NYLion Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 (edited) 2 hours ago, Motown Bombers said: I knew this was coming. Everyone expected the team was going to be bad, and when they are bad, they question the coach even though they are meeting expectations. Sorry but 0-8 is unacceptable no matter what. I was on board with the competitive losses but getting blown out of the water in two straight home games especially when there was some "give up" in the players is completely unacceptable. I expected struggles, I expected a few blowouts, but I did not expect to see a team that is worse in Game 8 than they were in Game 1. I'm not even going to touch on the coaching errors in the close losses. As I said before, all I wanted to see was some progression and if anything, the team is regressing and it appears that the coaches' message is growing a little stale. I get that there's a lack of talent, and injuries, but you still need to see compete every week (when you're trying to build a foundation) and I haven't seen it as of late. Of course you don't fire Campbell anytime soon but I don't see why it's so taboo for him to be questioned. Edited November 1, 2021 by NYLion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabretooth Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 Just now, 1984Echoes said: If it's 1.8M instead of 1.6M are the Lions going to go bankrupt? Does it kill them that bad? CJ made the amount irrelevant when he refused to make appearances for them. As MB said, they can't just give him the money at this point. The ball was (and might still be) in CJ's court. He refused their very reasonable offer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 Just now, NYLion said: Sorry but 0-8 is unacceptable no matter what.... So go tell Sheila this is unacceptable and you want everyone fired. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 2 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: If it's 1.8M instead of 1.6M are the Lions going to go bankrupt? Does it kill them that bad? If it's $113 million instead of $114.6 million is Calvin Johnson going to go bankrupt? Does it kill him that bad? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYLion Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 Just now, 1984Echoes said: So go tell Sheila this is unacceptable and you want everyone fired. O...K? What's your point? You're ok with what we've seen the last two home games? Obviously you didn't read my post when I said "I don't think Campbell should be fired" so.... anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 1 minute ago, sabretooth said: CJ made the amount irrelevant when he refused to make appearances for them. As MB said, they can't just give him the money at this point. The ball was (and might still be) in CJ's court. He refused their very reasonable offer. I'm saying the team, if they really want to heal this wound, can negotiate with CJ and if they pay him $1.8M for appearances or $1.6M for appearances... I could care less. I would prefer/ I think it would be better for the team & CJ, to get this resolved. I'm not really invested in this... It's just up to the two sides to decide, or not, if they want to resolve/ negotiate/ finalize this... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYLion Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 1 hour ago, Motown Bombers said: Rams just aren't a fan of draft picks. They are a fan of winning though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 1 minute ago, NYLion said: ... You're ok with what we've seen the last two home games? The last two games are meaningless. Before the season I didn't care about wins and losses.. and I don't right now. As for the really, really crappy game they played against the Eagles... I have no opinion until this team gets better players. Which is not probable until at least 2022, possibly even 2023. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 6 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said: If it's $113 million instead of $114.6 million is Calvin Johnson going to go bankrupt? Does it kill him that bad? Then negotiate. That's all I'm saying... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted November 1, 2021 Author Share Posted November 1, 2021 there's a lot of revisionist history going on in here. people said they'd be bad, but not 0-8 blown out by the eagles bad. i thought theyd win 5 or 6 and there were people telling me i was crazy pessimistic. i think 6 was probably the consensus on wins. very few people thought 0-17 was a possibility. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 Just now, 1984Echoes said: Then negotiate. That's all I'm saying... Calvin Johnson has no interest in negotiating. He just wants his money. He can go away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 Just now, buddha said: there's a lot of revisionist history going on in here. people said they'd be bad, but not 0-8 blown out by the eagles bad. i thought theyd win 5 or 6 and there were people telling me i was crazy pessimistic. i think 6 was probably the consensus on wins. very few people thought 0-17 was a possibility. I thought they would win 5 games. Then they lost 2 of their 3 top OL for the season, their best pass rusher, their top defensive backs, and 2 of their 3 best WR from an already bad receiver group. I've revised my expectations down to 2-3 wins and still think that's achievable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYLion Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: The last two games are meaningless. Before the season I didn't care about wins and losses.. and I don't right now. As for the really, really crappy game they played against the Eagles... I have no opinion until this team gets better players. Which is not probable until at least 2022, possibly even 2023. No, it's not meaningless. You don't want games like these to pile up to close the season. This season is about building a foundation, building a culture. All your building is a losing culture if you're not only losing, but not competing. It's not necessarily about wins/losses although 0-17 should never EVER be acceptable or meeting an expectation, it's about showing incremental improvements as the season wears on and laying a foundation going into next season and beyond. If these non competitive losses continue, this season was a compete loss. The coaches/players etc. need to make sure this season means SOMETHING. It's a lot of young players on this roster, they need to learn how to compete regularly and I'm seeing regression in their game. Swift, for example, looked like he wasn't even trying this week. Not good signs. Edited November 1, 2021 by NYLion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 I said before the season that there were too many unknowns to even hazard a guess. Could be 3? 6? or 9? wins, or somewhere in between? Lose 5 or 6 of their best players and they may end up with 0 or 1 or 2 wins? I didn't expect this... but I'm not surprised. A lot of the "unknowns" before this season are becoming known. I don't feel I've revisioned anything. (I mean... personally). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 7 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said: Calvin Johnson has no interest in negotiating. He just wants his money. He can go away. If that's his stance then, yes, he can just go away. If the Lions offer to negotiate and he says "screw you" then... yeah, same message back to ya' CJ... But did the team make that offer? I mean, I don't know about that... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 2 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: If that's his stance then, yes, he can just go away. If the Lions offer to negotiate and he says "screw you" then... yeah, same message back to ya' CJ... But did the team make that offer? I mean, I don't know about that... It's been reported the Lions offered him $500,000 a year for 3 years to make a few appearances. I don't even think they were in person appearances just on promotional videos. I believe they offered $100,000 for an additional in person appearance. He refused. He said he just wants the Lions to find a way to pay him. He can go get bent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 6 minutes ago, NYLion said: ... It's a lot of young players on this roster, they need to learn how to compete regularly and I'm seeing regression in their game. Swift, for example, looked like he wasn't even trying this week. Not good signs. I agree that's not a good sign... player/ culture-wise... But I'm still holding back on judgement because I think a large part of that is the influence of sub-par players on culture. Not because they are bad culture but, because they are bad players. And if Swift becomes part of the problem instead of the solution then, I think that will suck for us because he is one of the young players we would like to see succeed but... I also think that we'll just have to see how the Org fixes the player/ talent issue before we can really get a read on the culture issue... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 1 minute ago, Motown Bombers said: ... He can go get bent. So it sounds like you have just permanently closed that door. If the Org has... oh well, I will concede. If the Org hasn't, and still thinks it can reach CJ... well, I'll just leave that door open, personally, just in case... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 Just now, 1984Echoes said: So it sounds like you have just permanently closed that door. If the Org has... oh well, I will concede. If the Org hasn't, and still thinks it can reach CJ... well, I'll just leave that door open, personally, just in case... I mean, their hands are tied. There isn't much to negotiate unless Calvin Johnson is willing to make a couple promotional appearance. I have closed the door. Not going to beg this entitled diva to be a part of the organization. I'll survive if Calvin Johnson doesn't announce the Lions draft pick. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 I'll survive too. My preference is that they work something out but... Yeah... It takes two to tango. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabretooth Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 (edited) 37 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: I'm saying the team, if they really want to heal this wound, can negotiate with CJ and if they pay him $1.8M for appearances or $1.6M for appearances... I could care less. I would prefer/ I think it would be better for the team & CJ, to get this resolved. I'm not really invested in this... It's just up to the two sides to decide, or not, if they want to resolve/ negotiate/ finalize this... Sorry, I didn't see the resolution to this discussion above.....'nuff said Edited November 1, 2021 by sabretooth Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sabretooth Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 13 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said: It's been reported the Lions offered him $500,000 a year for 3 years to make a few appearances. I don't even think they were in person appearances just on promotional videos. I believe they offered $100,000 for an additional in person appearance. He refused. He said he just wants the Lions to find a way to pay him. He can go get bent. Agreed Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NYLion Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 19 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: I agree that's not a good sign... player/ culture-wise... But I'm still holding back on judgement because I think a large part of that is the influence of sub-par players on culture. Not because they are bad culture but, because they are bad players. And if Swift becomes part of the problem instead of the solution then, I think that will suck for us because he is one of the young players we would like to see succeed but... I also think that we'll just have to see how the Org fixes the player/ talent issue before we can really get a read on the culture issue... It's a fair take but I don't think they can afford to let this season go into the abyss and I think it's important, not necessary but important to win a few games just for their psyche going into the offseason because a lot of the team is made up of young players that will be here beyond this season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichiganCardinal Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 6 hours ago, Hongbit said: I don’t recall any games where they went 60 minutes punch for punch with anyone. They have played well at times but haven’t come close to putting together a full game. My personal expectations of this team were very low and have only gotten worse. The talent was never there and this was always going to a rebuild. As for Campbell, this didn’t mean a free pass, it meant that I wasn’t going to judge him on W-L record. He is essentially a first time head coach and there were big questions how he was going to handle preparation and game day. I am growing concerned that he makes poor decisions and continues to double down on them even when they don't work. He has literally been doing the same things and hoping for a different result. There is absolutely no rhyme or reason for why he goes for it or not on 4th down. This seems to be based on his gut feel. He also continues to try and go quick, up tempo whenever they get into a 3rd or 4th and short with the hope that it will confuse the other team and instead it is the Lions that get confused and don’t convert. This has happened multiple times this season and there is still no adjustment. There have also been some horrible clock management at the end of half and games. The drive before halftime was another example of huge gaffes with playcall and TO management in a 17-0 game. I like his attitude and I haven’t given up but there still needs to be some coaching acumen no matter how much the players and fans love his rah rah. We saw how this combination worked before with Rod Marinelli and nobody wants a repeat of that. That's fair - I'm distinguishing between the Ravens/Vikings games where they never gave in, and the Bengals/Eagles games where they were disinterested from the opening kickoff. I agree that Campbell hasn't been perfect, but I think his mistakes are not on par with those made by his predecessors in Detroit, and I think they are more aligned with being correctable in time than his predecessors as well. Or at the very least, he is deserving of more time than they were when they left. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted November 1, 2021 Share Posted November 1, 2021 3 minutes ago, NYLion said: It's a fair take but I don't think they can afford to let this season go into the abyss and I think it's important, not necessary but important to win a few games just for their psyche going into the offseason because a lot of the team is made up of young players that will be here beyond this season. I'm just waiting for them to win a couple games and then the inevitable hand wringing about winning meaningless games cost them x draft pick. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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