09/15/2023 9:38pm EDT Detroit Tigers vs Los Angeles Angels

[Jim Cowan]

7 innings and 91 pitches for Skubal, back in the old days that had "complete game" written all over it.  I feel like not everything from the old days is wrong by definition. 

[SoCalTiger]

Great game. That catch by Meadows in the first was unreal. That kid is a great center fielder. Baez came up big and he owed it to me supporting him for two poor years. Skubal was nasty but who were those guys. What a mess the Angels are. Trout will likely ask to be traded. 2 hits for Miggy and a nice crowd send off. 

[casimir]

  On 9/16/2023 at 3:53 AM, holygoat said:

Position player pitching!

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When is the last time the Tigers hit against a position player?

[casimir]

  On 9/16/2023 at 3:34 AM, AZTigersfan said:

Rely might be the sticking point here. The gentleman I was responding to said “with regularity,” which I swapped with rely. Regardless, I’m just not a fan of bunting outside of occasionally moving a runner. Just my opinion. 

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"With regularity" is probably a poor choice of words there, that's fair.  But hitters do need to take advantage of the situations given to them.  Its probably best to just add that skill to their tool belt and use it when available.  If the 3B is back, drop a bunt down the line and beat it out.  Once teams see that as a threat, the 3B isn't always back as much, and it opens up a bit more room for a ball to get through.

Its the same thing that most folks have complained about the shift for years.  The exaggerated shifts are because the data suggests hitters are "gripping and ripping".  Show some more ability to go the opposite way, and defenses have to play more straight up.  A batter using the whole field has more room to use than a hitter that is pull happy and uses only about half of the field.

As far as the exact occasion for bunting is concerned, I'm all about using it to get on base when the situation is available.  I understand using it to move a runner when only one run is needed.

[AZTigersfan]

  On 9/16/2023 at 12:17 PM, casimir said:

"With regularity" is probably a poor choice of words there, that's fair.  But hitters do need to take advantage of the situations given to them.  Its probably best to just add that skill to their tool belt and use it when available.  If the 3B is back, drop a bunt down the line and beat it out.  Once teams see that as a threat, the 3B isn't always back as much, and it opens up a bit more room for a ball to get through.

Its the same thing that most folks have complained about the shift for years.  The exaggerated shifts are because the data suggests hitters are "gripping and ripping".  Show some more ability to go the opposite way, and defenses have to play more straight up.  A batter using the whole field has more room to use than a hitter that is pull happy and uses only about half of the field.

As far as the exact occasion for bunting is concerned, I'm all about using it to get on base when the situation is available.  I understand using it to move a runner when only one run is needed.

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I understand and agree with you in a strategic point of view. It’s smart to take what the defense gives you. There there’s no sense denying that regardless of the level, inning, situation, etc… with that said, this doesn’t mean I have to like it. That’s where I’m at. I disagree with the guy’s choice and simply would’ve preferred him to attempt to beat Skubal in a more conventional way by swinging the bat. That’s just my preference and opinion. If I insinuated in any way that my preference is the right way or the only way, then I do apologize as that was not my intent.

[RandyMarsh]

Skubal has almost literallly been the best pitcher in baseball this year since he has come back. No starter with atleast the same amount of innings or more as him has a lower xERA.

If and its a big if but if he stays healthy it looks like we got atleast 1 Ace out of our big 3 pitching prospects from a few years ago. 

[chasfh]

  On 9/16/2023 at 2:56 AM, lordstanley said:

Second inning in a row the radio feed comes back midway through a leadoff hit in progress.  

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You can thank for new pitch timer for that, which is also being enforced between innings whereas it hadn’t been before.

[chasfh]

  On 9/16/2023 at 12:45 PM, AZTigersfan said:

I understand and agree with you in a strategic point of view. It’s smart to take what the defense gives you. There there’s no sense denying that regardless of the level, inning, situation, etc… with that said, this doesn’t mean I have to like it. That’s where I’m at. I disagree with the guy’s choice and simply would’ve preferred him to attempt to beat Skubal in a more conventional way by swinging the bat. That’s just my preference and opinion. If I insinuated in any way that my preference is the right way or the only way, then I do apologize as that was not my intent.

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Remember that one NL game, I forget exactly which one—I think the Diamondbacks may have been involved?—where I think it was no score really late in the game, and some hitter broke up a perfect game with a bunt, and the entire baseball world went ape****? I’m fuzzy now on the details, but I wasn’t fuzzy then about my opinion that it was the right thing to do because a run would have won the game, so why wouldn’t somewhere try a bunt hit to get the lead run or winning run on base? That’s just good baseball.

Now, if it’s a blowout late in the game, like 8-0 in the ninth, and a guy bunts just to throw a monkey wrench in a no-hit bid, then yeah, I totally agree that’s a chicken**** move.

FWIW, I also don’t think I can say someone has a no-hitter going if it’s only the fourth inning. I think it’s gotta go at least six before I take it seriously. YMMV.

[gehringer_2]

  On 9/16/2023 at 1:31 PM, chasfh said:

You can thank for new pitch timer for that, which is also being enforced between innings whereas it hadn’t been before.

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I haven't put a stopwatch on it, but earlier in the season when I was listening to more of the broadcasts opposite the video feed I became pretty well convinced they were cheating time on the radio cast - that is, running the breaks longer and then clipping time during game play to catch up each inning, so they were always coming back late but starting the inning with buffered audio. If that's the case, then if the buffer resets/is lost, coming back in the middle of the 1st AB is exactly what you get.

[Motor City Sonics]

  On 9/16/2023 at 3:20 AM, Tiger337 said:

Right, a batter's job is to help his team score runs.  If bunting helps his team score runs, then he has done his job.  Helping his opponent achieve goals should not be on his mind at all.  

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But, should Josh Donaldson have turned to Jim Joyce and said "call me out, dude" ?     

[Sports_Freak]

  On 9/16/2023 at 12:47 PM, RandyMarsh said:

Skubal has almost literallly been the best pitcher in baseball this year since he has come back. No starter with atleast the same amount of innings or more as him has a lower xERA.

If and its a big if but if he stays healthy it looks like we got atleast 1 Ace out of our big 3 pitching prospects from a few years ago. 

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Another great Avila pick. <ducks>....9th rounder. Baseball is by far the hardest sport to draft.

[Sports_Freak]

  On 9/16/2023 at 12:17 PM, casimir said:

"With regularity" is probably a poor choice of words there, that's fair.  But hitters do need to take advantage of the situations given to them.  Its probably best to just add that skill to their tool belt and use it when available.  If the 3B is back, drop a bunt down the line and beat it out.  Once teams see that as a threat, the 3B isn't always back as much, and it opens up a bit more room for a ball to get through.

Its the same thing that most folks have complained about the shift for years.  The exaggerated shifts are because the data suggests hitters are "gripping and ripping".  Show some more ability to go the opposite way, and defenses have to play more straight up.  A batter using the whole field has more room to use than a hitter that is pull happy and uses only about half of the field.

As far as the exact occasion for bunting is concerned, I'm all about using it to get on base when the situation is available.  I understand using it to move a runner when only one run is needed.

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Most good hitters in the minors never even learn to bunt anymore. There isn't enough time down there to teach them because most of the time, the better hitters are brought up without ever having to bunt. 

[Toddwert]

  On 9/16/2023 at 12:47 PM, RandyMarsh said:

Skubal has almost literallly been the best pitcher in baseball this year since he has come back. No starter with atleast the same amount of innings or more as him has a lower xERA.

If and its a big if but if he stays healthy it looks like we got atleast 1 Ace out of our big 3 pitching prospects from a few years ago. 

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always thought he was the best of the big three he just has to stay healthy of course

[Tiger337]

Skubal has definitely been their most impressive pitcher the last few years.  Mize and Manning have never shown the same dominance over an extended period of time.  

[RandyMarsh]

Skubal has the one thing that them two don't or didn't and that's the explosive fastball that can get swings and misses in and out of the zone. 

[TigersForever1256]

  On 9/16/2023 at 3:30 AM, AZTigersfan said:

Ah too bad skubs. Heck of a performance tonight. 

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LOL @ Skubs 😅

[TigersForever1256]

  On 9/16/2023 at 12:04 PM, casimir said:

When is the last time the Tigers hit against a position player?

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I wondered that myself when Escobar toed the rubber. I can't recall it ever happening, but I'm sure it must have. I'm old.

[chasfh]

  On 9/16/2023 at 6:11 PM, Sports_Freak said:

Another great Avila pick. <ducks>....9th rounder. Baseball is by far the hardest sport to draft.

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I don’t think anyone has argued that Avila could never ever make a good pick. After all, his background is scout. The problem is he couldn’t lead the development of them, because that’s not what scouts do. 

[chasfh]

  On 9/16/2023 at 6:36 PM, Tiger337 said:

Skubal has definitely been their most impressive pitcher the last few years.  Mize and Manning have never shown the same dominance over an extended period of time.  

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Manning has shown flashes of Skubality, he just hasn’t been able to string together a bunch of them in a row. He’d been better of late, but it’s still fair to say that you never know which guy you’re gonna get when he starts.

I’m mildly surprised to be reminded that Mize started 30 games and tossed 150 innings last year, because I think of him as being a healthcare disaster. I think his impending return will be one of the top stories going into 2024.

[Tiger337]

  On 9/17/2023 at 2:28 AM, chasfh said:

Manning has shown flashes of Skubality, he just hasn’t been able to string together a bunch of them in a row. He’d been better of late, but it’s still fair to say that you never know which guy you’re gonna get when he starts.

I’m mildly surprised to be reminded that Mize started 30 games and tossed 150 innings last year, because I think of him as being a healthcare disaster. I think his impending return will be one of the top stories going into 2024.

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He had only 118K in those 150 IP though.  That is something to watch next year along with his health.  

Olson and Long have been impressive in a small sample.  The Tigers have been getting a lot more more out of their young pitchers under Fetter.  Now work on the hitters.  

[gehringer_2]

  On 9/17/2023 at 3:29 AM, Tiger337 said:

He had only 118K in those 150 IP though.  That is something to watch next year along with his health.  

Olson and Long have been impressive in a small sample.  The Tigers have been getting a lot more more out of their young pitchers under Fetter.  Now work on the hitters.  

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I'm going to guess that GSL needs to find a little more consistent life on this FB to cut down on the those MiLB HR numbers. Maybe between Fetter and the Tigers Kinesiology crew they can get him there.

[gehringer_2]

  On 9/17/2023 at 2:28 AM, chasfh said:

Mize started 30 games and tossed 150 innings last year, 

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that was last year's last year.  2 starts for this year's last year.  

[gehringer_2]

  On 9/17/2023 at 3:29 AM, Tiger337 said:

He had only 118K in those 150 IP though.  That is something to watch next year along with his health.  

Olson and Long have been impressive in a small sample.  The Tigers have been getting a lot more more out of their young pitchers under Fetter.  Now work on the hitters.  

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There was a report that his focus is working to improve his FB. I think that's that's the right strategy though it probably won't drive K's directly.