08/06/2023 1:40 pm EDT Tampa Bay Rays vs Detroit Tigers

[Toddwert]

They should rename the players only broadcast to the old man broadcast 

[kdog]

I guess this is the point of a meaningless season. They have to figure out if Manning will ever make the turn.

[Dtrain72]

Me just now turning the game on and...

 

[AZTigersfan]

Please pinch hit for Haase!

[AZTigersfan]

I think even our players could’ve hit that curveball. Hanging middle/middle. 

[AZTigersfan]

Bases loaded, no outs,  Haase up. Come on Haase now is the time to do something good!

yup strikeout. At least it wasn’t a triple play, I was fairly confident that was a distinct possibility. 

Edited August 6, 2023 by AZTigersfan

[Toddwert]

Uggh Ibenza

[AZTigersfan]

You gotta bench Ibanez after his third gaff. Bench him for a while.

[Klondike]

Hinch has to pull a Maton and send Ibanez down

Edited August 6, 2023 by Klondike

[Shinzaki]

Ship out Ibnez...call up Wenceel

[Adullin]

Tiger's keep smoking the ball right at people 

[AZTigersfan]

Manning cannot stop hitting the middle of the zone with his off speed pitches. Ask Wentz how that works out. 

[gehringer_2]

4 minutes ago, AZTigersfan said:

Manning cannot stop hitting the middle of the zone with his off speed pitches. Ask Wentz how that works out. 

Manning gave up 9 hits - 7 on breaking balls. 

[AZTigersfan]

4 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

Manning gave up 9 hits - 7 on breaking balls. 

Ya Haase and Rogers haven’t done him any favors with their pitch selection but Manning’s breaking ball has been broken for a while now? That’s concerning 

[AZTigersfan]

Big Carp Bomb!!! Too bad we were hosed on that balk.

[gehringer_2]

28 minutes ago, AZTigersfan said:

Ya Haase and Rogers haven’t done him any favors with their pitch selection but Manning’s breaking ball has been broken for a while now? That’s concerning 

It would help if he would keep his FB velo up. He was trending toward 90 mpH with the FB and throwing his slider up to 84. That's not enough velo difference. Manning should be able to keep guys off balance timing wise with his curve, but he doesn't have enough command of the curve, he's either hanging it or missing with it completely.

[Adullin]

Mental errors killed this one. Bad defense leads to runs, bad base running hurt, no breaks 

[RandyMarsh]

I've already given up on Manning as being anything more than a serviceable number 4. He'll string together a few good starts in a row here and there to give you hope but ultimately revert right back to the player he truly is which is a mid 4s type pitcher.

BTW that's not necessarily a bad thing, there's some value to being roughly league average and giving you 5-6 innings a start but any hope of him being an All Star caliber pitcher like we envisioned at one point is long gone in my eyes. 

[Tenacious D]

31 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:

I've already given up on Manning as being anything more than a serviceable number 4. He'll string together a few good starts in a row here and there to give you hope but ultimately revert right back to the player he truly is which is a mid 4s type pitcher.

BTW that's not necessarily a bad thing, there's some value to being roughly league average and giving you 5-6 innings a start but any hope of him being an All Star caliber pitcher like we envisioned at one point is long gone in my eyes. 

He’s our Milt Wilcox.  Was hoping for Dan Petry.

[SeattleMike]

32 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:

I've already given up on Manning as being anything more than a serviceable number 4. He'll string together a few good starts in a row here and there to give you hope but ultimately revert right back to the player he truly is which is a mid 4s type pitcher.

BTW that's not necessarily a bad thing, there's some value to being roughly league average and giving you 5-6 innings a start but any hope of him being an All Star caliber pitcher like we envisioned at one point is long gone in my eyes. 

Every rotation needs a Porcello. Let's hope Manning can be at least as good as Porcello was.

[gehringer_2]

looking at some more pitch data for Manning, this season he's increased his slider usage about 30% at the cost of the his change and curve. I'm going to guess he did that to chase a higher K rate against RHB, but as has been noted, his slider isn't that good, and it doesn't give him as much delta Velo as he had with more curve and change-use. And without the change/curve he's now he's giving up an 815 OPS against LHB (657 in '22).  Tell me again about the brilliance of Tigers' pitching coaching? They don't seem to be pushing the right buttons with Manning.

[Jim Cowan]

1 hour ago, gehringer_2 said:

looking at some more pitch data for Manning, this season he's increased his slider usage about 30% at the cost of the his change and curve. I'm going to guess he did that to chase a higher K rate against RHB, but as has been noted, his slider isn't that good, and it doesn't give him as much delta Velo as he had with more curve and change-use. And without the change/curve he's now he's giving up an 815 OPS against LHB (657 in '22).  Tell me again about the brilliance of Tigers' pitching coaching? They don't seem to be pushing the right buttons with Manning.

Yes I think that the brilliance of the Tigers' pitching coaching has never extended to the starters, it was based on over-achievements in the bullpen.  Lately that has been hit-or-miss.

[casimir]

Losing 2 of 3 to the Rays is one thing, but there was quite a bit of sloppiness this series.  That was discouraging.

[1776]

2 hours ago, casimir said:

Losing 2 of 3 to the Rays is one thing, but there was quite a bit of sloppiness this series.  That was discouraging.

I almost commented on this last night but decided against it. I understand this team isn’t overly talented. However, the problem you note isn’t out of the norm with this team. Agree, very discouraging at this level. 
 

[gehringer_2]

10 hours ago, Jim Cowan said:

Yes I think that the brilliance of the Tigers' pitching coaching has never extended to the starters, it was based on over-achievements in the bullpen.  Lately that has been hit-or-miss.

This regime really loves the slider. I understand why, but that doesn't mean I have to like it. I still believe it's the hardest pitch on an arm.

Edited August 7, 2023 by gehringer_2