2024 DETROIT TIGERS REGULAR SEASON THREAD

[casimir]

On 9/10/2024 at 6:30 PM, SoCalTiger said:

Him or someone similar is ideal to hedge both third and first base provided they bat right. This allows us to keep Verling in right field. Our resurgence is tied directly to our outfield defense of Riley in left, Meadows in center and Verling in right. It’s the best outfield defense in the game. Just let it roll 24/7 162. 

I like this.  I'd suggest Carpenter is fine in a corner OF although certainly no equal to any of those three you mentioned.  So I'd be comfortable with him spelling in either corner or RF when Vierling plays CF to give Meadows a day off.  Perez on the bench or maybe just use the Ibanez/McKinstry type for in game OF depth when needed with Perez on call in Toledo for when an injury arises.

[Tenacious D]

On 9/10/2024 at 5:08 PM, gehringer_2 said:

because he hasn't done enough with the bat *yet* to look like a regular. Sure he may, but the proper presumption for any garden variety MiLB player called to the majors is failure until they prove otherwise.

This hasn’t aged well.

[oblong]

1 hour ago, IdahoBert said:

It’s always a mistake when I go on a Tigers-oriented Facebook page and read the blathering idiocy of ordinary fans. It makes me appreciate this place even though we are Morans. 

Two or three months ago, scores of ordinary fans on a Facebook Tigers page were venting their rage at Verlander claiming that he had left the team in free agency for more money and they could never forgive him. There were so many of them almost no one could be heard over their grunts that simulated reasoned discourse  Just now it was white hot rage at the Jack Flaherty trade that anyone with brain tissue knew was inevitable.

Even though we are fewer than we once were, I’m glad the few of us who remain are still together.

 

I find most facebook baseball groups are made up of old timers who complain about today's game.  They want just two leagues with no divisions, no DH, no wild card teams, pitchers to throw 120+ pitches a game (back when pitchers were real men b/c Nolan Ryan), no batting gloves/sliding gloves/body armor, no shifts, Hank Aaron is the real HR champ,  no flashy play (read:  too many Mexicans), and you must pledge that Dale Murphy and Don Mattingly should be HOFers.

[Graterol]

29 minutes ago, Tenacious D said:

This hasn’t aged well.

Sweeneys 60ABs are encouraging….but it’s 60 ABs.

I wouldn’t hate the idea of Sweeney as full time SS next year but only if we have a platoon/fallback option if he doesn’t hit like this over 500 ABs.

[gehringer_2]

17 minutes ago, Graterol said:

Sweeneys 60ABs are encouraging….but it’s 60 ABs.

I wouldn’t hate the idea of Sweeney as full time SS next year but only if we have a platoon/fallback option if he doesn’t hit like this over 500 ABs.

yeah - just for a recent example, Baddoo started out much better than Sweeney has and has flamed out. Trey is looking promising but he's got a ways to go to show you can start making plans around him.

Edited September 12 by gehringer_2

[Tiger337]

Sweeney has done enough in the minors to say that he could develop into a viable starter, but he also could be Zach McKinstry who also had a fantastic month in the Majors.  

[gehringer_2]

20 minutes ago, Tiger337 said:

Sweeney has done enough in the minors to say that he could develop into a viable starter, but he also could be Zach McKinstry who also had a fantastic month in the Majors.  

He had an up and down year at AAA. Good April, lousy May and June and then really picked it up in July and has been hitting ever since, so he's actually got 3 pretty good months in a row now including the promotion to Det.

[RatkoVarda]

he simply has to be better than Baez, McKinstry and Kreidler. so far so good.

[Edman85]

2 hours ago, Tiger337 said:

Sweeney has done enough in the minors to say that he could develop into a viable starter, but he also could be Zach McKinstry who also had a fantastic month in the Majors.  

Hey now, McKinstry is up to 2 now.

[Tiger337]

15 minutes ago, Edman85 said:

Hey now, McKinstry is up to 2 now.

I think Mckinstry is good in the role he is in now.  You just don't want him getting too mant at bats over the course of a season.  

[Mr.TaterSalad]

I wanted to ask this two-part question. Do you consider this season a success where it stands right now and would you consider it a success if we end up missing the playoffs after all is said and done?

[Tigermojo]

1 minute ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

I wanted to ask this two-part question. Do you consider this season a success where it stands right now and would you consider it a success if we end up missing the playoffs after all is said and done?

Yes X2 for me.

[Tenacious D]

6 hours ago, Graterol said:

Sweeneys 60ABs are encouraging….but it’s 60 ABs.

I wouldn’t hate the idea of Sweeney as full time SS next year but only if we have a platoon/fallback option if he doesn’t hit like this over 500 ABs.

So, if he struggles in his first 35 AB’s, he’s destined to be a utility guy, but hitting well after 60, it’s too small of a sample size?

just trying to keep up.

 

[Mr.TaterSalad]

2 minutes ago, Tigermojo said:

Yes X2 for me.

See, I wouldn't say it is a success unless we squeak into the playoffs. Which of course could very well happen. While I've enjoyed this last month or so of baseball, it didn't have to be this way. We could have solidly been in a playoff spot where the Royals or Twins are at now if our GM and/or owner had gone out and made the necessary moves this offseason and they did not. Call me a whiner, a complainer, a curmudgeon or whatever but this season is a failure because we should have been a playoff team with the pitching staff we had and are not having to claw our way into one if we make it.

We had a playoff caliber starting rotation and our General Manager and/or Owner squandered it away. Did they not have a gauge on where they thought this team would be at this season? Did they not have a gauge on the level of talent in their starting rotation and the damage they could do to other teams?

We had and continue to have a rotation with a starter who has been in the Cy Young chase in Tarik Skubal. Until the trade deadline, we had two other pitches in Flaherty and Olson who were as good as most anyone else's #2 and #3 starters. Harris and Ilitch squandered it away by either refusing to add a bat/s in the offseason or potentially by the owner meddling and not allowing Harris to go out and spend the money necessary to acquire a a middle of the order bat.

Harris trotted out a lineup with an average OPS so low that it would make Paul Bako, Kimera Bartee, Randy Smith, and the 97 Tigers blush. Randy Smith in-fact put out lineups with higher overall OPS, OBP, and runs scored in the 97, 98, and 99 seasons. Am I suggesting we bring Smith back, of course not, he was a dreadful GM. Am I suggesting Scott Harris and Chris Ilitch should be held accountable for this season's failures when it comes to the lineup, yes, they should be.

We've seen the names rehashed here a thousand times, JD Martinez, Matt Chapman, passing on Langford in the draft, etc. It seems pointless to rehash this argument now. Maybe I should just shut up and enjoy the winning while we're doing it, but it is frustrating to know that we could be firmly in control of our own destiny had we just made one or two moves with this lineup during the offseason.

[oblong]

14 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

I wanted to ask this two-part question. Do you consider this season a success where it stands right now and would you consider it a success if we end up missing the playoffs after all is said and done?

Despite the odds I think anybody at this point expecting to make the playoffs is setting themselves up for disappointment.  

Yes, I think it's a success but that's due to the injuries and record despite them.  I am disappointed in a few players that brings it down somewhat.  But this season, despite a couple of bad weeks here and there in May and June, it's been an enjoyable run.  Pretty consistent.

[gehringer_2]

56 minutes ago, Tenacious D said:

So, if he struggles in his first 35 AB’s, he’s destined to be a utility guy, but hitting well after 60, it’s too small of a sample size?

just trying to keep up.

 

Nothing confusing really - you start knowing you have a major league hitter at about 500 AB, pretty sure one way or the other by 1000, and even then some guys might still go either way (Torkelson).

Edited September 12 by gehringer_2

[Tenacious D]

34 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

Nothing confusing really - you start knowing you have a major league hitter at about 500 AB, pretty sure one way or the other by 1000, and even then some guys might still go either way (Torkelson).

So, let’s not cast off someone after their first 10 games?  We’re in violent agreement.

[tiger2022]

Anything other than playoffs after a 10 year rebuild is a failure.

Winning a playoff series or even a world series depends a lot on luck and fortune.  But 162 games is a lot more telling as to how a team is constructed.

[monkeytargets39]

This year is a success if you take into account how we felt around mid-June.  From the start of the year I don’t know if I feel it’s that much of a success.

 

Our leadoff hitter and center fielder spent more than half the year in Toledo because he had such an awful start.  Torkelson was so bad that we HAD to send him down and had to play utility guys at 1B for over two months.  Baez somehow got even worse.  Keith’s first couple months were brutal.  Third base was just as big of a mess as we thought it’d be heading into the year.  Carpenter missed two plus months.  Maeda went from savvy depth signing to unplayable.  We continuously gave Joey Wentz chances despite constant failures.  Mize and Manning haven’t progressed at all.  All of this on a team that we thought should solidly contend for the division.

 

Instead, we are only close to sniffing the wild card because Skubal and Flaherty became two of the best starters in baseball, Wenceel Perez and Matt Vierling were unexpectedly valuable, and we’ve somehow managed to turn three months of Skubal/Montero plus Bullpen starts into a good working strategy.  If it weren’t for Tyler Holton, Will Vest, Jason Foley and a mishmash of pitchers that no one on here had ever expected to see the big leagues, we’d be in Oakland A’s territory record-wise.  Brieske, Faedo, Miller and Chafin certainly weren’t particularly impressive.

 

Credit where it’s due though-  Meadows completely turned it around in Toledo and has carried it back to the MLB, Jake Rogers has been elite calling games with a variety of pitchers, Keith kept working and turned it around in a big way, Carp has been a monster when healthy, Vierling/Ibanez/Perez all stepped up big this year, Malloy looks like he will be valuable, and a ton of low level prospects have pitched great with their opportunities.  
 

I’m not a Hinch fan, but he and Fetter have navigated the pitching staff health issues quite well.  If these guys can go into next year playing with the energy and execution level that they have since the trade deadline- then next year should be a lot of fun.  But if all the borderline guys regress and start slow again…….then it’ll be hard for me to say anything more than that these last two months were just a ball club of young players who were playing loose because they had no pressure on them.

 

 

Edited Friday at 03:53 PM by monkeytargets39

[RatkoVarda]

Hinch should get significant consideration as AL manager of the year for the masterful job he has done with this flawed team.

[Edman85]

6 minutes ago, RatkoVarda said:

Hinch should get significant consideration as AL manager of the year for the masterful job he has done with this flawed team.

He should but it will be Quartaro because the Royals exceeded expectations

[oblong]

I said this in another thread I think, maybe this one, but outside of a couple of weeks here and there, the team was always competitive. They were in a lot of games they lost.  The season was fun.  I didn't expect the playoffs but this is no comparison to what we've had.  It's the best season since 2016.

 

[1776]

1 hour ago, Edman85 said:

He should but it will be Quartaro because the Royals exceeded expectations

If I had a vote it would definitely go to Mark Kotsay. He has done an incredible job this year with all the distractions and chaos surrounding the organization.

[Graterol]

On 9/12/2024 at 12:42 PM, Tenacious D said:

So, if he struggles in his first 35 AB’s, he’s destined to be a utility guy, but hitting well after 60, it’s too small of a sample size?

just trying to keep up.

 

Not even sure what point is being made. Entire track record matters more than small sample size. Jung hasn’t hit great this year  but don’t think we should write him off. Sweeney has hit well recently but hasn’t hit as well over his entire career. I hope Sweeney continues to hit like this even if I don’t expect it to continue.

[Tenacious D]

You’d have to go deeper in the thread, but not recommending it.  The point is we shouldn’t rush to judgement over a ridiculously small sample size.