kdog Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 15 minutes ago, Sports_Freak said: A successful Detroit baseball GM is all I have to go on. DD made many successful moves, trades and free agent signings, that made us a contender year after year. Hopefully Harris does the same. I will say DD had a lot of money to work with, but he was pretty good at evaluating talent and getting it here. Emptying the farm system for expensive proven players actually worked. But like we all know, the Tigers had one of the highest payroll at that time. That success is fleeting... Scott Boras had the batphone to Mike Ilitch; That won't be avaialble in our current situation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 39 minutes ago, Sports_Freak said: No, a successful GM makes a boatload of money for a billionaire owner. And keeps the fans hopes alive for producing a winner....in the future...always 2 or 3 years away. I’m sorry, I misunderstood you. I thought you were saying something along the lines of a successful GM would bring in established players and increase payroll and, if it were trades, empty out our minor league system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoCalTiger Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 1 hour ago, chasfh said: OK, good example. Do the Orioles make that trade? Apparently not. Elias built a great team in Baltimore but if his greed for duplicity of stud minor league hopefuls prevent him from getting the "DD" piece to win in October what good is it. maybe some GMs/PBOs can build and can't make "the Play" and some are the opposite Ala DD. I hope Harris can do both. A Skubal Trade with Baltimore made so much sense to both sides. Why do you need Holiday when you have Gunner backed up by Westberg at short and why do you need Skubal when you're years away from winning and can't without a shortstop. Baltimore could have had Burnes and Skubal starting 60 % of their playoff series. It's like the guy with 10 performance cars who rents because he can't afford to buy a house due to car payments and we're the husband that won't let his wife divorce him knowing she will eventually leave anyway and choosing to live in misery. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shinzaki Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 (edited) The Chisox seem to have been undone by a really poor culture...lazy and entitled Chris needs to channel his inner Mike and throw a bucket of cash at Juan Soto...sell him on being this generations Miggy...do whatever it takes, man Edited July 31 by Shinzaki Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongLiveMaroth Posted July 31 Author Share Posted July 31 1 hour ago, chasfh said: Take a look at our Fangraphs Scouting + STATS! prospect ratings look now. https://www.fangraphs.com/prospects/the-board/2024-in-season-prospect-list?org=det Honest question for the pessimists: does this serve only to demonstrate that our system is not as strong as we all thought it was yesterday morning? I like this look better as it gives a comparison to other teams as well. I think it has already been called out but FG doesn't even have Hamm listed and he is a top 100 ranked prospect (or was prior to the draft) on Baseball America so that feels like a miss on FG's part as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlington Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 (edited) 58 minutes ago, Sports_Freak said: A successful Detroit baseball GM is all I have to go on. DD made many successful moves, trades and free agent signings, that made us a contender year after year. Hopefully Harris does the same. I will say DD had a lot of money to work with, but he was pretty good at evaluating talent and getting it here. Emptying the farm system for expensive proven players actually worked. But like we all know, the Tigers had one of the highest payroll at that time. That success is fleeting... DD was genius in the 2000s at trading prospects. The Tigers' drafts were miserable, but the WAR DD picked up was huge, even setting aside the lopsided Cabrera deal. If you add up the WAR post-trade for the players going and coming in the numbers are stupefying. Adding to DD's brilliance was his ability to regularly upgrade the team's worse position to an All-Star level. Harris seems to have an entirely different approach emphasizing development, he's more the farmer while DD was the trader. I haven't looked into the numbers but I bet he has drafted many more prep over college players than Tigers have in the past. He's signing FAs and picking up fringe players with an eye for development and then flipping them. The FAs signed and flipped this year contributed more to the MLB top 30 than the draft this year. I think he should continue in this line until we are competitive and when so, become a buyer at the deadline with the surplus talent accumulated, upgrade This approach has time pressures as control over the core will disappear in a few seasons and it's not a fan favorite because it accepts development over winning sometimes. But if all works, we will have a core of strong home grown players, popular with the fans, and a competitive team that hopefully will win a title or two. Edited July 31 by Arlington Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sports_Freak Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 41 minutes ago, kdog said: Scott Boras had the batphone to Mike Ilitch; That won't be avaialble in our current situation. True. Money wasn't the objective for Mr. I. He was willing to spend crazy money in hopes of bringing a championship to Detroit. Those were some great years, a championship caliber baseball team... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlington Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 (edited) 48 minutes ago, kdog said: Scott Boras had the batphone to Mike Ilitch; That won't be avaialble in our current situation. Thank god, no Johnny Damon, Jacob Turner or Stephen Drew. Edited July 31 by Arlington Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sports_Freak Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 40 minutes ago, chasfh said: I’m sorry, I misunderstood you. I thought you were saying something along the lines of a successful GM would bring in established players and increase payroll and, if it were trades, empty out our minor league system. Whatever it takes. I'm sure there's more than one way to build a winner. Drafting and developing homegrown talent is probably the long way to go about it. Rebuilding a team that had bare cupboards isn't very easy, making just a few mistakes could set them back several years. Look at the White Sox... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlington Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 What improved the farm system more this year - the draft or the prospects brought in by the FA signings and flipped? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arlington Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 10 minutes ago, Sports_Freak said: True. Money wasn't the objective for Mr. I. He was willing to spend crazy money in hopes of bringing a championship to Detroit. Those were some great years, a championship caliber baseball team... It was a sad day when they released DD and gave the job to Avila. DD just started the rebuild and got a decent haul in July 2015. I would have like to have seen what he could have done going forward. I suspect that Mr. I was losing control of the team and was pressured to make the change. The switch to Avila was just weird and lazy, and we now know, bad. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syrett4 Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 2 minutes ago, Arlington said: What improved the farm system more this year - the draft or the prospects brought in by the FA signings and flipped? Interesting question. Short term - Trade deadline. Marathon analogy: All draft prospects start at the starting line while the traded guys the Tigers received 5 starting at Whitecaps or Erie (10 mile head start) and 2 at Toledo (15 mile head start) Long term - Draft. Harris seems to like drafting high upside guys out of high school and so far it seems to be working so by the time 2030 rolls around, I would say the draft has a few at MLB and most of the traded for guys won't pan out or will be off the roster by then. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 I have no problem with the collection of moves made at the deadline. However, the moves were made because this season has been a failure as have the last several sesons. I am not blaming Harris for that, but I do appreciate the honesty from the Toronto GM: https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/ross-atkins-apologizes-blue-jays-fans Quote “I’m disappointed that we’re here, it’s unacceptable that we’re here and I’m sorry to our fans for that,” said Atkins. The Blue Jays currently sit 50-58, last in the American League East and some 14 games off the division lead and nine points out of the final wildcard spot before August. The Jays made three moves on Tuesday, trading away Isiah Kiner-Falefa, Kevin Kiermaier, and Trevor Richards to close out a busy couple of weeks for the team. “We did not want to be at this point where we are, trading players away,” Atkins added. “It’s a disappointing time in my career and where we are as an organization, but we switched to getting better and switched to focusing on reshaping the group that is here, an already very talented group that we want to build around. We feel that we’ve done so, adding players who are close to the Major League or in the Major Leagues who can help us win more baseball games in the coming years.” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyMarsh Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 I don't know if he tried and there just weren't any trades in this regard that made sense for the Tigers but I wouldve liked to see them take on the Cubs approach. The Cubs sold players that weren't going to be there next year and threw into the towel on this year but were buyers on players that could help them next yr and beyond like Isaac Paredes. I feel like the Tigers are in a similar situation to them and are potentially close enough next year where they could've been buyers for players like that and still sold off guys like Flaherty and Chafin. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoomGaspar Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 Is there any indication yet of who will fill the empty roster spots, or even who is pitching tonight’s game? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 NObody's pitching tonight 🙂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BoomGaspar Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 1 minute ago, oblong said: NObody's pitching tonight 🙂 Good. That should save us some runs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1776 Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 From July 3rd through July 30th the Rays were moving salary and setting up for the trade deadline. Of the trades recorded in the above time frame, they received a total of 11 minor league prospects in return. Of these 11 minor league players, nine of them are now listed in the Top 30 Prospect list for the Rays organization. Not bad. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
syrett4 Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 9 minutes ago, 1776 said: From July 3rd through July 30th the Rays were moving salary and setting up for the trade deadline. Of the trades recorded in the above time frame, they received a total of 11 minor league prospects in return. Of these 11 minor league players, nine of them are now listed in the Top 30 Prospect list for the Rays organization. Not bad. Yeah they got a nice ROI on Austin Meadows to flip Paredes. How Tampa does this is impressive, but they always feel like they are the baseball version of day trading stocks and never really build a long-term team. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 41 minutes ago, syrett4 said: Yeah they got a nice ROI on Austin Meadows to flip Paredes. How Tampa does this is impressive, but they always feel like they are the baseball version of day trading stocks and never really build a long-term team. Yes, they are very impressive, but I wouldn't want the Tigers to emulate them too much for two reasons: (1) No other team has been able to do what they do (2) It wouldn't be that much fun to follow a team with no roster continuity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeattleMike Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 4 hours ago, AlaskanTigersFan said: It definitely is depressing..... Only one potential Above average player in our whole organization (and barely at that)........ Sheeeesh. MLB had us 5th to start the year: https://www.mlb.com/news/farm-system-rankings-2024-preseason And I believe MLB still ranks the Tigers system in the top 10. So does BA and the Athletic, I believe. Fangraphs seems a bit of an outlier. Seeing Sweeny ranked ahead of McGonigle stands out. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sports_Freak Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 14 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: Yes, they are very impressive, but I wouldn't want the Tigers to emulate them too much for two reasons: (1) No other team has been able to do what they do (2) It wouldn't be that much fun to follow a team with no roster continuity. There were a lot of fans cheering on Flaherty and Canha this season. They played for about 4 months in Detroit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenacious D Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 I like that we were able to get the only top 100 prospect that was dealt during the deadline. And were able to accomplish that moving someone that was perceived to be damaged goods. I’m curious if Sweeney is an upgrade to Kreidler or Leonard? Probably helps that he hits LH and has shown remarkable consistency with his BA and OPS the last few seasons (though not spectacular), while showing some HR pop and SB ability. He certainly has the pedigree as a 1st round pick and is only 24, so still young for AAA. Would be great if he could be the bridge at SS until McGonigle or Rainer are ready. Or be a more productive UT guy than McKinstry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeattleMike Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 Just now, Tenacious D said: I like that we were able to get the only top 100 prospect that was dealt during the deadline. And were able to accomplish that moving someone that was perceived to be damaged goods. I’m curious if Sweeney is an upgrade to Kreidler or Leonard? Probably helps that he hits LH and has shown remarkable consistency with his BA and OPS the last few seasons (though not spectacular), while showing some HR pop and SB ability. He certainly has the pedigree as a 1st round pick and is only 24, so still young for AAA. Would be great if he could be the bridge at SS until McGonigle or Rainer are ready. Or be a more productive UT guy than McKinstry. Sweeney has an OPS just shy of .900 against RHPs. .500 against LHPs. Sounds as though he is a below average SS (although opinions seem to differ) but I'd really like to see him platooned with Javy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
monkeytargets39 Posted July 31 Share Posted July 31 3 spots on the 40 man roster open by my count unless I’m missing something. Any reason not to add Jung and call him up and let him run at 3B so we can use Vierling more in LF/CF to help spell Riley? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.