Pistons Offseason - 2023

[Deleterious]

 

[Betrayer]

I liked Omoruyi's effort as well, but that's an odd thing to do before you even get into Free Agency. Not worried about the 1.9M, but there really aren't many roster spots.

Hopefully this signals a trade to move Bogey/Bagley/Killian at some point before the season starts.

[Deleterious]

The option date was probably the 29th.

[casimir]

18 hours ago, Deleterious said:

My two FA targets:

Harrison Barnes - 3/$60M year 3 is a team option.

Donte DiVincenzo - 3/$30M year 3 is a team option

No big splash and nothing fancy.  But both provide 3PT shooting and both are at least plus defenders IMO.

 

Those talents are acceptable.  I think that's a reasonable offseason.

Barnes has 10 seasons under his belt already?  Good grief....

[casimir]

17 hours ago, Betrayer said:

Yes.

Although I'd be fine with someone more Forward sized (McDaniels, Craig, Strus, Thybulle, Hart, Ingles, Yuta) than Divincenzo who is only 6'4" on a team full of Guards, but I wouldn't complain about it since it just means Killian, Hami, and McGruder have to be out the door.

 

And yes please. Also, can we toss Killian or Bagley in that trade?

I thought about the size with DiVincenzo also.  It might be an issue, but the 3 point shooting needs to be added. 

Cunningham & Ivey with Sasser/Hayes & DiVincenzo off of the bench.

Duren & Bogdanvoich & Thompson with Wiseman/Bagley & Stewart & Burks off of the bench?

Obviously not that linear, and some matchups dependent upon game flow and situational.  Heck, it might not even be a 10 man rotation, could be 8/9 with some spot duty. 

Hayes is going to be phased out while Sasser gets through his rookie season, but with Cunningham around and hopefully with a more healthy team and experienced Ivey, Hayes' inability to score isn't as glaring and his defense and passing can be beneficial to the cause.

Bogdanovich being moved now would really be helpful, I think.  Sure, they would miss his shooting.  But if he could be replaced with a somewhat offensive equivalent that plays better than zero defense, thanks for the memories and please bring back some future draft picks.  Gotta think his offense would be desirable given the market.

[casimir]

11 hours ago, Betrayer said:

I liked Omoruyi's effort as well, but that's an odd thing to do before you even get into Free Agency. Not worried about the 1.9M, but there really aren't many roster spots.

Hopefully this signals a trade to move Bogey/Bagley/Killian at some point before the season starts.

Well, Omoruyi or not, I think moving players is going to happen.  I think draft night was too quiet for Weaver.

I didn't mind the trade for Bagley.  Give him a try, see what happens.  I think we've seen it, and its time to move on.  That's fine.

Bogdanovich specifically, I wonder if its better to be patient and wait out other transactions.  I wonder if his market increases as things progress and options become fewer.  The lack of defense is tough, maybe as the offseason goes along, given the relative lack of offense in free agency, what can they expect to get for him?

Hayes, again, I think he can serve a bit of a purpose on his way out the door.  Maybe he takes the lack of an extension to heart, plays like it, and they can move him at the deadline.  Along the way, Sasser isn't forced into too much time at the beginning, he can be a 4th/5th G and earn his stripes to move up the chain of command.  That probably seems the most optimistic outcome.

[buddha]

everyone knew what bagley (and wiseman) were before we traded for them.  the fact that they didnt suddenly become better and different players overnight seems to be a surprise only to troy weaver.

[Deleterious]

The Bagely trade is probably ok. The Bagely extension is inexcusable.

[casimir]

1 hour ago, buddha said:

everyone knew what bagley (and wiseman) were before we traded for them.  the fact that they didnt suddenly become better and different players overnight seems to be a surprise only to troy weaver.

I don’t know.  Young players, and Wiseman hadn’t even gotten a lot of playing time.  Different environments can be beneficial to players and, in turn, teams.

It’s obviously an extreme example, I’m not at all suggesting it’s the rule.  But we all knew what Ben Wallace was when he got to Detroit, right?

[casimir]

50 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

The Bagely trade is probably ok. The Bagely extension is inexcusable.

Yeah, I was strictly talking about the trade.

[NYLion]

15 hours ago, Betrayer said:

Anything you're seeing right now isn't from the Piston's front office. It's all something one reporter speculated on and then 15 people re-reported calling it a "rumor" or a "inside info". This front office is notoriously quiet when it comes to releasing information. Plus, every agent is using the Pistons cap space to float stuff out there and make it look like their player is wanted.

I wouldn't count on the Pistons pursuing Cam unless Monty is pushing for it and they want to appease him. Weaver has made comments in the past about how much he prefers the trade market to the Free Agency market, and even more so with restricted free agents.

I wouldn't say that necessarily. The Ausar pick was telegraphed a few days before the draft, we knew for a while that Weaver was hot for Bagley and then Wiseman before he dealt for them. There's been a few trades/signings that were out of the blue but there's been stuff floated out there that came to fruition.

I think Cam Johnson is a natural connection. They now have the cap space to make a move like this, the Monty Williams connection and the obvious need for a 3 and D wing. Not saying that I want this to happen but I think there's a good chance that they will pursue him.

[casimir]

6 minutes ago, NYLion said:

I wouldn't say that necessarily. The Ausar pick was telegraphed a few days before the draft, we knew for a while that Weaver was hot for Bagley and then Wiseman before he dealt for them. There's been a few trades/signings that were out of the blue but there's been stuff floated out there that came to fruition.

I think Cam Johnson is a natural connection. They now have the cap space to make a move like this, the Monty Williams connection and the obvious need for a 3 and D wing. Not saying that I want this to happen but I think there's a good chance that they will pursue him.

Hopefully Brooklyn follows through on matching any offer.

[Deleterious]

 

[buddha]

2 hours ago, casimir said:

I don’t know.  Young players, and Wiseman hadn’t even gotten a lot of playing time.  Different environments can be beneficial to players and, in turn, teams.

It’s obviously an extreme example, I’m not at all suggesting it’s the rule.  But we all knew what Ben Wallace was when he got to Detroit, right?

wiseman had plenty of playing time in the lower leagues to see that he's a bad basketball player or needed EXTENSIVE improvement.

at least bagley can theoretically shoot from outside.

[Betrayer]

2 hours ago, NYLion said:

I wouldn't say that necessarily. The Ausar pick was telegraphed a few days before the draft, we knew for a while that Weaver was hot for Bagley and then Wiseman before he dealt for them. There's been a few trades/signings that were out of the blue but there's been stuff floated out there that came to fruition.

I think Cam Johnson is a natural connection. They now have the cap space to make a move like this, the Monty Williams connection and the obvious need for a 3 and D wing. Not saying that I want this to happen but I think there's a good chance that they will pursue him.

I listened to the podcast where Windhorst said that he felt Brooklyn would probably match anything up to 100M and that Detroit is a team that could have interest in him. Couple hours later everyone is reporting that "Brooklyn plans to match up to 100M for Cam Johnson." That's what I'm saying. It's all the rumor game where one reporter says something he feels could happen and then everyone reports that like it's a fact directly from the team's war room.

That's how you get clicks. And we all eat it up.

Just like all the supposed interest we had in Ayton last year - another RFA that we were having these exact discussions about. Can someone give me an example of an RFA that Weaver has gone after in the entire time he's been here. Has there been even one? Maybe this will be the first, but after hearing Troy's comment in the past about dealing with RFAs, I'll believe it when I see it.

[NYLion]

55 minutes ago, Betrayer said:

I listened to the podcast where Windhorst said that he felt Brooklyn would probably match anything up to 100M and that Detroit is a team that could have interest in him. Couple hours later everyone is reporting that "Brooklyn plans to match up to 100M for Cam Johnson." That's what I'm saying. It's all the rumor game where one reporter says something he feels could happen and then everyone reports that like it's a fact directly from the team's war room.

That's how you get clicks. And we all eat it up.

Just like all the supposed interest we had in Ayton last year - another RFA that we were having these exact discussions about. Can someone give me an example of an RFA that Weaver has gone after in the entire time he's been here. Has there been even one? Maybe this will be the first, but after hearing Troy's comment in the past about dealing with RFAs, I'll believe it when I see it.

You said that the Pistons front office is notoriously tight-lipped about their intentions so not to believe any of the rumors but that's not true based on the examples I gave. No RFAs but some of their moves have been telegraphed ahead of time. They very well might have had interest in Ayton before the draft (which is when those rumors floated out there) then they traded for Duren and the rumors died out.

Who knows if what's really going on behind the scenes but there's many reasons to believe that the Pistons will pursue Cam Johnson. As I mentioned before, they now have the cap space to make that move, the Monty Williams connection and their biggest need he'd fill.

[Deleterious]

 

[RandyMarsh]

Mo Bamba was just waived by the Lakers, Weaver's got to be salivating at the thought of picking up another former high draft pick big man. 

[RandyMarsh]

Pelicans declined Herb Jones, sounds like they will still try to work out an extension with him but if they can't is he somebody we should go after? I may be undervaluing what it would take to get him but I really like him as a player and would love to get him instead of breaking the bank for Cam Johnson. 

[Betrayer]

4 hours ago, NYLion said:

You said that the Pistons front office is notoriously tight-lipped about their intentions so not to believe any of the rumors but that's not true based on the examples I gave.

Listen to the beat writers and their podcasts as well as the other sources who report on the Pistons, they all say it. This might be the first time you've heard it, but I promise it's not a hot take by me. It's a well established point about this front office, from rookie workouts where the press doesn't get access, to off-season moves. Just because a conjecture or two comes out to be correct - throw enough darts at the board and one of them will hit the mark - doesn't change that fact.

[RandyMarsh]

7 minutes ago, Betrayer said:

Listen to the beat writers and their podcasts as well as the other sources who report on the Pistons, they all say it. This might be the first time you've heard it, but I promise it's not a hot take by me. It's a well established point about this front office, from rookie workouts where the press doesn't get access, to off-season moves. Just because a conjecture or two comes out to be correct - throw enough darts at the board and one of them will hit the mark - doesn't change that fact.

They do say that particularly JEIII but then after the move happens they usually contradict that whole point. Like when we drafted Duren some of those same people that said they were tight lipped said things like "No surprise they picked him as it was common knowledge that Weaver was infactuated with him and considered taking him at 5." 

 

[RandyMarsh]

I think the Bojan trade was one that comes to mind though where I don't recall anybody saying things like that and I'm sure there were others but it "seems" like after every move they make you get some sorta write up about how it was known that he coveted that player. 

[Deleterious]

2 hours ago, RandyMarsh said:

Pelicans declined Herb Jones, sounds like they will still try to work out an extension with him but if they can't is he somebody we should go after? I may be undervaluing what it would take to get him but I really like him as a player and would love to get him instead of breaking the bank for Cam Johnson. 

Nice player and a hell of a defender. But I doubt they decline him unless they already had a deal set up.

[casimir]

10 hours ago, buddha said:

wiseman had plenty of playing time in the lower leagues to see that he's a bad basketball player or needed EXTENSIVE improvement.

at least bagley can theoretically shoot from outside.

If he’s healthy.

[NYLion]

7 hours ago, Betrayer said:

Listen to the beat writers and their podcasts as well as the other sources who report on the Pistons, they all say it. This might be the first time you've heard it, but I promise it's not a hot take by me. It's a well established point about this front office, from rookie workouts where the press doesn't get access, to off-season moves. Just because a conjecture or two comes out to be correct - throw enough darts at the board and one of them will hit the mark - doesn't change that fact.

It's not just a conjecture or two. I named three instances (Ausar, Wiseman and Bagley) when their moves were telegraphed ahead of time. Hell, Weaver pretty much gave away his draft strategy saying "I'm not trying to bunt, I'm swinging for the fences", we all kind of figured that meant Ausar at that moment. I don't know if this will apply to their RFA chasing or not but you can connect the dots to see that chasing Cam Johnson isn't far fetched. 

Edited June 30, 2023 by NYLion