2024 Trade Deadline Rumors and Discussion

[TigerNation]

2 minutes ago, AlaskanTigersFan said:

That's not 100% accurate. I looked up Cleveland and they have three guys. Plus, I also consider guys .790 to be close enough to .800 for arugment sake. I see what you're saying here. But https://www.espn.com/mlb/team/stats/_/name/cle/table/batting/sort/OPS/dir/desc shows three players not two. SO I'm not 100% sure how accurate that is. 

 

https://www.espn.com/mlb/team/stats/_/name/bos/table/batting/sort/OPS/dir/desc - Red sox have 6, that shows they have two. Just another example. (Thank you for looking that up though)

Because your list shows unqualified hitters. 

[TigerNation]

28 minutes ago, Tiger337 said:

So, the other 27 teams should not try to win and sell all their best players?

And apparently it's impossible to add an .800 OPS hitter.

The Tigers already have three hitters in Greene, Carpenter, and Keith that could all be .800+ OPS guys next year, but because they don't have a 4th they are years away from being competitive.

[AlaskanTigersFan]

2 minutes ago, TigerNation said:

Because your list shows unqualified hitters. 

I dunno if you're legit saying that or trying to get a jab in. 

Kwan - .891
Fry - .860
Ramirez - .835
Naylor .792 (Close enough which I pointed out in previous post to be considered for argument sake).

Even without Naylor, 30% of your lineup fits the criteria......

[chasfh]

29 minutes ago, AlaskanTigersFan said:

That's not 100% accurate. I looked up Cleveland and they have three guys. Plus, I also consider guys .790 to be close enough to .800 for arugment sake. I see what you're saying here. But https://www.espn.com/mlb/team/stats/_/name/cle/table/batting/sort/OPS/dir/desc shows three players not two. SO I'm not 100% sure how accurate that is. 

 

https://www.espn.com/mlb/team/stats/_/name/bos/table/batting/sort/OPS/dir/desc - Red sox have 6, that shows they have two. Just another example. (Thank you for looking that up though)

The cutoff I used was qualified hitter, meaning, 3.2 plate appearance times the number of team games. So, 3.2 * 99 = 317 plate appearances. David Fry has 259 plate appearances, which is why he didn't qualify.

Also, I used .800 as the cutoff because that, not .790 (or, more exactly, .792) was the cutoff you established.

To your point, thought, David Fry is a regular—an American league All-Star, in fact—and .792 is close enough for rock and roll. But now you understand why they did not show up in the list.

Edited July 23 by chasfh

[chasfh]

By the way, I looked at Fry's Reference card and here is what is list as his position:

D2H73/59

The slash is a 10-game cutoff, meaning, he played ten or more games at the positions left of the slash, and fewer than ten games at the positions right of the slash. ("H" is pinch-hitter.)

Take a deeper dive and this is how those positions break outs:

So what the hell is wrong with Mike Chernoff and Stephen Vogt? Why do they have to play Fry all over the field? Why can't they stick a guy at a position and keep him there like teams did when I was eleven?

 

[IdahoBert]

I’m not interested in trades right now because I just saw that we now have a +3 run differential. Everything is fine. I’m going to party like it’s 1999, without a care for the morrow.

[casimir]

1 hour ago, AlaskanTigersFan said:

That's not what I'm saying at all. 

I'm saying OBJECTIVELY that a team without at least three .800 OPS hitters will MOST LIKELY NOT win the World Series. It can be done, sure. Any team can get hot if they get in to the playoffs. The players playing in MLB are obviously good if they are in the MLB.

What I'm saying is, we can sit here all day and say we're "Close" to getting in the playoffs or we can use our assets now and DRASTICALLY IMPROVE our chances to get to three+ .800 players who OBJECTIVELY will GIVE US a BETTER chance at actually winning the thing.... If you can honestly sit here and tell me that the Tigers will beat the Phillies, Dodgers, Yankees, Orioles, and Cleveland then I'll shut up.

But we have the chance here to drastically improve our team in the near future. Going for it this year will be setting us up for failure in the years to come. They can get so much for Flaherty and Skubal right now that they can add three possibly four position players of first division calibur (.800+ OPS). Then you Sign one or two pitchers in Free Agency or trade for one to replace Skubal. Take the Moneyball approach with Skubal. Can you replace him directly? No. But can you sign two #2 pitchers in FA to make up for him along with four first division players in your lineup? Yes. (It's been proven numerous times that teams that don't have cy young candidates leading their rotation can win a WS). Or if an Ace does hit FA, then you pay for him. Hell Corbin Burnes will be a FA. Trade Skubal, and use MONEY from one of the richest owners in Baseball to sign Burnes. Burnes and Jobe is a nice 1-2.

All I'm saying is our lineup is not WS calibur. I think if you can step back and actually look at it, you will see that. We all like this team. But take the subjective look out of it and look at things objectively. If we buy or stand pat, we are Al Avila 2.0. We will be stuck in this endless loop of mediocrity purgatory. The time is NOW to get better. And you get better by trading Skubal and Flaherty for 3-4 guys who will be in the lineup for the next decade.

I don't think anyone questions they need better position players.  Whether the threshold is an .800 OPS or maybe something more along the lines of OPS+ based, this offense needs help.

I think Flaherty has pitched himself to a point where a trade return is going to be better than the qualifying offer compensation.  Maybe that's debatable given his recent back issue, I don't know.  I think he gets traded before the deadline.  As fun as the Tigers have looked lately, its tough to see this stretch continuing given the pitching rotation health.  They've given themselves a puncher's chance, but let's see how they get through Cleveland and Minnesota.  The other issue is that they're chasing teams down, so they have to rely on their downfalls as well.

I think Skubal could still command a similarly high return during the offseason.  I think he'll be kept unless the offer is too much to decline.  I do disagree with what you said about replacing him directly.  The Tigers can ask for a top tier pitching prospect as part of a trade package.  I suppose we can debate whether or not that is a replacement for Skubal based on current value, and that's fine.

But they're also going to need to find some arms this offseason to begin with.  Almost certainly in the bullpen, but probably more rotation depth as well.

[TigerNation]

1 hour ago, AlaskanTigersFan said:

I dunno if you're legit saying that or trying to get a jab in. 

Kwan - .891
Fry - .860
Ramirez - .835
Naylor .792 (Close enough which I pointed out in previous post to be considered for argument sake).

Even without Naylor, 30% of your lineup fits the criteria......

Not a jab, just explaining the difference between the two list.

[LongLiveMaroth]

I'll take a Starlyn Caba or Aiden Miller please.

 

 

[casimir]

6 minutes ago, LongLiveMaroth said:

I'll take a Starlyn Caba or Aiden Miller please.

 

 

Caba sounds like fun.

[Sports_Freak]

 

[1984Echoes]

32 minutes ago, Sports_Freak said:

 

That's a nice start...

But the Tigers are missing at least 3 more prospects on their side of the ledger...

[monkeytargets39]

39 minutes ago, Sports_Freak said:

 

That’s not enough for Skubal by himself let alone throwing Foley into the deal.

Foley in a bandbox stadium would be very high value for a team.  That’s not just a pot-sweetener we are talking about. 

[Longgone]

1 hour ago, 1984Echoes said:

That's a nice start...

But the Tigers are missing at least 3 more prospects on their side of the ledger...

Baltimore has a lot of good prospects, but Holliday is in a class above and would be a superior get.

[Tiger337]

13 hours ago, TigerNation said:

And apparently it's impossible to add an .800 OPS hitter.

The Tigers already have three hitters in Greene, Carpenter, and Keith that could all be .800+ OPS guys next year, but because they don't have a 4th they are years away from being competitive.

Malloy is up to 760, so he's a possibility.  I don't know if he'll be a full-time player, but he has hit well for a rookie.   

[gehringer_2]

26 minutes ago, Tiger337 said:

Malloy is up to 760, so he's a possibility.  I don't know if he'll be a full-time player, but he has hit well for a rookie.   

slow start but he is adjusting to the need to be more aggressive in the K zone - really I think the whole team is. I amd going to guess the brain trust has digested the game's recent trends and made its adjustment as well.

[RatkoVarda]

Os are not trading their blue chip guys for anyone, but you can have these blah veterans

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2024/07/orioles-willing-to-trade-ryan-mountcastle-cedric-mullins.html

[1984Echoes]

3 minutes ago, RatkoVarda said:

Os are not trading their blue chip guys for anyone, but you can have these blah veterans

https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2024/07/orioles-willing-to-trade-ryan-mountcastle-cedric-mullins.html

That's NOT how I read that article.

The very first sentence, in the second paragraph, explicitly states: "the Orioles might ALSO... be sellers."

So the two are separate. A big trade (for Skubal, for example) with top prospects, but ALSO trade Mullins and Mountcastle because they have so many damn high upside prospects that they need to make room for any of those that are not traded.

That's exactly how I read what they've written and I don't see any other way to take that.

10 hours ago, Longgone said:

Baltimore has a lot of good prospects, but Holliday is in a class above and would be a superior get.

That's great...

But they are STILL short a few prospects on the Tigers side, even if Holliday is a superior get. They are NOT trading Skubal and Foley 1-for-1, basically, a prospect each. I mean, seriously? Do you actually believe that?

I'm sorry but... not even close. Not happening.

[casimir]

I am going to predict the Tigers trade away Flaherty, Kelly, Canha, and Ibanez.  I don't know how they backfill Flaherty, pitching depth seems to be a bit of a quagmire.  Dingler up for Kelly.  Torkelson up for Canha in a put up or shut up.  Vilade up for Ibanez.  You can take those to the bank or put them in a coffee can and bury it in your yard.

[Hongbit]

My gut is that Skubal doesn’t get traded but if he does it’s not for the Godfather deal we are all expecting.   Harris makes an underwhelming deal that most Tiger fans think is way too light.  

Something along the lines of what @Greg Pappas was suggesting a few weeks earlier that we all balked at.   1 of a Basallo or Mayo and much lesser prospect.   Not both of them and definitely no Holliday in the deal at all.  

I just have a bad feeling that Harris is a little bitch at this stuff and just kind of sucks in general.

[AlaskanTigersFan]

2 minutes ago, Hongbit said:

My gut is that Skubal doesn’t get traded but if he does it’s not for the Godfather deal we are all expecting.   Harris makes an underwhelming deal that most Tiger fans think is way too light.  

Something along the lines of what @Greg Pappas was suggesting a few weeks earlier that we all balked at.   1 of a Basallo or Mayo and much lesser prospect.   Not both of them and definitely no Holliday in the deal at all.  

I just have a bad feeling that Harris is a little bitch at this stuff and just kind of sucks in general.

Just curious on thought process. They traded more for 1 year of Burnes.... 

[chasfh]

13 minutes ago, Hongbit said:

blah blah blah blah Harris is a little bitch at this stuff and just kind of sucks in general.

There it is. 😉😝

[chasfh]

I'm going to predict we move Flaherty and Chafin, and Kelly is 60/40. I say that because catcher is a position of strength, or at least a well-settled position, for almost all the contenders, and as a two-month rental, he doesn't have much value in trade. At best he's a throw-in to pry away a lottery ticket. I don't think anyone will want either Canha or Ibanez.

If we did get the killer diller deal for Skubal, I think we keep Flaherty and take the QO pick. I also think any deal we do for Skubal will need not only a top of the system position player, but a numbered starter as well. If Harris did trade Flaherty AND Skubal and got no pitching in return, he will have totally overplayed his hand.

[RatkoVarda]

Philly and NYY and LAD have been rumored to be interested in Flaherty. Possible bidding get nuts for him? I won't mention last year, but don't blow it (again) Harris!

other guys are filler or will just return a flier (of course they could always find Olson 2.0)

[Tiger337]

17 minutes ago, Hongbit said:

My gut is that Skubal doesn’t get traded but if he does it’s not for the Godfather deal we are all expecting.   Harris makes an underwhelming deal that most Tiger fans think is way too light.  

Something along the lines of what @Greg Pappas was suggesting a few weeks earlier that we all balked at.   1 of a Basallo or Mayo and much lesser prospect.   Not both of them and definitely no Holliday in the deal at all.  

I just have a bad feeling that Harris is a little bitch at this stuff and just kind of sucks in general.

I think Harris is smart and understands player value and won't make a deal that hurts the team.  I don't know if he's bold and creative enough where he can make a big deal like this though.  My feeling is that he is cautious and risk averse , but I don't really know yet.  That wouldn't be a terrible thing.  Not everyone can be Dave Dombrowski.