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2023 Trade Deadline


RatkoVarda

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1 minute ago, Sports_Freak said:

I just want him to hit a bit more. His glove is amazing. And with his contract, he needs way more production.

Nobody is arguing that he needs to hit more.

But you suggested benching him as a means to get him to opt out.  Ain’t happening. It’s an absolutely foolish theory.  He’ll make more salary over the next 4 seasons with the Tigers than he would if he opts out.  That’s simply all there is to it.

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I think the Cardinals are an interesting trade partner.  They have a glut of underperforming young OF and we have the same with pitching.  We could use another OF.  They need controllable starters (not rentals like Lorenzen or ERod).

The other interesting move would be to go after Arenado, if they make him available for prospects.  Great bat and glove who could provide lineup protection for Greene and Tork and leadership for a very young team. He’s getting older and still is expensive, so that might make him more attainable.

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We just have to hope that Baez plays better and hits at least league average perhaps finding his lost power because he isn’t going anywhere but Comerica Park for the next four years. I still think he will improve he just cannot be this bad and he hustles and plays hard all the time apart from a rare let down so I believe he will get better. 

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12 hours ago, casimir said:

Nobody is arguing that he needs to hit more.

But you suggested benching him as a means to get him to opt out.  Ain’t happening. It’s an absolutely foolish theory.  He’ll make more salary over the next 4 seasons with the Tigers than he would if he opts out.  That’s simply all there is to it.

I get it. But if he ended up hitting .320 with 30 home runs and 110 RBI, he would be gone and all the Tiger fans would want to keep him. So he's either successful and leaves or he sucks and stays.

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8 minutes ago, Sports_Freak said:

I get it. But if he ended up hitting .320 with 30 home runs and 110 RBI, he would be gone and all the Tiger fans would want to keep him. So he's either successful and leaves or he sucks and stays.

A more realistic scenario would be he matched his lifetime numbers of .260/.302/.464 with strong defense.  Would we want to keep him?  Would he opt out?    

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The fans, as usual, misdirect their anger. Javy in the lightening rod becase of the contract, but that's sunk cost, forget about it. A SS with a great glove is the one place a team can afford to carry a non-productive bat. The Tigers real issue is the line-up is too short overall, particularly at 3B, OF, an C. Greene, Torkelson, Rogers (who doesn't play enough), Carpenter, Vierling, and I suppose Cabrera, just is not enough hitters - period. It would be nice if SS was another big bat, but there are other positions they need to put better bats into where there is a better probability of finding one, and a better glove at 3B would be nice as well. I even get the impression the team is fine with Baez being the focus of frustration because it diverts attentions from the other deficiencies.

Edited by gehringer_2
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22 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

The fans, as usual, misdirect their anger. Javy in the lightening rod becase of the contract, but that's sunk cost, forget about it. A SS with a great glove is the one place a team can afford to carry a non-productive bat. The Tigers real issue is the line-up is too short overall, particularly at 3B, OF, an C. Greene, Torkelson, Rogers (who doesn't play enough), Carpenter, Vierling, and I suppose Cabrera, just is not enough hitters - period. It would be nice if SS was another big bat, but there are other positions they need to put better bats into where there is a better probability of finding one, and a better glove at 3B would be nice as well. I even get the impression the team is fine with Baez being the focus of frustration because it diverts attentions from the other deficiencies.

This is right.  Of course, Javy is being compared to his past success and we are disappointed that his performance isn’t up to those standards.  The bigger problem is 1/3 of your lineup is hitting around .200.

I firmly believe if we can acquire two established hitters this deadline and/or offseason to provide protection for Javy, Tork, Greene, etc. this lineup can turn around quickly. Austin Meadows could have been one of those, but we can’t count on that.

Edited by Tenacious D
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50 minutes ago, RatkoVarda said:

yes and maybe

that version of Baez - .260/.302/.464 - is the one they should be trying to put in the batter's box, not the version that does not exist

I agree.  The back end of the contract would still likely be bad, but they probably can't get anything better in the near future.  

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3 hours ago, Tiger337 said:

A more realistic scenario would be he matched his lifetime numbers of .260/.302/.464 with strong defense.  Would we want to keep him?  Would he opt out?    

If there were a better option at SS? I would replace him. And my point about benching him has more to do with performance than is does salary. It's not a good look for any sport when contracts over quality of play determines whether a player is benched.

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2 minutes ago, Tenacious D said:

Let’s aim higher.  We need an impact bat or two for this lineup.  3B is one position that we could potentially solve that.

Candelario’s season is better than the Tigers have at their disposal for 3B.  They could look to upgrade at 2B, OF, and C as well.

I doubt that Harris buys, and if he does, it’s going to be a tough needle to thread while simultaneously selling.  They’re in an odd spot where they are theoretically in a division race and that’s it.  There’s no chance to fall back on a wild card spot.  And there’s also the fact that they themselves have been a losing record team all season long.

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https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2023/07/astros-rays-showing-interest-in-michael-lorenzen.html

Michael Lorenzen is one of the top rental starting pitchers who could move between now and the August 1 trade deadline. The Rays and Astros are among the contending clubs that have shown interest in the Tigers’ righty, reports Jon Morosi of MLB.com (Twitter link).

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47 minutes ago, casimir said:

Candelario’s season is better than the Tigers have at their disposal for 3B.  They could look to upgrade at 2B, OF, and C as well.

I doubt that Harris buys, and if he does, it’s going to be a tough needle to thread while simultaneously selling.  They’re in an odd spot where they are theoretically in a division race and that’s it.  There’s no chance to fall back on a wild card spot.  And there’s also the fact that they themselves have been a losing record team all season long.

We should be buying if anyone values any of our prospects not named Colt Keith.  

And selling if we can get some good prospects for ERod or Lorenzen.

There doesn’t have to be only one pathway.

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Baez has value and starting tomorrow represents the potential to bounce back. I still like his skill set and have more confidence with him at bat than anyone else but Greene Verling Tork and Carpenter. If he did opt out we slip backwards as a team. As others have said we just need to add two solid bats and others will improve. Baez always excelled as a side kick not a main character. That’s what we need. 
 

As for Erod I would offer to add one more year and 30 mil to his contract. Four years 70 mil. If he declines then trade him. 
 

Lorenzen I am trading 100 %. Not enough history of success as a Starting pitcher and coming off an All Star nod so his stock is at the peak. 
 

We need another Verling/ Maton type return to build depth but Harris must bring back hitters who can defend. 
 

Then add a solid player or two in free agency or trade and another couple pitchers. . And yes we can trade minor leaguers not named Keith to make it happen. 

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24 minutes ago, Tenacious D said:

We should be buying if anyone values any of our prospects not named Colt Keith.  

And selling if we can get some good prospects for ERod or Lorenzen.

There doesn’t have to be only one pathway.

You beat me to it and expressed it much better !

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8 hours ago, Tenacious D said:

We should be buying if anyone values any of our prospects not named Colt Keith.  

And selling if we can get some good prospects for ERod or Lorenzen.

There doesn’t have to be only one pathway.

Well, see, there's that qualifier.  It ain't exactly a good farm system to deal from, is it?

That aside, I agree with you, the Tigers (or any team) don't need to be completely on one side of the aisle or the other.  I just think the focus will be on trading Rodriguez and Lorenzen for prospects.  And maybe they can move Cisnero and Shreve, too.

Edited by casimir
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43 minutes ago, casimir said:

Well, see, there's that qualifier.  It ain't exactly a good farm system to deal from, is it?

It's also not good enough to take players off the table (ie. Colt Keith).

For someone like Arenado, I'd have to imagine he'd have to be on the table for the Cards to be interested.

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1 minute ago, mtutiger said:

It's also not good enough to take players off the table (ie. Colt Keith).

Exactly.  Everyone should be available for the right price.  Its just the price for a players are going to be much more expensive than other players.

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