casimir Posted August 20 Share Posted August 20 I doubt Verlander would want to remove himself from the rotation, but that'd be a fun end of game arm to watch and exactly what the Tigers could use. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Timmitch55 Posted August 20 Share Posted August 20 8 hours ago, oblong said: If JV coming back is “cost free” then fine. But every team has a budget. Verlander would be the highest paid player on the team unless they extend Skubal. Gotta sign Tarik first. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenacious D Posted August 20 Share Posted August 20 3 hours ago, Timmitch55 said: Gotta sign Tarik first. There is so much money that can be spent. I think the only contracts of significance are Baez and Maeda, whose expires after 2025. And contrary to popular belief, Ilitch is willing to spend. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 i dont get the worry about not signing a free agent because we have to sign skubal. the tigers payroll is next to nil. they have a lot of room to sign whatever aging player they want. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RatkoVarda Posted August 21 Share Posted August 21 they can add 100M to the 2025 payroll and still not be in the top 15 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 I think the chances we sign JV or Max is zero. Harris has a plan. I feel positive that signing gimpy over-40 players when your team haven’t played even .500 ball in eight years is not part of it. I doubt overpaying over-30 players, impact or not, is part of that plan either. If we had six positions and the majority of the rotation filled, maybe. But we’d have a hell of a time trying to talk most guys into coming to Detroit if they have other options. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graterol Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 I’m sure this has been discussed, but has Carpenter ever played 1B? There is no way Tork can be counted on next year. It would open up an expanded role for Ibanez and Vierling. And Carp certainly can’t be worse on D than Tork. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 9 hours ago, Graterol said: I’m sure this has been discussed, but has Carpenter ever played 1B? There is no way Tork can be counted on next year. It would open up an expanded role for Ibanez and Vierling. And Carp certainly can’t be worse on D than Tork. Carp’s stick as currently constructed certainly plays at first, although we seem to have a lot of guys left over from the Avila administration who are on track to end up at first sooner than later, so there will be lots of competition for that in the next year or two. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdog Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 I'm requesting that Harris and Ilitch divert a little bit from their risk profile to get a real impact right handed bat. Make a trade and ship off excess prospect inventory to get a guy who will help you next year. I don't want to hear about blocking prospects. They aren't all going to work out..as we have seen. And they have to figure out a solution for SS. Henning seems to think that they are going to dump Baez's money. But I have my doubts. Even if you do that, you need an actual option to play the position. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graterol Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 36 minutes ago, kdog said: I'm requesting that Harris and Ilitch divert a little bit from their risk profile to get a real impact right handed bat. Make a trade and ship off excess prospect inventory to get a guy who will help you next year. I don't want to hear about blocking prospects. They aren't all going to work out..as we have seen. And they have to figure out a solution for SS. Henning seems to think that they are going to dump Baez's money. But I have my doubts. Even if you do that, you need an actual option to play the position. I don’t understand why so many people fail to grasp the idea of a sunk cost. Baez should not be on this team next year. Even eating his salary, the payroll is low. They definitely should be signing one impact bat from Adames, Kim, Alonso, Bellinger, etc. And with holes at 1B and SS and some positional flex with guys like Vierling they won’t be blocking anyone if they do sign a FA. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1776 Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 (edited) 41 minutes ago, kdog said: And they have to figure out a solution for SS. Henning seems to think that they are going to dump Baez's money. But I have my doubts. Even if you do that, you need an actual option to play the position. Over the past several weeks I’m coming around to the belief that they may cut ties with Baez beyond this year. As recently as the AS break I wouldn’t have given it a chance and commented as much here. After watching him flail away Tuesday night, as he’s done all season long, I realize there is no way you can have that bat in a lineup that is seriously competing for a playoff spot. I wondered if they’d wait until the end of spring training next year to see if things would be different? Maybe some closely supervised things in the offseason? I don’t know the nitty gritty of his contract so I don’t know if bringing him to spring training would be a problem, any more than it already is, and then cutting him as opposed to parting ways at the end of this season. I’m a Baez fan until he picks up a bat and then I just cringe. Edited August 22 by 1776 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 1 hour ago, Graterol said: I don’t understand why so many people fail to grasp the idea of a sunk cost. Baez should not be on this team next year. Even eating his salary, the payroll is low. They definitely should be signing one impact bat from Adames, Kim, Alonso, Bellinger, etc. And with holes at 1B and SS and some positional flex with guys like Vierling they won’t be blocking anyone if they do sign a FA. If they had someone better than Baez to play short, Baez would be gone now. Maybe Trey Sweeney is that guy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RatkoVarda Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 Baez will not finish his contract in Det obviously. Sweeney is interesting. Gage Workman looks like he could play some type of ML role. But Baez is in the mix until Harris gets 2 shortstops who are better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RatkoVarda Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 1 hour ago, Graterol said: I don’t understand why so many people fail to grasp the idea of a sunk cost. Baez should not be on this team next year. Even eating his salary, the payroll is low. They definitely should be signing one impact bat from Adames, Kim, Alonso, Bellinger, etc. And with holes at 1B and SS and some positional flex with guys like Vierling they won’t be blocking anyone if they do sign a FA. I cannot see them spending $50M on the SS position. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 (edited) 1 hour ago, Graterol said: .... They definitely should be signing one impact bat from Adames, Kim, Alonso, Bellinger, etc. And with holes at 1B and SS and some positional flex with guys like Vierling they won’t be blocking anyone if they do sign a FA. My thoughts on SS (for anyone's comments... Graterol I'm just using your comments here as a starting point...): Sweeney against RH'ers - yes, OK. He looked fine on the field from what little I saw... maybe he has range limitations? But also... maybe he could be the full-time starter there. I'm definitely penciling him in for 2025, and, if his bat plays at a high-level... I think he will be playing at least against RH'ers and in 50% (or more) of 2025 games as a starter. Baez. Whether Sweeney starts against righties only and platoons with Baez, or proves himself a capable full-time starter and Hinch decides to use Baez instead as a RH'ed McKinstry (defensive replacement for Sweeney as needed... all the way up to the RH'ed side of a platoon with Sweeney, plus Baez is also a capable fielder at 2B and 3B IIRC, and can also play the OF...). There's at least an argument that Baez could stick with the team next year. I'm not saying it's a good solution or argument... I'm just saying there's some logic there (call it faulty logic if you will... but still...). If the Org decides to dump Baez (salary is a sunk cost so we're paying it whether he is, or is not, with the team...) because they just want to find a better player... I don't think anyone will shed any tears. Which leads to... Internal or External options: Internal options are... not great. Andrew Navigato, RH'er, AAA - plays all over the field but I don't believe is a good enough fielder at SS for him to be a realistic option there. Could replace McKinstry anyways if they were looking to add a RH'ed bench guy that can play a lot of positions. Could he be any worse? Kreidler, RH'er, AAA - supposed to have a great glove at SS and has some power (but doesn't make enough contact to get to it that often) but, so far in MLB.. has proven to be a subpar solution. Eddys Leonard, RH'er, AAA - an unknown to me. He's played mostly SS in the minors, but also 2B/ 3B/ and some OF... but I don't know how his fielding is viewed, or whether he would have enough MLB bat to platoon with Sweeney, or just be a defensive replacement as needed, and be more of a RH'ed McKinstry? If Baez is dumped... He at least tosses his hat into the ring. Gage Workman, LH'er, AA - Also supposed to be a great glove at SS, has also played some 2B/ 3B/ OF in the minors... also has power but doesn't make enough contact to get to it often enough... But as a LH'ed Kreidler 2.0... I don't think he fits the need of trying to get a RH'ed bat to play opposite Sweeney. I think he plays in Toledo next year. Trei Cruz, Switch-hitter, AA - Played all over as has everyone else... has bloodlines (Jose Cruz grandfather and Jose Cruz Jr. father)... but hasn't shown enough yet to say he's a good option. He's a few steps behind Workman so that's saying something. Still, if it's only to be a defensive replacement for Sweeney, possibly up to a RH'ed platoon... He may also at least have his hat in the ring next year in spring training and from my viewpoint: I'll just say "anything could happen". Everyone else internally is too further back to be a viable 2025 option, IMO. External options, if we want better options from the Right-side in 2025, I believe we would have to look externally. But I don't see a need to go out and sign a huge contract SS. Someone for 2 years or 3 at most I would think is what Harris would be looking for, at a reasonable cost. So... : Ha-Seong Kim, RH'ed, 4 years with Padres - We'd have to trade for him, but a great option. But would the Padres even be willing to trade him? At what cost? I don't think the Padres will entertain offers for him so moot point IMO. Unless we find out otherwise. Adames, RH'ed, Brewers - is he a FA this year? Here's the problem: How do you sign him away from the Brewers, who are a playoff team? It's hard to walk away from that, and it can't just be "money" as the reason. Money doesn't trump winning, so something else will also be needed to entice. Bo Bichette - it might be possible to talk the Blue Jays into trading Bichette (Not a FA until after 2025), he'd be a good "recovery" option and fine at SS for at least 2025... Maybe more if things work out... And I don't think the trade cost would be prohibitive.. we would just need to match up with what the Blue Jays would want... I think Bichette is the best option, IMO. And as for Bellinger or Alonso types...? I don't think we sign another 1B'man until the Tork situation plays out, at least through 2025... for better or for worse... And the internal positioning is figured out (let's say for example, Hao Yu Lee is brought up to be the 2B'man, and Keith is shifted to 1B... just to use one example...). Edited August 22 by 1984Echoes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RatkoVarda Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 2 hours ago, kdog said: I'm requesting that Harris and Ilitch divert a little bit from their risk profile to get a real impact right handed bat. Make a trade and ship off excess prospect inventory to get a guy who will help you next year. I don't want to hear about blocking prospects. They aren't all going to work out..as we have seen. And they have to figure out a solution for SS. Henning seems to think that they are going to dump Baez's money. But I have my doubts. Even if you do that, you need an actual option to play the position. Christian Encarnacion-Strand would an interesting addition. Out with a bad wrist, huge RH power, not great defender but plays 3b and 1b. Would be back up plan for both Jung and Tork. And if everyone hits, then great. Have CES, Jung, Keith and Tork in a round robin of 3b, 2b, 1b and DH. Malloy + some arms? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graterol Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 1 hour ago, RatkoVarda said: I cannot see them spending $50M on the SS position. It’s a sunk cost. It doesnt matter. If you have $40 mil of new dollars to spend on position players (making up a number), where is the best bang for your buck giving our existing roster. It would be at SS and 1B most likely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RatkoVarda Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 1 minute ago, Graterol said: It’s a sunk cost. It doesnt matter. If you have $40 mil of new dollars to spend on position players (making up a number), where is the best bang for your buck giving our existing roster. It would be at SS and 1B most likely. you are absolutely correct - and I don't think they are going to spend $50M at one position Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sports_Freak Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 6 minutes ago, Graterol said: It’s a sunk cost. It doesnt matter. If you have $40 mil of new dollars to spend on position players (making up a number), where is the best bang for your buck giving our existing roster. It would be at SS and 1B most likely. Unless you want to eliminate salary. Then you just trade away salary and replace them with a Toledo player. Just call it an evaluation...every year... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edman85 Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 On the topic of saving money, very preliminary calculations show Riley Greene being well short of arbitration status. Your arb guys this year are... Tarik Skubal Casey Mize (if option declined) Jake Rogers Will Vest Zach McKinstry Jason Foley Matt Vierling Andy Ibanez Beau Brieske (probably) Riley Greene (doubtful) Akil Baddoo (if he spends three more days in MLB) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigermojo Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 10 minutes ago, Edman85 said: On the topic of saving money, very preliminary calculations show Riley Greene being well short of arbitration status. Your arb guys this year are... Tarik Skubal Casey Mize (if option declined) Jake Rogers Will Vest Zach McKinstry Jason Foley Matt Vierling Andy Ibanez Beau Brieske (probably) Riley Greene (doubtful) Akil Baddoo (if he spends three more days in MLB) Do you think Mize's option is worth it or will they try to save money in arbitration? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edman85 Posted August 22 Share Posted August 22 21 minutes ago, Tigermojo said: Do you think Mize's option is worth it or will they try to save money in arbitration? I don't think he pitched well enough this year to earn his option in arbitration and the option will be declined. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motor City Sonics Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 SS- I can't handle the thought of another year with Baez. They need a two-year solution until Kevin McGonigle is ready (hopefully) Willy Adames will want a long term (and probably close to 20 mil a year to play here) I think Amed Rosario might be an answer. Good defensive player, can hit better than .200, which puts him over the Javy Line. He won't want a ton of money and you can probably sign him to a year or two. Just not Javy. I think the team we're seeing right now (position players) is a preview OF - Carpenter-Meadows-Greene INF-Tork-Keith-Jung C- Rogers-Dingler Bench - Vierling-Ibanez-Perez-Sweeney Just need a starting SS or a platoon with Sweeney. Now pitching is a whole 'nother story. What is Reese Olson's status? Mize should be back. Will Manning even be in the picture next year? What to do with Kenta - just buy him out? I don't see Jackson Jobe in the rotation in April. Ty Madden and Wilmer Flores are dropping like stones. I'm sure we'll see two free agent starting pitchers again - probably C-level. Who knows what they do with Tarik. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 20 hours ago, Edman85 said: I don't think he pitched well enough this year to earn his option in arbitration and the option will be declined. It's dumb system system. The Arbs seem to have established a seniority based scale with close to zero consideration of a player's actual worth. All it does is create more player movement without actually benefiting players. If the Tigers decline - the odds Casey can get on the open market anywhere near the amount an Arbitrator would award have to be about nil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted August 23 Share Posted August 23 20 hours ago, Edman85 said: I don't think he pitched well enough this year to earn his option in arbitration and the option will be declined. What is the implication of this? Would Mize become a free agent and the Tigers lose all rights of control? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.