LOCKOUT '22: When will we see baseball again?

[4hzglory]

2 minutes ago, buddha said:

you'll still get paid and still get a bonus if you get drafted.

And from the initial reports, the first picks bonus was higher than any bonus received from this year's signing period.   They were set bonuses based on slot, but overall the bonuses to all drafted international players were for more $ than the $ paid to the same amount of players in the last international period.

[gehringer_2]

1 minute ago, buddha said:

you'll still get paid and still get a bonus if you get drafted.

I could understand the idea that if the academies are getting a cut now that might go away in a draft system and that could reduce the funds available for the instructional system, but if that's the issue why are Abreu and Guillen on the other side? Not arguing here, just trying to understand the issues a bit.

[4hzglory]

https://www.mlb.com/news/international-draft-cba-negotiations

 

So the aggregate bonus & for the 20 round international draft (600 players) is more than was spent on over 1000 players in the last period prior to the pandemic.  So the international prospects would actually get more $ overall.  No team could pass on a selection.  They expect $21-23 million more to be spent on international players with this system.

[4hzglory]

4 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

I could understand the idea that if the academies are getting a cut now that might go away in a draft system and that could reduce the funds available for the instructional system, but if that's the issue why are Abreu and Guillen on the other side? Not arguing here, just trying to understand the issues a bit.

And the trainer quoted in the article (from MLB so take that with a grain of salt) is for the draft.

[Tiger337]

 

 

[Tigermojo]

14 hours ago, Tenacious D said:

I bet we’re getting this $&@%er

 

"Hot and ready" on the back of every player's jersey.

[KL2]

https://knewz.com/knewz-exclusive-minor-league-teams-says-it-found-out-it-was-cut-by-press-release-sues-team-and-baseball/

 

 

[Tiger337]

1 hour ago, KL2 said:

https://knewz.com/knewz-exclusive-minor-league-teams-says-it-found-out-it-was-cut-by-press-release-sues-team-and-baseball/

 

 

Norwich, CT was one of my favorite minor league locales, so I was disappointed to see them go.  I know they won't get their team back, but go get em Norwich!   

[1776]

2 hours ago, KL2 said:

https://knewz.com/knewz-exclusive-minor-league-teams-says-it-found-out-it-was-cut-by-press-release-sues-team-and-baseball/

 

 

“The Norwich team was based in Oneonta, New York, and was affiliated with the Boston Red Sox and New York Yankees before the Detroit Tigers.”

Confusing. Back in 2005, or thereabouts, we saw the Oneonta Tigers play in Oneonta. They relocated out of Oneonta but the quote above says they were based in Oneonta? As I recall the owner at the time sold the team to someone else with the understanding the team would stay in Oneonta. Then, after the sale, the team was moved against his wishes.
 

I also recall there were no alcohol sales at the game. My friend and I bought a 12 pack of Blue Moon and left it in his vehicle in the parking lot. The place was very casual and you go in and out of the park as long as you showed your ticket upon re-entering. Between innings we’d go out and have a beer and come back as play was resuming. 
Beautiful country there.

[CMRivdogs]

 

[KL2]

37 minutes ago, 1776 said:

“The Norwich team was based in Oneonta, New York, and was affiliated with the Boston Red Sox and New York Yankees before the Detroit Tigers.”

Confusing. Back in 2005, or thereabouts, we saw the Oneonta Tigers play in Oneonta. They relocated out of Oneonta but the quote above says they were based in Oneonta? As I recall the owner at the time sold the team to someone else with the understanding the team would stay in Oneonta. Then, after the sale, the team was moved against his wishes.
 

I also recall there were no alcohol sales at the game. My friend and I bought a 12 pack of Blue Moon and left it in his vehicle in the parking lot. The place was very casual and you go in and out of the park as long as you showed your ticket upon re-entering. Between innings we’d go out and have a beer and come back as play was resuming. 
Beautiful country there.

They moved but yhe parent company is currently the Oneonta baseball team llc or something like that.

 

I wrote it.

[Tiger337]

55 minutes ago, 1776 said:

“The Norwich team was based in Oneonta, New York, and was affiliated with the Boston Red Sox and New York Yankees before the Detroit Tigers.”

Confusing. Back in 2005, or thereabouts, we saw the Oneonta Tigers play in Oneonta. They relocated out of Oneonta but the quote above says they were based in Oneonta? As I recall the owner at the time sold the team to someone else with the understanding the team would stay in Oneonta. Then, after the sale, the team was moved against his wishes.
 

I also recall there were no alcohol sales at the game. My friend and I bought a 12 pack of Blue Moon and left it in his vehicle in the parking lot. The place was very casual and you go in and out of the park as long as you showed your ticket upon re-entering. Between innings we’d go out and have a beer and come back as play was resuming. 
Beautiful country there.

I saw them in Oneonta too.  It was definitely a unique environment. 

http://www.detroittigertales.com/2008/08/back-from-oneonta.html

[1776]

Opening Day moved back to at least April 14th. No agreement.

[Tigeraholic1]

Just saw Jon Morosi on MLB Network say they are still negotiating tonight.

[1776]

https://www.mlb.com/news/mlb-cba-negotiations-update

If they can still pull something out of the hat I’m all for it but…

Edited March 10, 2022 by 1776

[1776]

[chasfh]

If true, then holy shit.

From the article:

Remember how the MLBPA was expecting a full counterproposal to its Wednesday afternoon proposal? MLB came back, instead, with three options for how to table the draft conversation.

They indicated that they would not talk about anything else until the MLBPA agreed to one of the three options. All those things that were close and could have been hammered out suddenly went out the window. 

The MLBPA came back with its own option. 

Manfred and his owners didn’t respond to that option. Instead, they canceled more games. 

No, really, that’s how it all went down, according to multiple reports. And that’s the stupidest thing of this whole stupid lockout. Seven more days and 93 more games were canceled because the MLB owners and MLB players could not agree on how to table an issue that both wanted to table.

It boggles the mind. MLB could have just said, “You know what? We’re so close and we want baseball to start again, so let’s agree on everything else and we’ll take up this discussion when we’ve both have time to focus solely on this very complicated issue.” 

But that’s not what happened. The owners added strings. They refused to consider input from the other side. They told the players, “It’s one of our options or nothing.” 

And then, they canceled games. Again, because they couldn’t agree with the MLBPA on how to table the issue. I keep thinking that if I type that sentence over and over, it’ll make sense. They couldn’t agree on how to table an issue, so the owners canceled seven more days and 93 more games. 

Yep, this really is the stupidest moment of this whole stupid lockout, and I’m not sure there’s a close second. 

[mtutiger]

5 hours ago, 1776 said:

“The Norwich team was based in Oneonta, New York, and was affiliated with the Boston Red Sox and New York Yankees before the Detroit Tigers.”

Confusing. Back in 2005, or thereabouts, we saw the Oneonta Tigers play in Oneonta. They relocated out of Oneonta but the quote above says they were based in Oneonta? As I recall the owner at the time sold the team to someone else with the understanding the team would stay in Oneonta. Then, after the sale, the team was moved against his wishes.
 

I also recall there were no alcohol sales at the game. My friend and I bought a 12 pack of Blue Moon and left it in his vehicle in the parking lot. The place was very casual and you go in and out of the park as long as you showed your ticket upon re-entering. Between innings we’d go out and have a beer and come back as play was resuming. 
Beautiful country there.

I went to a game there in 2008 while spending a summer working in Binghamton... most rustic baseball experience ever.

[oblong]

1 hour ago, chasfh said:

If true, then holy shit.

From the article:

Remember how the MLBPA was expecting a full counterproposal to its Wednesday afternoon proposal? MLB came back, instead, with three options for how to table the draft conversation.

They indicated that they would not talk about anything else until the MLBPA agreed to one of the three options. All those things that were close and could have been hammered out suddenly went out the window. 

The MLBPA came back with its own option. 

Manfred and his owners didn’t respond to that option. Instead, they canceled more games. 

No, really, that’s how it all went down, according to multiple reports. And that’s the stupidest thing of this whole stupid lockout. Seven more days and 93 more games were canceled because the MLB owners and MLB players could not agree on how to table an issue that both wanted to table.

It boggles the mind. MLB could have just said, “You know what? We’re so close and we want baseball to start again, so let’s agree on everything else and we’ll take up this discussion when we’ve both have time to focus solely on this very complicated issue.” 

But that’s not what happened. The owners added strings. They refused to consider input from the other side. They told the players, “It’s one of our options or nothing.” 

And then, they canceled games. Again, because they couldn’t agree with the MLBPA on how to table the issue. I keep thinking that if I type that sentence over and over, it’ll make sense. They couldn’t agree on how to table an issue, so the owners canceled seven more days and 93 more games. 

Yep, this really is the stupidest moment of this whole stupid lockout, and I’m not sure there’s a close second. 

It’s almost like the owners don’t really care if there’s baseball in April.  They pulled a Lucy. 
 

 

[Tigermojo]

The owners keep trying to add something new every time. "I guess we could add more money for that but you have to wash our cars every weekend."

Where did that come from? If that's something you wanted, why wasn't it in the discussion from the very beginning? It looked like things could have been settled by now if they didn't keep trying to add something which hasn't been discussed. Then the players have to take time for all of them to get on the same page for the new item.

I thought they were close but the owners keep changing the fine print and that is very shady on their part.

[Longgone]

6 hours ago, Tigermojo said:

The owners keep trying to add something new every time. "I guess we could add more money for that but you have to wash our cars every weekend."

Where did that come from? If that's something you wanted, why wasn't it in the discussion from the very beginning? It looked like things could have been settled by now if they didn't keep trying to add something which hasn't been discussed. Then the players have to take time for all of them to get on the same page for the new item.

I thought they were close but the owners keep changing the fine print and that is very shady on their part.

I dont know where this comes from, the international draft has been on the table from the beginning, it wasn't introduced "last minute". Tying it to draft pick compensation may have been last minute, however, but every ask has a quid pro quo, and the deal should be evaluated in it's totality.

[Biff Mayhem]

11 hours ago, chasfh said:

If true, then holy shit.

From the article:

Remember how the MLBPA was expecting a full counterproposal to its Wednesday afternoon proposal? MLB came back, instead, with three options for how to table the draft conversation.

They indicated that they would not talk about anything else until the MLBPA agreed to one of the three options. All those things that were close and could have been hammered out suddenly went out the window. 

The MLBPA came back with its own option. 

Manfred and his owners didn’t respond to that option. Instead, they canceled more games. 

No, really, that’s how it all went down, according to multiple reports. And that’s the stupidest thing of this whole stupid lockout. Seven more days and 93 more games were canceled because the MLB owners and MLB players could not agree on how to table an issue that both wanted to table.

It boggles the mind. MLB could have just said, “You know what? We’re so close and we want baseball to start again, so let’s agree on everything else and we’ll take up this discussion when we’ve both have time to focus solely on this very complicated issue.” 

But that’s not what happened. The owners added strings. They refused to consider input from the other side. They told the players, “It’s one of our options or nothing.” 

And then, they canceled games. Again, because they couldn’t agree with the MLBPA on how to table the issue. I keep thinking that if I type that sentence over and over, it’ll make sense. They couldn’t agree on how to table an issue, so the owners canceled seven more days and 93 more games. 

Yep, this really is the stupidest moment of this whole stupid lockout, and I’m not sure there’s a close second. 

It's like a bad SNL skit.

[chasfh]

Another view: “OK, now it’s Players’ fault.”

 

[sabretooth]

Why do I get the feeling that the owners want to shed themselves of unprofitable early-season games

[oblong]

7 minutes ago, sabretooth said:

Why do I get the feeling that the owners want to shed themselves of unprofitable early-season games

because they do.  This costs them nothing.  They can be firm right now with no risk.