The Gaza War

[pfife]

Oblong it seems like you're arguing that Israel's response is because of an act of war perpetrated on them.  I agree with that.   Likewise, why couldn't the behavior of the people in that unverified Harvard video be because of that as well, like I've been arguing?

[oblong]

24 minutes ago, pfife said:

I don't think that part was left out, it's mutually agreed upon by all posters involved in this discussion.

No it’s not because the main argument used against many on the left about their antisemitism is the fact they refuse to acknowledge the role of Hamas in this. They just pretend that Israel decided to attack Gaza on Oct 8 and ignore the why.  Their statements minimize, at best, and  often ignore, the why.  They do nothing to hold Hamas to account and present this as an act of aggression.  That’s a deliberate omission on their part. 

[pfife]

That canary mission account that's been mentioned here has more video of the Harvard event, and they claim the edtaritor of Harvard Law Review is part of the mob.   It seems like the extended video is the 15 seconds we've already seen then it abruptly cuts to what I think is a phone being held by the victim in the minutes preceding the mob.   He seems to be trying to cut through the courtyard area and they keep holding up the textiles and saying "exit", redirecting him around.   He repeatedly tells people not to touch him and not to grab him and you can hear others in the background yelling at people not to touch him.

[pfife]

Just now, oblong said:

No it’s not because the main argument used against many on the left about their antisemitism is the fact they refuse to acknowledge the role of Hamas in this. They just pretend that Israel decided to attack Gaza on Oct 8 and ignore the why.  Their statements minimize, at best, and  often ignore, the why.  They do nothing to hold Hamas to account and present this as an act of aggression.  That’s a deliberate omission on their part. 

Oh you accused me of leaving that out but now you're talking about not me so I'll let you take that up with the not me's.

[ewsieg]

5 hours ago, chasfh said:

Please help me understand which part of the article stipulates that the blowback Fetterman faced from leftists was motivated by antisemitism, because I can't locate that idea within it.

None of it says that, nor was that the point I was trying to make.  It's a nuanced world and I thought there were some interesting tidbits that went along with some of the things you were raising.  An overall view and reaction towards someone that has been considered a champion of progressives, which correct, isn't saying it's anti-semite, but shows a considerable difference from the Biden core of democrats on the issue.  

I suspect you'll disagree, but it looks similar to Macomb county and how it changed recently.  Pre-trump, your side felt it was full of good, honest, hard working union men and women.  They surprisingly stopped voting blue for a billionaire because for reasons you can determine and the left, or at least folks like 1984 believes they are racist now.  And yes, i'm sure there were some hidden racists that felt empowered to puff their chest a little bit, just like you're seeing with some anti-semite's that feel they have a little more power to express that now too.

[RatkoVarda]

2 hours ago, Edman85 said:

This was in the NYT Morning newsletter the other day. FWIW.

thank you for this. the civilian deaths in Gaza are war crimes, and Hamas is the only group that should be charged with those war crimes.

[oblong]

9 hours ago, pfife said:

Oh you accused me of leaving that out but now you're talking about not me so I'll let you take that up with the not me's.

It's not an accusation, just pointing out your fake scenario doesn't represent the reality. 

You go ahead and take comfort in your fake scenario that doesn't represent reality as if that is an actual argument instead of just bull****. 

 

[pfife]

1 minute ago, oblong said:

It's not an accusation, just pointing out your fake scenario doesn't represent the reality. 

You go ahead and take comfort in your fake scenario that doesn't represent reality as if that is an actual argument instead of just bull****. 

 

You literally said I left that out.  It was an accusation.  You gp ahead and take comfort in misrepresenting both mine and your own posts as if I cant read.

Edited November 2, 2023 by pfife

[oblong]

7 hours ago, RatkoVarda said:

thank you for this. the civilian deaths in Gaza are war crimes, and Hamas is the only group that should be charged with those war crimes.

That's the most frustrating part.   The Arab/Muslim world, including people here in Dearborn, refuse to acknowledge the role of Hamas in this and that the are the ones who do not care about arab/muslim lives.  

 

[pfife]

10 hours ago, oblong said:

You are leaving out the biggest reality.  Ignoring Hamas and pretending they are not doing anything to inflame the situation and have no responsibility for provoking israel into their response. 

Here's where you literally accused me.  

[oblong]

11 minutes ago, pfife said:

You literally said I left that out.  It was an accusation.  You gp ahead and take comfort in misrepresenting both mine and your own posts as if I can read.

Well you did leave it out.  Using the word accusation infers I was saying you did it intentionally.  I wasn't doing that.  Just stating the fact that you didn't say that and therefore it presents an incomplete picture.

 

 

 

[oblong]

24 minutes ago, pfife said:

Here's where you literally accused me.  

you love to be the victim....  poor you

 

[oblong]

I mean if someone says player A is a better power hitter than player B because player A hit 20 homers and player B hit 18, and I come back and say "Well actually player A has a higher slugging % because they hit more triples and doubles, you left that out", am I "accusing" them of something?  No... just filling in the gaps for an incomplete point.

But some like drama.

 

[pfife]

11 hours ago, oblong said:

You are leaving out the biggest reality.  Ignoring Hamas and pretending they are not doing anything to inflame the situation and have no responsibility for provoking israel into their response.

Now that we have clearly established by quoting and bolding your post that  you were in fact, accusing me of this - let's dig a little deeper.  You say this is the "bigggest" reality - I would argue it's absolutely not bigger reality than the hypothetical person (who actually has thousands of real life examples) family being in danger.  It may be equal reality but not bigger, both are equally real.

[pfife]

3 minutes ago, oblong said:

I mean if someone says player A is a better power hitter than player B because player A hit 20 homers and player B hit 18, and I come back and say "Well actually player A has a higher slugging % because they hit more triples and doubles, you left that out", am I "accusing" them of something?  No... just filling in the gaps for an incomplete point.

But some like drama.

 

OK rad drama-generating hypothetical but here in this actual real thread of posts you posted, you did accuse me of leaving out what you called the biggest reality.   It's been quoted and bolded.   I'm sorry that you posted something you didn't intend to post, so you can just say sorry and move on but some like drama

Edited November 2, 2023 by pfife

[pfife]

10 minutes ago, oblong said:

you love to be the victim....  poor you

 

And you apparently love to be the liar. 

[pfife]

32 minutes ago, oblong said:

Well you did leave it out.  Using the word accusation infers I was saying you did it intentionally.  I wasn't doing that.  Just stating the fact that you didn't say that and therefore it presents an incomplete picture.

 

 

 

Ah yes more convenient inferences on what I posted.   Just what I was hoping for!  We don't have enough of those!   

At least you have the stones to admit you took liberty with my words unlike the other posters here

I responded to what you actually said.  You now admit you responded to what you inferred I said.   I trust that you see the difference but I don't think you'll admit the obvious difference because some people like drama.  

Edited November 2, 2023 by pfife

[Biff Mayhem]

14 minutes ago, pfife said:

Ah yes more convenient inferences on what I posted.   Just what I was hoping for!  We don't have enough of those!   

At least you have the stones to admit you took liberty with my words unlike the other posters here

I responded to what you actually said.  You now admit you responded to what you inferred I said.   I trust that you see the difference but I don't think you'll admit the obvious difference because some people like drama.  

Bro. Seriously. Give it up already.

[pfife]

1 minute ago, Biff Mayhem said:

Bro. Seriously. Give it up already.

Bro.  I appreciate the advice, but I'm ok with it.  If you think I'm breaking the rules I apologize, that is not my intent.

[smr-nj]

I started reading this from the bottom up just now (since last read sometime in the previous evening), and I realize that I need at least two cups of cawfee to tackle it.😂☕️☕️

[smr-nj]

Nah, I’m going to PT in about 20 minutes… that’s enough of a workout for a Thursday morning.

 

[Biff Mayhem]

2 minutes ago, pfife said:

Bro.  I appreciate the advice, but I'm ok with it.  If you think I'm breaking the rules I apologize, that is not my intent.

No, you're not breaking any rules. You're just singlehandedly derailing a really good thread with these spun out emotional responses.

[oblong]

you should quote some more posts... people find it engaging.

[pfife]

Just now, Biff Mayhem said:

No, you're not breaking any rules. You're just singlehandedly derailing a really good thread with these spun out emotional responses.

OK, thanks for clarifying on the rules.   I don't share your assessment otherwise.  

[pfife]

Just now, oblong said:

you should quote some more posts... people find it engaging.

done