gehringer_2 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 (edited) 1 hour ago, RandyMarsh said: I'm of the belief that sending experienced guys to the minors to "figure things out" rarely ever works The thing is, looking back at it, Torkelson was never a decent hitter in the minors before they called him up. He's been 'unfinished' from the get go. When he made the team in 2022, he had only ever hit 239 in Toledo the prior season, and then when they sent him back down in 2022 he still didn't get above 230 at AAA before they brought him back again. So he did hit a bunch of HR in 2023, he still never got his OPS to 800. So he has never shown sustainable skill as a hitter in the 1st place. All we can hope now is that it isn't too late at this point for him to learn to do what he should have learned to do 2/3 yrs ago, command more of the strike zone. Edited June 3 by gehringer_2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted June 3 Author Share Posted June 3 10 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said: MLBtraderumors says that we are indeed sending down Tork to make room for Malloy. As I said I'm skeptical that the move will do anything for Tork but the fact is when we are trying to win games we just can't afford his empty bat in the lineup so even if it doesn't help him from a team perspective it is the right call. I’m surprised, but sure, why not? As long as they can switch off between Canha and Urshela, unless they have something up their sleeve with the market, which I kind of doubt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiger2022 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 That sounds about right. Tork never had been able to hit professional pitching. But what else can they do? They picked him #1 and he is 24. Give him the rest of the season on Toledo. What do they have to lose? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyMarsh Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 22 minutes ago, tiger2022 said: That sounds about right. Tork never had been able to hit professional pitching. But what else can they do? They picked him #1 and he is 24. Give him the rest of the season on Toledo. What do they have to lose? I was actually surprised when I looked back at the numbers how poorly he had hit at Toledo. HRs yes, which I guess is what we were all looking at, but that was it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 24 minutes ago, tiger2022 said: shat sounds about right. Tork never had been able to hit professional pitching. But what else can they do? For starters, I'm going to guess they need to get him with an instructor that connects with him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiger2022 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 (edited) Maybe he can turn into a consistent 35 hr guy even though he might only hit .220ish. Edited June 3 by tiger2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 how do you draft a guy #1 for his hit tool and he cant hit a ****ing fastball? i'll wait to hear how this wasnt al avila's fault because CONSENSUS! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 27 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said: I was actually surprised when I looked back at the numbers how poorly he had hit at Toledo. HRs yes, which I guess is what we were all looking at, but that was it. He drew walks too, but overall not the stats of someone you'd expect to be called up to the majors quickly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edman85 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 18 minutes ago, buddha said: how do you draft a guy #1 for his hit tool and he cant hit a ****ing fastball? i'll wait to hear how this wasnt al avila's fault because CONSENSUS! Scouting in 2020 was a challenge. But man, there have been a lot of similar flops the last 5 years or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenacious D Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 He won’t be the first 1-1 that didn’t work out (if he doesn’t). We now have two #1 picks (Tork and Manning) that have been demoted to Toledo, along with a #2 pick (Meadows) and two other #1’s (Mize and Faedo) that have underperformed. Lets hope that Harris’ development team can help Jung, Jobe and Clark, among others, pan out. (Ironically our best pitcher was a 9th rounder and hitter was a 19th). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 (edited) IDK - I'd like to think there is a hitter in there still waiting to get out. He has a beautiful swing and such easy power. maybe that last NCAA season where pretty much everyone walked him all the time put him down the wrong path? Who knows? it's like he either can't see the need, or maybe doesn't have the confidence to believe he can go get pitches and do damage instead of over thinking what he wants to swing at. But as has been noted, if what Tork happens to need in his unique case is to learn to become more of a hacker, that might be a hard lesson to find help with in this org right now. Edited June 3 by gehringer_2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 28 minutes ago, buddha said: how do you draft a guy #1 for his hit tool and he cant hit a ****ing fastball? i'll wait to hear how this wasnt al avila's fault because CONSENSUS! Who should they have drafted? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 Is it surprising the 2020 draft didn’t pan out for any team? Seasons shut down in March. How much HS and college ball was played? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 6 minutes ago, oblong said: Who should they have drafted? The pick wasn't the problem - maybe the handling of the player, but that's still an open question. Someone always has to be picked 1st - that just a fact regardless of whether there are any sure things in a given draft. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 21 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said: The pick wasn't the problem - maybe the handling of the player, but that's still an open question. Someone always has to be picked 1st - that just a fact regardless of whether there are any sure things in a given draft. To me a criticism or gripe has to be followed up with a suggestion on what should have been done or could be done to solve the problem. The Tigers development problem goes back decades with multiple administrations, that’s no secret. But a single player is not an indictment by itself, even a #1. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tiger2022 Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 17 minutes ago, oblong said: To me a criticism or gripe has to be followed up with a suggestion on what should have been done or could be done to solve the problem. The Tigers development problem goes back decades with multiple administrations, that’s no secret. But a single player is not an indictment by itself, even a #1. Why? Just because someone can recognize an obvious bad decision doesn't mean they have a solution. I always thought picking a 1st baseman #1 overall was lazy and stupid. Quality hitting 1st basemen is the easiest position to fill, so for a guy to go #1, he has to be top 3 in the league for a long time. And for Mize, picking a guy with an average at best fastball just because he had success in college is not a great strategy. That was the pick I was left wondering about the most and I am not surprised he has been pretty bad as an mlb pitcher. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IdahoBert Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 Tork hit something like 63 homers in 159 college and summer league games. Which is an awful lot. He even had a high BA and could walk. But a guy who’s playing first base in college isn’t much of an athlete overall. I don’t know if there were other more “complete players” available in the first round or not. But my non-expert take on it was that he had a good chance of being a one-dimensional guy, and that without an overall athleticism expressed in the ability to play a more demanding position he might not be up to the challenges he’d face. He may simply not have either the reflexes or the mentality to adjust when he’s being figured out. It’s a drag. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 9 minutes ago, tiger2022 said: Why? Just because someone can recognize an obvious bad decision doesn't mean they have a solution. I always thought picking a 1st baseman #1 overall was lazy and stupid. Quality hitting 1st basemen is the easiest position to fill, so for a guy to go #1, he has to be top 3 in the league for a long time. And for Mize, picking a guy with an average at best fastball just because he had success in college is not a great strategy. That was the pick I was left wondering about the most and I am not surprised he has been pretty bad as an mlb pitcher. So who should they have picked instead? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 1 hour ago, oblong said: Who should they have drafted? A question often asked but never answered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IdahoBert Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 Hitting a projectile thrown at high velocity with a stick over and over again, or throwing a projectile and making it do funny stuff to confuse or throw the guy with the stick off balance are two of the most sparsely distributed talents in the world. There are small number of people functioning on the planet at one time that can do that at the highest levels. It’s no surprise that guys wash out. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 3 minutes ago, IdahoBert said: Hitting a projectile thrown at high velocity with a stick over and over again, or throwing a projectile and making it do funny stuff to confuse or throw the guy with the stick off balance are two of the most sparsely distributed talents in the world. There are small number of people functioning on the planet at one time that can do that at the highest levels. It’s no surprise that guys wash out. Indeed. As for Mize this season, he’s still coming back from major surgery. I kind of expected a bit of an up and down season. And we still don’t know how the stamina over the course of a season will factor in, I suspect Torkelson was misused early on. When he was promoted, he started the season hitting 7th. If a rookie 1B can only crack 7th in the lineup in any of the Tiger lineups from recent seasons, that kind of seems like a bit of a red flag right there. It ain’t like they’ve been chock full of hitting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 1 hour ago, oblong said: Who should they have drafted? someone better. i'm not a baseball scout, i dont know. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IdahoBert Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 We know that he is capable of hitting the baseball on occasion so even though he doesn’t have an overall athleticism, he does possess this one aspect of athleticism so maybe he’s just a head case and needs the help of a baseball version of a “horse whisperer” but we don’t have one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigermojo Posted June 3 Share Posted June 3 This doesn't mean Tork's career is over. It's an opportunity to make adjustments to help him be successful. He did it for a couple months last year. He has to figure out how to do it more consistently. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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