Summer 2023 Off-Season Thread

[gehringer_2]

3 hours ago, lordstanley said:

i guess better than the opposite. But even if one values plus/minus, I think we’d have to adjust that guys like Compher, Sprong and Holl played on really good teams while the Wings players did not. 

+/- is probably more useful for comparisons within a team, and even then it breaks down for Dmen like Seider who have to be on the ice against the opposition's best while lesser defensemen are 'protected' by not getting those minutes.

If you are going to compare across teams you can take the team's even strength goal differential, multiply it by the player's total TOI/4920 and substract that from his +/-. That result should be more comparable for players across differenct teams.

[Dan Gilmore]

[Kacie]

Sheesh, I said it was interesting, not some be all, end all defining stat.  Mostly for those of us, myself included, who felt like all the signings was just more of the same.  Or as Valenti said, up until the DeBrincat trade, the other signings didn't get the blood flowing to the nether regions.  It was also from July 4th, so the trade hadn't yet been made which is why Kubalik and DeBrincant were not included.  Carry on with the over analysis.

[Mr.TaterSalad]

Regarding William Nylander, I'm not saying the Wings should trade for him at this point, but does he end up resigning and staying in Toronto or do folks think there's a better than 50% chance he gets traded?

[buddha]

i think they sign him and matthews.

[Shinzaki]

The Leafs have to do something to get off the treadmill...don't know if that means moving on from Nylander, but they have to shuffle the deck a bit

 

[1984Echoes]

If we're going to accumulate some high-end goal scorers on the Wings...

I like Nylander better than DeBrincat (size/ toughness/ playoffs).

And I like Jason Robertson more than Nylander (size/ toughness/ playoffs).

How do we get JR...?

We're going to stick 'em up with our hockey sticks:

"Dallas, this is Detroit. This is a stick up! We want Jason Robertson. Hand him over!!! And we'll even send you a couple future 1sts so you don't feel so bad... Sorry...but C'ya later! C'mon JR... this way north to Hockeytown!"

[Shinzaki]

RHD Tony Deangelo is a FA after pulling a Zadina in Philly...he is ...by reputation...a bad person...put he has a nice offensive game and was originally drafted by Tampa Bay under Yzerman.

Sign...pass or hard pass?

[slothfacekilla]

32 minutes ago, Shinzaki said:

RHD Tony Deangelo is a FA after pulling a Zadina in Philly...he is ...by reputation...a bad person...put he has a nice offensive game and was originally drafted by Tampa Bay under Yzerman.

Sign...pass or hard pass?

The hardest of passes.  The guy sucks at defense and has legitimately worn out his welcome everywhere.  Yzerman already dumped him to the Coyotes after the Lightning drafted him in the first round and he couldn't stop being a ****head in the AHL.  The Wings seem to place a good emphasis on leadership and a team mentality I don't see any universe where this makes sense.

[buddha]

all offense and zero defense isnt something the wings have been searching for from their defensive core.  they also have gothesbiere who fills that role on the PP.  

hard pass.

[Shinzaki]

His +/- numbers have been really up and down throughout his career...some years pretty good others pretty bad...but yeah..other than his being RH...I don't see any reason to even consider it

[lordstanley]

On 7/12/2023 at 3:39 PM, Kacie said:

Sheesh, I said it was interesting, not some be all, end all defining stat.  Mostly for those of us, myself included, who felt like all the signings was just more of the same.  Or as Valenti said, up until the DeBrincat trade, the other signings didn't get the blood flowing to the nether regions.  It was also from July 4th, so the trade hadn't yet been made which is why Kubalik and DeBrincant were not included.  Carry on with the over analysis.

Sure, I think it was interesting and glad you posted it. I, and I think others, was simply giving reasons why it should be discounted a bit as probably not as positive as it would seem at first glance. I don’t want to discourage anyone from finding and posting tidbits like that though. 

Edited July 15, 2023 by lordstanley

[Cruzer1]

Finding out that Brady Tkachuk was the reason DeBrincat wanted out of Ottawa. Makes sense, Cat was stuck on the 2nd line and fewer minutes behind Brady. He wanted to go somewhere where he could be on the first line and get his numbers back up.

[buddha]

wheeler's top 50 prospects under 23 is out.  prospect cannot have played significant time in the nhl, so no seider, raymond, or berggren.

edvinsson at 11, kasper at 31, ASP at 43.  mazur, danielson and wallinder in the honorable mentions.

in my biased opinion he's sleeping on mazur and lombardi.

[buddha]

as usual with prospect rankings, there's an (over)emphasis on skilled wingers.  especially small skilled wingers.  

yzerman seems to take the team building approach of getting big defensemen and centers.  then let the wingers come in free agency because theyre easier to find there.

[Shinzaki]

He's sleeping on Danielson...RHC with size who can skate and create offense?  He should be higher...much higher

[slothfacekilla]

Danielson is probably too tall for Wheeler to rate him 😂

Not a huge fan of his lists to be honest.

[buddha]

1 hour ago, Shinzaki said:

He's sleeping on Danielson...RHC with size who can skate and create offense?  He should be higher...much higher

all around center who can play defense, drive play, and create for others?  sounds like jonathan toews.

[buddha]

1 hour ago, slothfacekilla said:

Danielson is probably too tall for Wheeler to rate him 😂

Not a huge fan of his lists to be honest.

me neither.

a lot of those prospect lists are like that.  smaller guys who dazzle against lesser competition and put up huge numbers, but when they get into the league they are checked out of existence, or at least back to reality.  

the smaller ice and the bigger players makes the nhl more of a big man's league.  that's why i dont understand people thinking raymond and debrincat are going to be on the same line, that seems like an awfully small line to go up against other teams' biggest defenders.  maybe at home when we have the last change (which i think someone else mentioned earlier), but not regularly.  i expect to see rasmussen and/or perron paired with them.  

[buddha]

then again, chicago ran kane/toews/debrincat out there with good success...

[gehringer_2]

27 minutes ago, buddha said:

then again, chicago ran kane/toews/debrincat out there with good success...

It probably depends on whose out their with them on D as well. If you have Edvinsson and Seider out there with a smaller front line it's going to matter less.  Scotty did mixing and matching along those lines shift by shift in a game, don't really have a feel for how much Lalonde cares to mix and match in game yet. IDK - is he maybe a less rigid about lines than Blashill was? Not something I was paying that much attentions to last season.

Edited July 18, 2023 by gehringer_2

[Dan Gilmore]

But Kane is a badass, just ask the cabbies in Buffalo. 🤐

[slothfacekilla]

Bultman did a mailbag and gave his top 10 prospects with a bonus 11th:

1. Edvinsson

2. Kasper

3. Danielson

4. Mazur

5. Sandin Pellikka

6. Wallinder

7. Cossa

8. Lombardi

9. Soderblom

10. Johansson

11. Augustine

 

Seems pretty good though I might flip Wallinder and ASP based on Wallinder seeming to being on the cusp of solid NA pro play.  I haven't seen enough of Danielson or Augustine to get much of a feel, but Danielson makes sense there before we see him in is D+1 season.  Lombardi is a wildcard but he seemed to look solid in short AHL time at the end of the season, I'm excited to see what he can do.

[buddha]

athletic's model has the wings improving the second most of any team this year.

they were the biggest improvers last year too.

[slothfacekilla]

1 hour ago, buddha said:

athletic's model has the wings improving the second most of any team this year.

they were the biggest improvers last year too.

I'm not a huge fan but JFresh's model apparently thinks the Wings snatch a wild card spot with 96 points