Sports_Freak Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 Just now, casimir said: I don’t think it would work quite the way some folks hope this would work. I just want him to hit a bit more. His glove is amazing. And with his contract, he needs way more production. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 1 minute ago, Sports_Freak said: I just want him to hit a bit more. His glove is amazing. And with his contract, he needs way more production. Nobody is arguing that he needs to hit more. But you suggested benching him as a means to get him to opt out. Ain’t happening. It’s an absolutely foolish theory. He’ll make more salary over the next 4 seasons with the Tigers than he would if he opts out. That’s simply all there is to it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Toddwert Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 9 minutes ago, casimir said: I don’t think it would work quite the way some folks hope this would work. No especially someone popular with other Latin players Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenacious D Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 I think the Cardinals are an interesting trade partner. They have a glut of underperforming young OF and we have the same with pitching. We could use another OF. They need controllable starters (not rentals like Lorenzen or ERod). The other interesting move would be to go after Arenado, if they make him available for prospects. Great bat and glove who could provide lineup protection for Greene and Tork and leadership for a very young team. He’s getting older and still is expensive, so that might make him more attainable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalTiger Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 We just have to hope that Baez plays better and hits at least league average perhaps finding his lost power because he isn’t going anywhere but Comerica Park for the next four years. I still think he will improve he just cannot be this bad and he hustles and plays hard all the time apart from a rare let down so I believe he will get better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongLiveMaroth Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 I read this this morning and if we did trade with Texas Justin Foscue does make sense. He won't break into the infield in Texas and he fits Harris's control the strikezone mantra with 46BB to 38K at AAA only problem is like a lot of our prospects the position is questionable. https://www.mlb.com/news/each-mlb-contender-s-biggest-need 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sports_Freak Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 12 hours ago, casimir said: Nobody is arguing that he needs to hit more. But you suggested benching him as a means to get him to opt out. Ain’t happening. It’s an absolutely foolish theory. He’ll make more salary over the next 4 seasons with the Tigers than he would if he opts out. That’s simply all there is to it. I get it. But if he ended up hitting .320 with 30 home runs and 110 RBI, he would be gone and all the Tiger fans would want to keep him. So he's either successful and leaves or he sucks and stays. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 8 minutes ago, Sports_Freak said: I get it. But if he ended up hitting .320 with 30 home runs and 110 RBI, he would be gone and all the Tiger fans would want to keep him. So he's either successful and leaves or he sucks and stays. A more realistic scenario would be he matched his lifetime numbers of .260/.302/.464 with strong defense. Would we want to keep him? Would he opt out? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RatkoVarda Posted July 19, 2023 Author Share Posted July 19, 2023 yes and maybe that version of Baez - .260/.302/.464 - is the one they should be trying to put in the batter's box, not the version that does not exist Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 (edited) The fans, as usual, misdirect their anger. Javy in the lightening rod becase of the contract, but that's sunk cost, forget about it. A SS with a great glove is the one place a team can afford to carry a non-productive bat. The Tigers real issue is the line-up is too short overall, particularly at 3B, OF, an C. Greene, Torkelson, Rogers (who doesn't play enough), Carpenter, Vierling, and I suppose Cabrera, just is not enough hitters - period. It would be nice if SS was another big bat, but there are other positions they need to put better bats into where there is a better probability of finding one, and a better glove at 3B would be nice as well. I even get the impression the team is fine with Baez being the focus of frustration because it diverts attentions from the other deficiencies. Edited July 19, 2023 by gehringer_2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenacious D Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 (edited) 22 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said: The fans, as usual, misdirect their anger. Javy in the lightening rod becase of the contract, but that's sunk cost, forget about it. A SS with a great glove is the one place a team can afford to carry a non-productive bat. The Tigers real issue is the line-up is too short overall, particularly at 3B, OF, an C. Greene, Torkelson, Rogers (who doesn't play enough), Carpenter, Vierling, and I suppose Cabrera, just is not enough hitters - period. It would be nice if SS was another big bat, but there are other positions they need to put better bats into where there is a better probability of finding one, and a better glove at 3B would be nice as well. I even get the impression the team is fine with Baez being the focus of frustration because it diverts attentions from the other deficiencies. This is right. Of course, Javy is being compared to his past success and we are disappointed that his performance isn’t up to those standards. The bigger problem is 1/3 of your lineup is hitting around .200. I firmly believe if we can acquire two established hitters this deadline and/or offseason to provide protection for Javy, Tork, Greene, etc. this lineup can turn around quickly. Austin Meadows could have been one of those, but we can’t count on that. Edited July 19, 2023 by Tenacious D Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 50 minutes ago, RatkoVarda said: yes and maybe that version of Baez - .260/.302/.464 - is the one they should be trying to put in the batter's box, not the version that does not exist I agree. The back end of the contract would still likely be bad, but they probably can't get anything better in the near future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sports_Freak Posted July 19, 2023 Share Posted July 19, 2023 3 hours ago, Tiger337 said: A more realistic scenario would be he matched his lifetime numbers of .260/.302/.464 with strong defense. Would we want to keep him? Would he opt out? If there were a better option at SS? I would replace him. And my point about benching him has more to do with performance than is does salary. It's not a good look for any sport when contracts over quality of play determines whether a player is benched. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sports_Freak Posted July 20, 2023 Share Posted July 20, 2023 (edited) I heard someone mention the Cardinals may desperately need controlled pitchers. If the Tigers bought out the Rodriguez opt-out, extended Lorenzen and then trade Skubal and Lange for Arenado, we would be a playoff team. Edited July 20, 2023 by Sports_Freak Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 I wonder what Washington would want for Candelario? Yes, I’m serious. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenacious D Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 3 minutes ago, casimir said: I wonder what Washington would want for Candelario? Yes, I’m serious. Let’s aim higher. We need an impact bat or two for this lineup. 3B is one position that we could potentially solve that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 2 minutes ago, Tenacious D said: Let’s aim higher. We need an impact bat or two for this lineup. 3B is one position that we could potentially solve that. Candelario’s season is better than the Tigers have at their disposal for 3B. They could look to upgrade at 2B, OF, and C as well. I doubt that Harris buys, and if he does, it’s going to be a tough needle to thread while simultaneously selling. They’re in an odd spot where they are theoretically in a division race and that’s it. There’s no chance to fall back on a wild card spot. And there’s also the fact that they themselves have been a losing record team all season long. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RatkoVarda Posted July 21, 2023 Author Share Posted July 21, 2023 https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2023/07/astros-rays-showing-interest-in-michael-lorenzen.html Michael Lorenzen is one of the top rental starting pitchers who could move between now and the August 1 trade deadline. The Rays and Astros are among the contending clubs that have shown interest in the Tigers’ righty, reports Jon Morosi of MLB.com (Twitter link). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shinzaki Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 I'm mostly angry with Javy because he does things like swinging at pitches that are so far out of the zone that he couldn't hit with a telephone pole when he's the potential tying run. It's galling to see a Major League baseball behave so...stupidly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenacious D Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 47 minutes ago, casimir said: Candelario’s season is better than the Tigers have at their disposal for 3B. They could look to upgrade at 2B, OF, and C as well. I doubt that Harris buys, and if he does, it’s going to be a tough needle to thread while simultaneously selling. They’re in an odd spot where they are theoretically in a division race and that’s it. There’s no chance to fall back on a wild card spot. And there’s also the fact that they themselves have been a losing record team all season long. We should be buying if anyone values any of our prospects not named Colt Keith. And selling if we can get some good prospects for ERod or Lorenzen. There doesn’t have to be only one pathway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalTiger Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 Baez has value and starting tomorrow represents the potential to bounce back. I still like his skill set and have more confidence with him at bat than anyone else but Greene Verling Tork and Carpenter. If he did opt out we slip backwards as a team. As others have said we just need to add two solid bats and others will improve. Baez always excelled as a side kick not a main character. That’s what we need. As for Erod I would offer to add one more year and 30 mil to his contract. Four years 70 mil. If he declines then trade him. Lorenzen I am trading 100 %. Not enough history of success as a Starting pitcher and coming off an All Star nod so his stock is at the peak. We need another Verling/ Maton type return to build depth but Harris must bring back hitters who can defend. Then add a solid player or two in free agency or trade and another couple pitchers. . And yes we can trade minor leaguers not named Keith to make it happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalTiger Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 24 minutes ago, Tenacious D said: We should be buying if anyone values any of our prospects not named Colt Keith. And selling if we can get some good prospects for ERod or Lorenzen. There doesn’t have to be only one pathway. You beat me to it and expressed it much better ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 (edited) 8 hours ago, Tenacious D said: We should be buying if anyone values any of our prospects not named Colt Keith. And selling if we can get some good prospects for ERod or Lorenzen. There doesn’t have to be only one pathway. Well, see, there's that qualifier. It ain't exactly a good farm system to deal from, is it? That aside, I agree with you, the Tigers (or any team) don't need to be completely on one side of the aisle or the other. I just think the focus will be on trading Rodriguez and Lorenzen for prospects. And maybe they can move Cisnero and Shreve, too. Edited July 21, 2023 by casimir Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 43 minutes ago, casimir said: Well, see, there's that qualifier. It ain't exactly a good farm system to deal from, is it? It's also not good enough to take players off the table (ie. Colt Keith). For someone like Arenado, I'd have to imagine he'd have to be on the table for the Cards to be interested. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted July 21, 2023 Share Posted July 21, 2023 1 minute ago, mtutiger said: It's also not good enough to take players off the table (ie. Colt Keith). Exactly. Everyone should be available for the right price. Its just the price for a players are going to be much more expensive than other players. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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