LOCKOUT '22: When will we see baseball again?

[romad1]

The solution to kids not wanting to play baseball is to make basketball and the other sports worse.  Kids should be forced to play soccer in wooden clogs and basketball on ice.  

[CMRivdogs]

Or make crab soccer a lettered sport.

[1776]

16 hours ago, romad1 said:

 

I think the worry about African Americans being driven from the game by latter day Bull Connors at the MLB offices is a little overdone.  

I have no idea what inspired the above comment. Bull Conners!?!? Wow. I’ve never heard of any conversation anywhere regarding suspicions about MLB discouraging black kids from participating in the game. 

[CMRivdogs]

6 minutes ago, CMRivdogs said:

Or make crab soccer a lettered sport.

I just looked on line. They've wimped out the game

[romad1]

11 minutes ago, 1776 said:

I have no idea what inspired the above comment. Bull Conners!?!? Wow. I’ve never heard of any conversation anywhere regarding suspicions about MLB discouraging black kids from participating in the game. 

I was exaggerating strictly for fun.  

[Tiger337]

I remember playing crab soccer in gym class as a kid.  It was boring.  

[casimir]

Bring back Scooter the talking baseball.

[gehringer_2]

17 hours ago, RandyMarsh said:

Baseball not promoting its stars is one of their biggest problems, I will say they seemed to try to do that with Ohtani this year so perhaps they are learning. 

I just remember a couple years ago ESPN ran a fame 100 countdown where they ranked the 100 most famous athletes in the world based on things like social media followers,  google searches,  endorsement money etc. and iirc not a single baseball player made the list. 

two issues - one is that stars move around too much so their idea as belonging a certain context with a certain team can't get as well established, and secondarily, you have a big slice of the best players in an English speaking country whose 1st language is Spanish. Look at Cabrera - he loves to talk to the press - the Spanish speaking press. Given his personality he would be much bigger local celebrity figure and that would perculate outward -  if he did his media work in English. The why's get complicated but the outcomes are what they are.

[CMRivdogs]

25 minutes ago, Tiger337 said:

I remember playing crab soccer in gym class as a kid.  It was boring.  

If it's the game I just saw in youtube I agree. The way we played in the mid '60 was the reason they invented cups.

[buddha]

1 hour ago, Tiger337 said:

I was hoping seven inning games and free baserunners were going solve the problem.  

pitch clocks and requiring batters to stay in the box solves the problem.  everybody knows it, but they cant get the players to do it.

[Jim Cowan]

Just go back to the ball that was used in the mid 1980's (not 1987).  All the other problems, including the shift, are solved.

[John_Brian_K]

32 minutes ago, buddha said:

pitch clocks and requiring batters to stay in the box solves the problem.  everybody knows it, but they cant get the players to do it.

The step out every pitch is maddening IMO. Readjust the gloves etc..

[davidsb623]

38 minutes ago, buddha said:

pitch clocks and requiring batters to stay in the box solves the problem.  everybody knows it, but they cant get the players to do it.

Want to shorten the game by 30-45 minutes?  Maybe longer?  Reduce the 4-5 minute commercial breaks between every half inning to a minute each.  

[buddha]

i remember an experiment done not so long ago from a game in the 80s and a game in the 10s to see why the game in the 10s was taking an hour longer.  the finding was that it was almost exclusively due to pitching changes and the time in between pitches.  advertising has always existed.

go back and watch a game from the 60s or 70s.  get ball pitch ball.  get in the box and stay there.  its a remarkably faster game and much easier to watch.

[oblong]

they need to make the players hit fewer foul balls.

 

[Tiger337]

1 hour ago, buddha said:

i remember an experiment done not so long ago from a game in the 80s and a game in the 10s to see why the game in the 10s was taking an hour longer.  the finding was that it was almost exclusively due to pitching changes and the time in between pitches.  advertising has always existed.

go back and watch a game from the 60s or 70s.  get ball pitch ball.  get in the box and stay there.  its a remarkably faster game and much easier to watch.

As much as I hate an kind of advertisement, I agree they are not really the problem.  The problem is not the length of games, but the pace of games.  The delays between pitches slow down the pace considerably.  

[buddha]

Just now, Tiger337 said:

As much as I hate an kind of advertisement, I agree they are not really the problem.  The problem is not the length of games, but the pace of games.  The delays between pitches slow down the pace considerably.  

i blame the players but ultimately it is management's responsibility.  if you put in requisite penalties the players will adjust.  if you let then do whatever they want, they will do whatever they want and take their own sweet time at the plate and on the mound.

current leadership is at least trying to look into incentives to speed things up and are experimenting in the minors.  that's a good thing.  they hired theo to help and he's a smart guy with baseball's best interests in mind.  that's another good thing.  and while i'm interested in seeing how their tweaks play in the minors, it still feels like they are messing around on the margins rather than dealing with the issue directly.

put a fucking pitch clock out there and if they dont throw it in 15 seconds call a ball.  of the batter steps out of the box once they step in its a strike.  the players will bitch.  player slappy reporters will complain.  those complaints will be echoed here by the usual union apologists.  so be it.  they will adapt and it will become a part of the game.

you want to watch a boring game?  go watch basketball before the shot clock.  or try to watch a college football game with 5 minutes of commercials after every other play.  baseball can be quick and exciting if we let it.

we just need to let it.

[CMRivdogs]

I thought the 1968 ACC final was quite entertaining in a weird way

[Tenacious D]

4 hours ago, Tigeraholic1 said:

My son has played baseball every year since he was 4 (13 now). Quit after last year and wants to play AAU summer basketball. Said baseball is boring, kinda broke my heart.....

Had the same experience with my son.  Overzealous travel coaches, incompetent high school coaches and the grind that goes with travel sucked all of the fun out if it for him.

[Tigeraholic1]

21 minutes ago, Tenacious D said:

Had the same experience with my son.  Overzealous travel coaches, incompetent high school coaches and the grind that goes with travel sucked all of the fun out if it for him.

In our house ball league a few of the players parents were running the league/board. They would bend and fold the rules to make sure their kids were on certain teams and crap like that. Each of the last 3-4 years the league has shrunk from angry parents. They are talking about changing the bylaws so board members can't coach or have a kid in the league. I doubt it will change.

Travel ball was a better experience for him. Good coaches and kids who did not mouth off.

Edited January 11, 2022 by Tigeraholic1

[buddha]

48 minutes ago, CMRivdogs said:

I thought the 1968 ACC final was quite entertaining in a weird way

masochist

[gehringer_2]

3 hours ago, davidsb623 said:

Want to shorten the game by 30-45 minutes?  Maybe longer?  Reduce the 4-5 minute commercial breaks between every half inning to a minute each.  

actually inning breaks in games are the one thing under pretty good control. In innings when they don't sweep the IF they hold it pretty close to 2 min, you can even watch the timer in the ballpark. A number of years ago they had drifted up to 3. The big items are batter step outs, high pitch counts and pitchers that slow to a crawl when men are on base.

[RandyMarsh]

Batter step outs are definitely the biggest thing or atleast what I notice most. The past 10 years or so I would occasionally watch games on the internet from the 70s or early 80s which is a little before my time  and the lack of step outs was the first thing I noticed.

Ive basically had to deal with it to some extent my whole viewing life so it's something I never paid attention to until after watching old games and seeing how quick things would go between pitches. 

[buddha]

1 minute ago, RandyMarsh said:

Batter step outs are definitely the biggest thing or atleast what I notice most. The past 10 years or so I would occasionally watch games on the internet from the 70s or early 80s which is a little before my time  and the lack of step outs was the first thing I noticed.

Ive basically had to deal with it to some extent my whole viewing life so it's something I never paid attention to until after watching old games and seeing how quick things would go between pitches. 

its striking how quickly the game used to move.  pitchers got the ball and threw it.  you didnt have to walk around the mound, tug your hat three times, and shake off ten pitches.

[chasfh]

3 hours ago, Jim Cowan said:

Just go back to the ball that was used in the mid 1980's (not 1987).  All the other problems, including the shift, are solved.

You're playing my song. How many years have you guys heard me advocating the idea that deadening the ball will solve practically every problem in the game that has evolved since Chicks Dig The Long Ball started?

The reason is simple: pitchers are afraid of giving up home runs. So pitchers have to be super careful to every hitter in the order, because every hitter can take them out of the park. They are trying to induce swing-and-miss on every pitch with maximum velocity and movement, so they end up throwing more pitches per plate appearance and taking more time in between pitches to maximize the gathering of their strength. That might be layering an extra half hour onto game time all by itself. But batters are still trying to jack the ball, which means they're always trying to pull it over the fence, so the shift makes sense to employ on most hitters.

Deaden the ball to 1980s-level, and you'll have fewer homers, which means pitchers can pitch to contact, which means batters would need to hit 'em where they ain't instead of hit 'em over their heads, which will eliminate the shift on all but the scariest power hitters. there would be fewer homers, fewer strikeouts, more balls in play, more action on batted balls. I bet fans would come back to see that.