Detroit Lions 2024 Offseason Thread

[1984Echoes]

I'm pretty certain the team has said Martin is athletic or has "sneaky athleticism" or along similar lines... so I have no idea what they mean by that... especially looking at that RAS... Or maybe it was something about "very impressive strength"...?

[1984Echoes]

This might have been some of what I was thinking/ hearing...:

https://www.prideofdetroit.com/2023/6/3/23747714/2023-detroit-lions-draft-recap-podcast-brodric-martin-profile-scouting-report-explosiveness-wku

[MichiganCardinal]

14 hours ago, 1984Echoes said:

I'm pretty certain the team has said Martin is athletic or has "sneaky athleticism" or along similar lines... so I have no idea what they mean by that... especially looking at that RAS... Or maybe it was something about "very impressive strength"...?

I'm not really sure what "sneaky athleticism" is. I think he was drafted to be a large specimen of a human being in the middle of the defensive line on obvious run downs. As others have said, that role is more about brute strength and plugging holes than it is being twitchy, agile, or being a natural athlete. Even when that role does its job oftentimes it's the edge rushers or second level linebackers who are getting credited with the tackle or TFL, which comes as a result of there being no running lane. It's not something that RAS is really designed to compensate for.

I think it's possible though they were asked about his athleticism and it's not like they can say "I've taken dumps with more athleticism than him," so instead they call him "sneaky athletic"

[gehringer_2]

1 hour ago, MichiganCardinal said:

I'm not really sure what "sneaky athleticism" is

good adjective for a dancer maybe. 

[Hongbit]

Sneaky Athleticism is used to describe either a big man who shows speed or agility or any white person that can run less than 4.6  

[Motown Bombers]

On a related tangent, I find the whole grit thing with the Lions mildly cringe. When I think of grit, I think of an undersized white SS for the Minnesota Twins. The grit thing seems to be working but I wish they came with something else. 

[gehringer_2]

8 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

On a related tangent, I find the whole grit thing with the Lions mildly cringe. When I think of grit, I think of an undersized white SS for the Minnesota Twins. The grit thing seems to be working but I wish they came with something else. 

It's seared into your memory because Nick Punto had more career PA against the Tigers than any other team.

[MichiganCardinal]

26 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

It's seared into your memory because Nick Punto had more career PA against the Tigers than any other team.

Anyone else have Nick Punto on your Lions Offseason Bingo card?

[Sports_Freak]

9 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:

It's seared into your memory because Nick Punto had more career PA against the Tigers than any other team.

Punto may have been gritty but I remember when Rod Allen called Jose Altuve an "Itty, bitty fella".

[Shinzaki]

Fins are not going to franchise DT Wilkins....expected to hit FA

[Mr.TaterSalad]

1 hour ago, Shinzaki said:

Fins are not going to franchise DT Wilkins....expected to hit FA

He's 28 years and this will likely be his last opportunity at a big contract. I would guess he'll want a 4 year plus deal. I've seen projections of north of $20 million per for Wilkins too. These aren't the types of contracts and players we will be signing IMO. I'd like to sign one of the marquee free agents like Wilkins, but I don't think we will be. It's best to lower expectations now, that way you won't be disappointed later. 

[RatkoVarda]

They have glaring needs at DE and CB and somewhat less so at DT. They have the cap room to make more than one significant move. I would be happy with just one impact signing. It would be a mistake to not do so IMO.

[Motown Bombers]

Just wait until they sign a big free agent and can't sign one of their own. 

[Mr.TaterSalad]

1 minute ago, RatkoVarda said:

They have glaring needs at DE and CB and somewhat less so at DT. They have the cap room to make more than one significant move. I would be happy with just one impact signing. It would be a mistake to not do so IMO.

This is what we the fans and media think. They might not think that though. Everyone wanted them to draft Jalen Carter, an edge rusher, or a CB last year in the draft. Instead, they took a RB and an off-ball LB in the first. They may feel fine with their CB room and like what they have with Emmanuel Moseley returning off injury and the chance to develop one of their own draft picks in Chase Lucas. Fans have been screaming for more help when it comes to pass rushing since they drafted Aiden. Someone to support Hutch on the defensive front. Their response was to resign Charles Harris, John Cominsky, and Romeo Okwara. They may like what they have with Houston as well.

I wouldn't be shocked at all if their free agency period consisted of no major, marquee signings. I wouldn't at all be surprised if it involved something like getting a starting Guard, another depth Olineman, a 3rd string WR, and depth signings along the DL and at the CB position.

[Mr.TaterSalad]

2 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

Just wait until they sign a big free agent and can't sign one of their own. 

Right. I don't feel that will happen with this regime. Brad Holmes and co. seem to be very smart with the cap and their finances. They seem to prioritize their own players that they can draft and develop over spending big in free agency like prior Lions regimes have done. Those expecting a Trey Flowers type signing and contract should temper their expectations. That's ok too because this regime clearly knows what the hell it's doing. They have a plan and it has thus far gotten them to an NFC Championship and was a half away from a Super Bowl. While I'd like to make one major, marquee defensive signing in free agency, I'll be ok if they don't because we clearly have competent people running things around here now.

[gehringer_2]

12 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

They seem to prioritize their own players

I don't remember if it was Campbell or Holmes that made the statement that they have a strong predisposition towards re-signing their own players that they have gotten to know rather than take chances on FA's who are locker room unknowns. Now like every other statement, I'm sure there is some wiggle room. You can do some research, you may have ex-teammates you trust that vouch for a guy's personality/work ethic etc.

Bottom line though is that they want to know guys in depth before they spend their money on them.

Edited March 3, 2024 by gehringer_2

[Motown Bombers]

I feel like I heard Holmes say before he wanted to model the Lions after the Ravens or Steelers who are consistent winners who build within. I know the Ravens have made some splash signing here and there, but they really always build through the draft. 

[buddha]

47 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

This is what we the fans and media think. They might not think that though. Everyone wanted them to draft Jalen Carter, an edge rusher, or a CB last year in the draft. Instead, they took a RB and an off-ball LB in the first. They may feel fine with their CB room and like what they have with Emmanuel Moseley returning off injury and the chance to develop one of their own draft picks in Chase Lucas. 

and they still have massive holes at edge, cb, and really could have used jalen carter.

as for free agents, lots of teams have tons of cap room.  if the bears and lions want the same guy, he aint coming here.  if wilkins or jones hits the market, i expect the bears to sign one of them.

bears are about to clear even mpre cap space by dealing fields to some dumb team who thinks he's lamar jackson 2.0.

[MichiganCardinal]

40 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

This is what we the fans and media think. They might not think that though. Everyone wanted them to draft Jalen Carter, an edge rusher, or a CB last year in the draft. Instead, they took a RB and an off-ball LB in the first. They may feel fine with their CB room and like what they have with Emmanuel Moseley returning off injury and the chance to develop one of their own draft picks in Chase Lucas. Fans have been screaming for more help when it comes to pass rushing since they drafted Aiden. Someone to support Hutch on the defensive front. Their response was to resign Charles Harris, John Cominsky, and Romeo Okwara. They may like what they have with Houston as well.

I wouldn't be shocked at all if their free agency period consisted of no major, marquee signings. I wouldn't at all be surprised if it involved something like getting a starting Guard, another depth Olineman, a 3rd string WR, and depth signings along the DL and at the CB position.

I still maintain that they were going to draft Witherspoon at #6 if the Seahawks hadn't taken him at #5. Beyond that, I think they would have taken Christian Gonzalez at #18 if the Patriots hadn't taken him at #17. Hell, they might have even taken Joey Porter Jr. at #34 if the Steelers didn't take him at #32. They finally put their foot down with the trade with Green Bay to jump New England and take Branch. I think there was recognition that we needed help in the secondary last draft, but the board just wasn't falling how they hoped. There really wasn't ever much behind Sutton and Moseley, and they knew Moseley was coming off an ACL and might not be ready by week one.

I think they want the best players that will fit what they're trying to do. Carter was a good player who didn't fit what they were trying to do. I think it's encouraging though that when the guy they want (twice) gets taken out from under them, they don't panic. They could have reached at #6 and selected Gonzalez way too early, but instead they reacted, and got us Gibbs and LaPorta instead. They could have panicked at #18 and reached for Deonte Banks, but instead they took the best linebacker in the draft. Likewise with #34 and they got us the best tight end in the draft.

[MichiganCardinal]

Regarding the edge position, I think they were just wrong. I think they thought Charles Harris would be a player who he isn't.

[Jason_R]

Seems like their free agent strategy has been similar to their coaching strategy. Sign a bunch of credible names at reasonable salaries and let things sort themselves out. 

I don’t think for a minute that they were or are satisfied with their CB room. But as Michigan Cardinal points out, the only difference maker at that position they could get  in the draft was a slot guy. 

Holmes has not been shy about moving up to get his players. Will be interesting to see if he moves up to fill the corner need, which is overwhelmingly the team’s greatest weakness. 

[1984Echoes]

1 hour ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

Everyone wanted them to draft ...an edge rusher, or a CB last year in the draft. Instead, they took a RB and an off-ball LB in the first...

This is misinformation.

Reports were they were hot on Devon Witherspoon, a CB, at their #6 spot. When he got selected ahead of them, they traded down.

[1984Echoes]

1 hour ago, RatkoVarda said:

They have glaring needs at DE and CB and somewhat less so at DT. They have the cap room to make more than one significant move. I would be happy with just one impact signing. It would be a mistake to not do so IMO.

I think if they spend big money, it's on a CB. The good ones (meaning capable of playing the position and not getting burned for TD's...) are just too rare.

I think it's easier to manufacture a pass-rush. In multiple different ways: a good DE, a pass-rushing interior player, a blitz-LB'er, or good-blitzing Safeties or CB's...

I just think there are too many ways to bandaid a D-Line or a pass-rush.

You can't bandaid a Burnt-Toast-CB so if they spend money, IMO... it's here.

[Hongbit]

27 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said:

 

You can't bandaid a Burnt-Toast-CB so if they spend money, IMO... it's here.

Sure you can and it happens all the time in the NFL.   You band-aid a sus CB by putting pressure on the QB.  Invest   heavily in a front 7 that can speed up the play and your CB’s instantly become much better.  

[1984Echoes]

Just now, Hongbit said:

Sure you can and it happens all the time in the NFL.   You band-aid a sus CB by putting pressure on the QB.  Invest   heavily in a front 7 that can speed up the play and your CB’s instantly become much better.  

If the CB can't cover **** than the speeded up rush is still worthless. Receivers that can get wide open or at least sufficient separation with 1 juke because our secondary CAN'T COVER means the QB is still hitting guys all the way down the field.

Unless you have an off-the-charts pass-rush that completely overwhelms O-Lines...

And the Lions are nowhere near that.

I'm not interested in trying to bandaid a bad secondary with a HEAVY investment in the front 7.

I'm interested in the Seahawks Legion of Boom secondary.

Shut down the receivers well enough to give the pass-rush an extra second to get home. AND I'm interested in drafting Danielle Hunter (3rd round)/ Maxx Crosby (4th round) types to build up our pass rush capabilities.

IMO: Both are needed. But I'm looking for the best CB the Lions can get as a FA AND in the draft... while I think pass rush is primarily draft or secondary FA's. It's still easier to bandaid a pass-rush and nearly impossible to bandaid a burnt-toast-CB (unless you have a GOAT pass rush)...

IMO.