NYLion Posted November 15, 2023 Share Posted November 15, 2023 3 hours ago, Deleterious said: 8 first round picks. He has drafted in the 1st round a starting 5 and 3 bench players. They still can't win 30 games. That is not collecting talent. You need a star or stars to win a title in this league. You don't need one to win 30 games. 8 FRPs should be plenty to do that. He's collecting players with a lot of natural talent. Hayes was an upside pick, Bey was known as a steal at the time, Stewart is what he is, Cade was the BPA, Ivey was arguably the best pure talent in the draft with Duren not far behind, Ausar again with big upside, he traded I don't know how many times for former high 1st round picks that had a lot of upside hoping that something clicks. That's all he's done is collect 1sts and back on talent. He doesn't seem to care about fit, need, supplying these players with the legit vets. He's just throwing a bunch of talent against the wall hoping that it sticks. Again though, you can't win in this league without a star or capable vets (legit vets like FVV in Houston as one example) and the Pistons don't have that so essentially I agree with you but what I'm saying is that Weaver has no idea how to build a team at least thus far. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hart Posted November 15, 2023 Share Posted November 15, 2023 I do think some of Cade's problems would be solved if we just didn't lean so heavily on him as the point guard. He won't get the 8-10 assist per game but the turnovers would go down and I personally think the shooting would improve. Cade expends a tremendous amount of energy trying to carry the offense as a point guard, more so than other guys because he is not that athletic for an NBA player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted November 16, 2023 Share Posted November 16, 2023 7 hours ago, Betrayer said: It's getting rough out there. No matter where you look the fanbase has turned on this team and all the off-season hopes have gone down the drain. The reality is there isn't one answer here. No matter how you look at it though, some changes must be made. Both things are true: Cade has to play better AND Cade is getting absolutely blitzed every time he comes off a screen with no spacing around him. Get Burks, Sasser, or Ivey in the starting lineup for Killian or even Knox for Stew - or both - to create more spacing. Also, he shouldn't be leading the league in minutes and top 5 in usage in his first month back for what is effectively his sophomore season after missing an entire season due to injury. He looks as tired and frustrated as we are. Monty's legendary stubbornness can't continue. The fact that Ivey is averaging 19 minutes a game while Killian is averaging 30 is criminal. Weaver loves to collect big-men, but he's collected the wrong ones for this bench. We said it before the season started, and Duren's injury has made it even worse - we needed a veteran defensive big man on this team. Someone cheap (like McGee or even Biyombo) that you could have used instead of rolling out Wiseman (or Stew) at the backup 5. Monty's .5 offense is making a difference in both the negative and positive columns. The turnovers are up by 2.5 from last year, however the assists are also up by 5 from last year (from 23 to 28 per game). We're at game 12 in a new system that involves way more ball movement and we're rolling out a rotation where every player that's logged significant minutes is between and 19 and 24 years old. I have to imagine the turnovers trend down as the vets come back and the youngsters get more games under their belt in this system. On a positive note, the ceiling for Ausar is high. Dude continues to be a bright spot for the Pistons on most nights. He's top 5 in the NBA in rebounds (the other guys are all centers), is already making a case for an All NBA Defensive Team appearance, and simply stuffs the stat sheet. We're just 12 games into his rookie season and I continue to be impressed. I agree you about Cunningham and coming off of his lost sophomore season. It is also probably unfair to ask him to be the leader by default of being the best talent on the team when he’s still at the beginning of his career. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted November 16, 2023 Share Posted November 16, 2023 1 hour ago, Hart said: I do think some of Cade's problems would be solved if we just didn't lean so heavily on him as the point guard. He won't get the 8-10 assist per game but the turnovers would go down and I personally think the shooting would improve. Cade expends a tremendous amount of energy trying to carry the offense as a point guard, more so than other guys because he is not that athletic for an NBA player. There’s the physical aspect of it, but there’s also the mental part of it, the leadership part of it. Was he handling a lot of point duties at Oklahoma State? Is this completely new for him? The other thing is it’s a new head coach, too. A more experienced team is probably going to transition better, at least I would think it would. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted November 16, 2023 Share Posted November 16, 2023 platinum equity/tom gores have owned the pistons for 13 years. they've had one winning season in that time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deleterious Posted November 16, 2023 Share Posted November 16, 2023 6 hours ago, NYLion said: He's collecting players with a lot of natural talent. Hayes was an upside pick, Bey was known as a steal at the time, Stewart is what he is, Cade was the BPA, Ivey was arguably the best pure talent in the draft with Duren not far behind, Ausar again with big upside, he traded I don't know how many times for former high 1st round picks that had a lot of upside hoping that something clicks. That's all he's done is collect 1sts and back on talent. He doesn't seem to care about fit, need, supplying these players with the legit vets. He's just throwing a bunch of talent against the wall hoping that it sticks. Again though, you can't win in this league without a star or capable vets (legit vets like FVV in Houston as one example) and the Pistons don't have that so essentially I agree with you but what I'm saying is that Weaver has no idea how to build a team at least thus far. Nope. Pistons fans think we have a bunch of talented guys. Results say otherwise. If you have 6 or 7 talented guys you could easily win 30 games regardless of how poor the fit is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deleterious Posted November 16, 2023 Share Posted November 16, 2023 1 hour ago, buddha said: platinum equity/tom gores have owned the pistons for 13 years. they've had one winning season in that time. Zero playoff wins? That is depressing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted November 16, 2023 Share Posted November 16, 2023 9 hours ago, buddha said: platinum equity/tom gores have owned the pistons for 13 years. they've had one winning season in that time. This surprises me for some reason. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted November 17, 2023 Share Posted November 17, 2023 22 hours ago, Deleterious said: Nope. Pistons fans think we have a bunch of talented guys. Results say otherwise. If you have 6 or 7 talented guys you could easily win 30 games regardless of how poor the fit is. It's beating a dead horse to say it, but whatever talent is in the group he has assembled doesn't include enough shooting for any of the rest of the talent that is there to create a functional basketball team. You can break down each player for all their strengths and weaknesses but bottom line - as a team they can't shoot the basketball. One player on the court now and then that can is not enough. Nothing really changes until that does. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deleterious Posted November 17, 2023 Share Posted November 17, 2023 I was a bit shocked when I looked up the Pistons shooting%. 46.7% from the field good for 16th in the league. 36.2% from three good for 14th in the league. League average is 35.7% 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hart Posted November 17, 2023 Share Posted November 17, 2023 We might not have playoff caliber talent but I don't think we 2-10 caliber talent either. Something is wrong with this organization from the top down. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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