruled out due to an off-field mental health issue. Schoop has shown no signs of reverting to average form. Cabrera is getting his retirement tour unless he asks out.

And Tork/Greene/developing young players aren't ready to carry an offense.

[casimir]

  On 4/10/2023 at 3:08 AM, chasfh said:

A major league first baseman should always position himself for the double play, every time.

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He was at the bag and on the side of the bag where the throw was coming from.  Can't fault him for that.

I guess the other variable is the bounce of the ball on the throw.  I think its tough to determine from the camera angles if it was a true bounce or if it happened to skip/redirect on Torkelson.

All in all, the play should have been merely a harmless pop up out with the runner staying at 1B.  Refsnyder gave Baez and Torkelson a chance to make it a double play with a nearly perfect throw and they nearly pulled it off.

[gehringer_2]

  On 4/10/2023 at 2:18 PM, casimir said:

He was at the bag and on the side of the bag where the throw was coming from.  Can't fault him for that.

I guess the other variable is the bounce of the ball on the throw.  I think its tough to determine from the camera angles if it was a true bounce or if it happened to skip/redirect on Torkelson.

All in all, the play should have been merely a harmless pop up out with the runner staying at 1B.  Refsnyder gave Baez and Torkelson a chance to make it a double play with a nearly perfect throw and they nearly pulled it off.

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Yeah - the infields are so good now that people tend to forget they still may not be perfect. Even with the better fields and and with increased dragging during the game (at least twice per game now) that have allowed IFs to make more successful deliberate bounce throws,  there is still no guarantee any given hop or throw can't still catch a fresh divot from a cleat. Still always some risk when ball meets dirt.

[chasfh]

  On 4/10/2023 at 2:18 PM, casimir said:

He was at the bag and on the side of the bag where the throw was coming from.  Can't fault him for that.

I guess the other variable is the bounce of the ball on the throw.  I think its tough to determine from the camera angles if it was a true bounce or if it happened to skip/redirect on Torkelson.

All in all, the play should have been merely a harmless pop up out with the runner staying at 1B.  Refsnyder gave Baez and Torkelson a chance to make it a double play with a nearly perfect throw and they nearly pulled it off.

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Tork was not close enough to the bag to take the throw and just step on it. He had to take the throw while backpedaling toward the bag and then lunge for the bag with his foot. That should be considered unacceptable. He should have been standing on the bag already and come off it only to retrieve an errant throw, which this throw was not. Moving to first in anticipation of a catch and a throw to him should be automatic as soon as he determines it's a pop-up on the infield. He needs to work on that.

Edited April 10, 2023 by chasfh

[chasfh]

I don't understand what's so confusing about that because it's standard baseball stuff, but whatever, OK, I guess ..