23-24 Prospects Thread

[buddha]

i had high hopes for gibson.  he's progressed well so far.

[slothfacekilla]

Just now, buddha said:

i had high hopes for gibson.  he's progressed well so far.

Agreed, I'm still kind of shocked.  Mostly because after ASP there isn't much on the right side in the pipeline (Tuomisto I guess...) so it makes me wonder if they have some sort of deal in principal with a free agent RHD or want to use the pick in a bigger trade.....or both?!  Apparently they really liked this Finnish kid last draft too, seems like he could be something.

[buddha]

15 minutes ago, slothfacekilla said:

Agreed, I'm still kind of shocked.  Mostly because after ASP there isn't much on the right side in the pipeline (Tuomisto I guess...) so it makes me wonder if they have some sort of deal in principal with a free agent RHD or want to use the pick in a bigger trade.....or both?!  Apparently they really liked this Finnish kid last draft too, seems like he could be something.

well....they just traded that pick and jake walman...

[Dan Gilmore]

Future considerations…🤔

[Hongbit]

Stevie definitely has something good cooking

[Jason_R]

What is happening!?!

[Jason_R]

49 minutes ago, Jason_R said:

What is happening!?!

This is the best write up I’ve found that isn’t expecting some secret Yzerplan magic or lighting Yzerman on fire. 

[Shinzaki]

Upon reflection...Walman has been injury prone the past two years....plying 63 games in each. His defensive play slipped last season.  I think if this clears room to make a bigger more meaningful acquisition...I'll be ecstatic.

[buddha]

i dont see the big deal with walman.  he was a great find because they got him for nothing.  he - almost more than anyone - was exposed in the ottawa fiasco last year.  they targeted him with physical play and he could not handle it.  he's a finesse player and he's injured.  a lot.

he was on a contract commensurate with his standing in the league: ok player who is injury prone and kind of soft for a dman.

that said, attaching a premium asset to get rid of the deal doesnt make a ton of sense to me and leads me to believe the rest of the league doesnt see him the way some in the analytics community see him.

waiting for the other shoe to drop on the deal.

[gehringer_2]

31 minutes ago, buddha said:

waiting for the other shoe to drop on the deal.

yeah - seems like there has to be an incoming Dman and at least one high priced signing in the works, the question is will it be the same guy - i.e. expensive Dman, or more fill-in Dmen plus maybe a $$ center.

[1984Echoes]

Stevie keeps saying he wants Gost back.

Maybe he means it?

[buddha]

7 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:

yeah - seems like there has to be an incoming Dman and at least one high priced signing in the works, the question is will it be the same guy - i.e. expensive Dman, or more fill-in Dmen plus maybe a $$ center.

i assume this means they think a lot of simon edvinsson, because he's likely going to play up top with seider.

sign an rhd and kane?

[gehringer_2]

1 hour ago, buddha said:

i assume this means they think a lot of simon edvinsson, because he's likely going to play up top with seider.

I hope Simon can play 30 min in the NHL because if you put those two together the other pairing are going to be bad - unless they sign or trade for an upgrade. ...Well Ghost and Chiarot might be passable. but you figure he as to be working every level he can to find another RH shot defense man, but that's a tough lift and we'll never hear a word about any deals that don't work out.

Edited June 26, 2024 by gehringer_2

[AlaskanTigersFan]

16 hours ago, Dan Gilmore said:

Future considerations…🤔

Is this actually something in hockey? Or is it basically a filler for like $5,000 down the line? Like could we get a 2nd in three years lets say? (Sorry, I don't know a lot about hockey.)

[1984Echoes]

I think it's dependent on how much Walman plays.

Just guessing.

But something like a 4th next year that could turn into a 3rd and also a later round pick maybe in 2026, like a 7th that could turn into a 6th? They do this a lot in the NHL. But again... just a WAG.

[buddha]

i think red wings fans appreciate but overrate jake walman.  dude waa scratched a bit last year after a lot of injuries.

good get when they got him for nothing, decent player, probably a bit overpaid but not too much.  good offense and bad defense.  not physical.  not strong.  fast.  good shot.

we'll see what he does this year.  there was a bit of a hue and cry when they let filip zadina go for nothing and we see how that turned out.

[gehringer_2]

18 minutes ago, buddha said:

i think red wings fans appreciate but overrate jake walman.  dude waa scratched a bit last year after a lot of injuries.

good get when they got him for nothing, decent player, probably a bit overpaid but not too much.  good offense and bad defense.  not physical.  not strong.  fast.  good shot.

we'll see what he does this year.  there was a bit of a hue and cry when they let filip zadina go for nothing and we see how that turned out.

Yeah - speed was supposed to be his big asset, and he would flash it once in a while, but to my eye you didn't see it enough to say it was being much of a difference maker. Maybe in a system like the Panthers that constantly attacks the puck aggressively with speed his skating could come into play more, but the Wings mostly sag back and play a more passive D so maybe he wasn't the fit for the system he could have been in a different scheme.

Still, I hate to see the Wings get slower even if it's only potential speed as the team is already too slow.

Edited June 26, 2024 by gehringer_2

[slothfacekilla]

I'm more than okay with losing Walman, he didn't play well last season and seems to have fallen out of favor with the organization being demoted to a third pairing then healthy scratched a bit.  I'm just more shocked it took a second round pick to get rid of him since his contract is pretty fair for what he should bring to the table.  I don't know if he got complacent after getting a multi year contract or what (he always did seem to rate video games above hockey in interviews that I've seen) but the Wings were definitely done with him for some sort of reason, and it seems like the rest of the league realized it too.

One of the interesting theories I've seen on future considerations is either the Sharks claiming someone on waivers and sending them to Detroit or the Sharks claiming Holl on waivers to bypass his 10 team no-trade list (which most certainly has the Sharks on it).  There is also buzz about Sharks agreeing to not draft someone the Wings want at 14 right ahead of the Wings.  In the end I think they're fun theories but "future considerations" is just going to be a $1 or nothing at all.

[Jason_R]

2 hours ago, slothfacekilla said:

IOne of the interesting theories I've seen on future considerations is either the Sharks claiming someone on waivers and sending them to Detroit or the Sharks claiming Holl on waivers to bypass his 10 team no-trade list (which most certainly has the Sharks on it).  There is also buzz about Sharks agreeing to not draft someone the Wings want at 14 right ahead of the Wings.  In the end I think they're fun theories but "future considerations" is just going to be a $1 or nothing at all.

I’ve seen this too but I’d be shocked if future considerations is anything other than a low level prospect. The obvious answer is the best one — he fell out of favor with the Wings and they needed to provide an incentive to move his contract. 

[1984Echoes]

3 hours ago, slothfacekilla said:

... but "future considerations" is just going to be a $1 or nothing at all.

I'm calling bull****.

$1 or nothing at all?

Bull.

[slothfacekilla]

28 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said:

I'm calling bull****.

$1 or nothing at all?

Bull.

lol okay, people can get their hopes up but I'm struggling to come up with an example of future considerations turning into anything substantial.  You have anything to back up your call or just your random gut feeling?  I used the $1 example because that's what the Wings paid to acquire Kris Draper...

[gehringer_2]

25 minutes ago, slothfacekilla said:

lol okay, people can get their hopes up but I'm struggling to come up with an example of future considerations turning into anything substantial.  You have anything to back up your call or just your random gut feeling?  I used the $1 example because that's what the Wings paid to acquire Kris Draper...

My guess 84 probably was onto it in an earlier post. It's probably future consideration because both sides maybe admitted there are legitimate questions about where Walman is, so to close the deal they could have agreed to base the return on some performance metric for next season - maybe +/- or just games played. The other possibility is that by leaving the return empty for now there is no cap hit on the return so it leaves SY the max room if he thinks he's going to hit it close. So in that case the option could be something like a pick if the Wings end up pinned to the cap, a utility player if not.

Edited June 26, 2024 by gehringer_2

[1984Echoes]

25 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

My guess 84 probably was onto it in an earlier post. It's probably future consideration because both sides maybe admitted there are legitimate questions about where Walman is, so to close the deal they could have agreed to base the return on some performance metric for next season - maybe +/- or just games played... 1984: (and he has two years so I think a 2025 draft pick based on 2024-25 performance and a later round 2026 pick based on 2025-26 performance...)

Yes.

I don't know (obviously) if I have the rounds correct... and they are NOT high round picks that I WAG'd...

But I think I'm "in the ballpark", so to speak.

 

 

 

Edited June 26, 2024 by 1984Echoes

[Longgone]

1 hour ago, 1984Echoes said:

I'm calling bull****.

$1 or nothing at all?

Bull.

Well that’s what “future considerations“ generally is, nothing at all.

[1984Echoes]

8 minutes ago, Longgone said:

Well that’s what “future considerations“ generally is, nothing at all.

On that basis...

That means that the 2nd rounder we traded to get rid of Walman is ALSO "nothing at all."

Right?