5/13/24 6:40PM Marlins @ Tigers

[RandyMarsh]

Before yesterday's game somebody on Twitter posted Tork's slash line from a year ago this time and it was pretty damn close to what it was this year.

I believe the obp was down this year but slugging up(or vice versa) but ultimately the OPS was about the same. 

[mtutiger]

9 hours ago, Shinzaki said:

Tork bopping dingers again is our in season addition 

As bad as the hitting has been to start the year, there was always a glass-half-full view where Tork (and Keith) weren't likely to continue to be as bad at the dish as they have been to date. 

I need to see more, trust but verify, but even before the homer on Sunday, both with the bat and the glove, it's been apparent that Tork has been playing better. Just need to see more consistency 

[casimir]

For the record, I don't like PHing for Carpenter that early in a game.  I understand the general lefty on lefty situation at hand.  I'm just not all that worried about Carpenter vs Nardi.

[oblong]

Hinch talked about that in his podcast interview with Jason and Dan.  He said he's not a strict conformist on the matchups but it depends the players involved.  I am not saying he's right or wrong but that he puts more thought into it than just L/L.

[kdog]

Wenceel's contribution to the 8th inning shouldn't get understated. Maybe he becomes something and Meadows never does?...that's the way it goes.

[oblong]

2 minutes ago, kdog said:

Wenceel's contribution to the 8th inning shouldn't get understated. Maybe he becomes something and Meadows never does?...that's the way it goes.

that's exactly right.  

[gehringer_2]

2 hours ago, mtutiger said:

As bad as the hitting has been to start the year, there was always a glass-half-full view where Tork (and Keith) weren't likely to continue to be as bad at the dish as they have been to date. 

I need to see more, trust but verify, but even before the homer on Sunday, both with the bat and the glove, it's been apparent that Tork has been playing better. Just need to see more consistency 

this bothered me though:

Quote

"We preach, less than two strikes, if it's not a damage pitch, it's not really worth it to swing at it," Torkelson said, "and then when you get to two strikes, you just battle and try to maybe maneuver it the other way, but you give the pitcher credit if he can do three in a row in that same spot. Odds say that he won't, but if he does, it's the big leagues, and they get paid to do that."

this was Tork, quoted by Petzold last week. I don't think you can give away any AB where a pitcher can hit his spot 3 times. That's a solid recipe for only winning games against the worst pitchers. Sure, you hunt zone when you are ahead in the count, but you have to start adjusting your approach from 0-1, at two strikes you've given the pitcher too many ways to get you out. And if you watch the Tigers, they seem to fail on an inordinate number of AB where they are up 2-0, because they are looking for perfect and pretty soon they are 2-2 and then out of the AB. Your BA when you get to 2-0 should be huge. 

And it's especially dumb for Tork, because he has the power to "do damage" just fine on an outer third FB (IIRC, 6 opposite field HR last season) if he sat on one at 0-1 when he *knows* that is where he is going to be pitched. But so far he won't. The 'approach' doesn't even give himself enough credit. 

 Everything you do in a AB has to be directed at not getting to two strikes, esp 0-2. All the numbers tell you that. If the Tiger's are willing to go to 0-2 to swing the bat at a strike, that is why they are an inept offense. 

Edited May 14 by gehringer_2

[SoCalTiger]

55 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

this bothered me though:

this was Tork, quoted by Petzold last week. I don't think you can give away any AB where a pitcher can hit his spot 3 times. That's a solid recipe for only winning games against the worst pitchers. Sure, you hunt zone when you are ahead in the count, but you have to start adjusting your approach from 0-1, at two strikes you've given the pitcher too many ways to get you out. And if you watch the Tigers, they seem to fail on an inordinate number of AB where they are up 2-0, because they are looking for perfect and pretty soon they are 2-2 and then out of the AB. Your BA when you get to 2-0 should be huge. 

And it's especially dumb for Tork, because he has the power to "do damage" just fine on an outer third FB (IIRC, 6 opposite field HR last season) if he sat on one at 0-1 when he *knows* that is where he is going to be pitched. But so far he won't. The 'approach' doesn't even give himself enough credit. 

 Everything you do in a AB has to be directed at not getting to two strikes, esp 0-2. All the numbers tell you that. If the Tiger's are willing to go to 0-2 to swing the bat at a strike, that is why they are an inept offense. 

Do we know how Tork has done against good pitchers slugging wise and what is the MLB average against such pitchers ? It's obviously lower but some players have good careers hitting AAAA pitchers but disappoint in big games. Are there such stats available ?

[Toddwert]

2 hours ago, kdog said:

Wenceel's contribution to the 8th inning shouldn't get understated. Maybe he becomes something and Meadows never does?...that's the way it goes.

it does make me wonder short of injures do we see meadows back as an everyday player this season... while the defense is great he has to have a little bit of a bat 

[Sports_Freak]

5 hours ago, casimir said:

Still leading MLB in doubles, too.

So, wait, is it going to be like reverse Lent?  Is he going to going 40 straight games with a homer and that's how he is getting to 40?  He's got the first 2 games in a row down already.  It seems like that might be a record.

When he hit that home run last night, you could see all the frustration coming out in the bat flip. I really don't remember him doing that before. It was the longest homer of his career.

[casimir]

3 hours ago, oblong said:

Hinch talked about that in his podcast interview with Jason and Dan.  He said he's not a strict conformist on the matchups but it depends the players involved.  I am not saying he's right or wrong but that he puts more thought into it than just L/L.

Its probably not fair of me to call it just a L/L matchup, you're right.  I'm sure he had some other rationale and I know he likes to look ahead in the game at possible matchups.

I guess I don't see the reward for PHing him with two out in the 5th when that spot in the lineup is coming up again.  Not for Carpenter, anyway.  Now, McKinstry or Keith, I am more amenable to it.

[casimir]

10 minutes ago, Sports_Freak said:

When he hit that home run last night, you could see all the frustration coming out in the bat flip. I really don't remember him doing that before. It was the longest homer of his career.

Of course he's frustrated.  I have no doubt about that.  I just wonder if the frustration has been mounting upon the problem and making things worse for himself.

[oblong]

16 minutes ago, casimir said:

Its probably not fair of me to call it just a L/L matchup, you're right.  I'm sure he had some other rationale and I know he likes to look ahead in the game at possible matchups.

I guess I don't see the reward for PHing him with two out in the 5th when that spot in the lineup is coming up again.  Not for Carpenter, anyway.  Now, McKinstry or Keith, I am more amenable to it.

One thing I hated about Tram being the manager is I had to criticize my hero.  He was a stickler on the matchups and it drove me crazy.  Just very predictable.

[Dan Gilmore]

Regarding Meadows, we drafted him out of high school, so he’s been around for awhile. But he won’t turn 26 until after this season. Hopefully he regains enough hit tool to return in at least a platoon role. He should be entering his prime before long. 

[Sports_Freak]

1 hour ago, casimir said:

Of course he's frustrated.  I have no doubt about that.  I just wonder if the frustration has been mounting upon the problem and making things worse for himself.

Hopefully, he busts out of that slump and hits a dozen Tork Bombs in the next 10 games or so. He's pretty hot right now, a 7 game hit streak? If we could get Riley and Torkelson hot at the same time, we may start being more consistent in scoring runs.

[gehringer_2]

2 hours ago, casimir said:

Of course he's frustrated.  I have no doubt about that.  I just wonder if the frustration has been mounting upon the problem and making things worse for himself.

I don't know Hinch's dynamics in a this kind of situation. From my observation over the years, most players end up coming down on the Magglio side - you have to ease back and stop pressing - stop trying to "do too much" to break a slump, but Hinch has a level of subliminal intensity about him - which in most cases is probably a big virtue for him, but that make me wonder if doesn't put more pressure a young guy like Tork playing for him, even if he doesn't mean it to. For instance, does he have that gift for getting guys to loosen up that Leyland had - which can help when a player is slumping.

Edited May 14 by gehringer_2

[casimir]

17 hours ago, oblong said:

One thing I hated about Tram being the manager is I had to criticize my hero.  He was a stickler on the matchups and it drove me crazy.  Just very predictable.

Remember the sac bunts early in games?