12/8/23 7:00PM EST Detroit Pistons @ Orlando Magic

[buddha]

2 hours ago, casimir said:

No.  I’m still hoping this is short term pain for long term gain.  Maybe I’m being naive, that very well could be the case.

its been four years.  how much pain do you want?

[Hart]

I can't accept the Pistons are doomed as long as Gores owns the team because that is likely the rest of my life.  Maybe we can get lucky with the next GM.  

[gehringer_2]

8 minutes ago, Hart said:

I can't accept the Pistons are doomed as long as Gores owns the team because that is likely the rest of my life.  Maybe we can get lucky with the next GM.  

We can hope, but be prepared for the worst. WCF owned the Lions for 5 decades of futility. Though at least in the Lion's case under WCF while they were mostly bad they only occasionally terrible.

Edited December 10, 2023 by gehringer_2

[casimir]

2 hours ago, buddha said:

its been four years.  how much pain do you want?

I have 13 years of Catholic school and the John Cooper era on my resume.  Pain?  Bring it.

[casimir]

2 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:

going to be very hard to turn around a franchise with poor leadership because bad decisions will continue to undercut any progress the players do make. The only way franchises with bad management this bad break through is when they get so much luck they can't screw it up, like drafting a Jokic. Pistons had their shot and Cade is no Jokic. 

Mike Ilitch was a bad owner until he wasn’t.  That’s not to say Tom Gores will follow the same path.  But perhaps he’s learned some lessons along the way.  He used to pal around with Andre Drummond.  That isn’t the case with anyone on the roster now.

[gehringer_2]

3 hours ago, casimir said:

Mike Ilitch was a bad owner until he wasn’t.  That’s not to say Tom Gores will follow the same path.  But perhaps he’s learned some lessons along the way.  He used to pal around with Andre Drummond.  That isn’t the case with anyone on the roster now.

Maybe. But Mike Ilitch at least was a guy who was a stand-up enough to run a reasonably honest business where he had to learn to pay some level of attention to his customers and there was never a question he loved his city. Gores is an absentee who has apparently worked at building his wealth by screwing anyone he can get a clear shot at and the more powerless they are to complain about it, the better. Hope for comparable concern about his team's fans may need to be tempered. In Gores' case, the only thing that can save the Pistons is his vanity. But maybe that will be enough, eventually

Edited December 10, 2023 by gehringer_2

[RandyMarsh]

The losing is bad enough but it's the way they are losing that is the real kicker. I remember the years we tanked in 20 and 21 we would lose but were atleast competitive most nights.

You had your blowout here and there but most nights we were in the games till atleast the middle of the 4th before ultimately fading.

This year they are just total blowouts where we are done by halftime or mid 3rd at the latest. During this 19 game losing streak you could count on 1 hand how many games they had a legit shot at winning by the mid point in the 4th and you'd still prob have a couple of fingers to spare.

 

[Deleterious]

4th year of the rebuild is worse than the 1st.  That is all you need to know.

[casimir]

10 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:

Maybe. But Mike Ilitch at least was a guy who was a stand-up enough to run a reasonably honest business where he had to learn to pay some level of attention to his customers and there was never a question he loved his city. Gores is an absentee who has apparently worked at building his wealth by screwing anyone he can get a clear shot at and the more powerless they are to complain about it, the better. Hope for comparable concern about his team's fans may need to be tempered. In Gores' case, the only thing that can save the Pistons is his vanity. But maybe that will be enough, eventually

Sure, there's that as well for perception's sake.

[casimir]

10 hours ago, RandyMarsh said:

The losing is bad enough but it's the way they are losing that is the real kicker. I remember the years we tanked in 20 and 21 we would lose but were atleast competitive most nights.

You had your blowout here and there but most nights we were in the games till atleast the middle of the 4th before ultimately fading.

This year they are just total blowouts where we are done by halftime or mid 3rd at the latest. During this 19 game losing streak you could count on 1 hand how many games they had a legit shot at winning by the mid point in the 4th and you'd still prob have a couple of fingers to spare.

 

The body language on the court in the middle of the 3rd in Orlando appeared to me to be ready to board the plane.  They're clearly playing against the opponent and themselves now.

[Deleterious]

3 hours ago, casimir said:

The body language on the court in the middle of the 3rd in Orlando appeared to me to be ready to board the plane.  They're clearly playing against the opponent and themselves now.

Casey had a ton of problems while the coach here.  But I will say this for him.  His teams never looked like that.  Even towards the end of the year when full tank mode was enabled, they played hard and gave effort.  

[Hart]

49 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

Casey had a ton of problems while the coach here.  But I will say this for him.  His teams never looked like that.  Even towards the end of the year when full tank mode was enabled, they played hard and gave effort.  

Probably what happens when the coach plays games with players minutes and roles.  

[casimir]

2 hours ago, Deleterious said:

Casey had a ton of problems while the coach here.  But I will say this for him.  His teams never looked like that.  Even towards the end of the year when full tank mode was enabled, they played hard and gave effort.  

Yes, agree.

I hope I’m reading into it too much, maybe it just isolated to that game.  I don’t see every moment of every game.  But it was slumped shoulders, not much of closing out on and contesting of perimeter shots, minimal boxing out.  Sure, the game was over early, we’ve seen enough 20some point deficits in the 3rd this season to know that.  But be professionals, work on your games, especially when playing time is being questioned.