Motor City Sonics Posted March 13 Posted March 13 (edited) 3 hours ago, Jim Cowan said: Reno Bertoia! DING ! I was in 10th or 11th grade. As big a Tiger fan as I was, I had never heard of him, but he played before I was born and he was basically Zack McKinstry. I remember him being nice, but he was kind of a depressed guy. Edited March 13 by Motor City Sonics Quote
Motor City Sonics Posted March 13 Posted March 13 1 hour ago, SoCalTiger said: Why keep McStinky ? Just let Jung and Tork play in Detroit at least they have potential upside. This love for mcStinky to the point of loosing young players seems counter productive to me. Because McStinky can play in the OF. If only J-Hen could play Center, but since he can't play Left or Right, I'm thinking it's a non-starter 1 Quote
casimir Posted March 13 Posted March 13 1 hour ago, SoCalTiger said: Why keep McStinky ? Just let Jung and Tork play in Detroit at least they have potential upside. This love for mcStinky to the point of loosing young players seems counter productive to me. I think his OF versatility keeps him on the roster until Meadows/Vierling return. McKinstry might not play CF or he might only play it in a pinch, but we know every position player on this roster not named Greene or Torres is a platoon player. With Torres playing only 2B, with Keith not really being that versatile, and with possible non gloves like Malloy/Torkelson making the roster, McKInstry' versatility is an asset for the time being. 1 Quote
gehringer_2 Posted March 13 Posted March 13 (edited) I think Jung starts in Toledo - he's not doing enough to make the team. Sweeney and Javy are the left side until one of them plays his way out of a job. Baez is back to having some XBH pop - that's what they were hoping for. It may not last but I think what he's doing to far is earning him a starting spot on a provisional basis. With Vierling and Meadows down, DH is available for Tork with Carpenter in the field. If Tork is still hitting when Meadows comes back, they'll cross that bridge then. If he isn't it's an easy decision. Edited March 13 by gehringer_2 Quote
Jim Cowan Posted March 13 Posted March 13 1 hour ago, casimir said: Good pull. I was going to guess it was a guy named Pierre or Garth. I never thought about someone from Italy. When he said Windsor I had it all the way, didn't need the other clues! He's before my time but I always knew the name. Quote
TigerNation Posted March 14 Posted March 14 2 hours ago, SoCalTiger said: Why keep McStinky ? Just let Jung and Tork play in Detroit at least they have potential upside. This love for mcStinky to the point of loosing young players seems counter productive to me. They are neither loosing nor losing young players because of McStinky. They aren't competing for the same roster spot. It's better for Jung to get everyday ABs in AAA than have McStinkys bench role in the majors. 1 2 Quote
papalawrence Posted March 14 Posted March 14 1 hour ago, Motor City Sonics said: DING ! I was in 10th or 11th grade. As big a Tiger fan as I was, I had never heard of him, but he played before I was born and he was basically Zack McKinstry. I remember him being nice, but he was kind of a depressed guy. My father had a scrapbook of the 1955 Tigers so I learned about Bertoria over 50 years ago. My brother snagged the scrapbook and has it now. I used to collect cards of the players in the scrapbook, including Tiger opponents. A '55 topps bertoria was one of them. I remember liking the name Bullet Bob Turley so I had several of his cards. 1 Quote
KL2 Posted March 14 Posted March 14 10 hours ago, chasfh said: I think it's possible Tork's on the block. Doubt it. Only cause spring training trades are crazy rare and anyone who is moved sucks and if you get anything out of them its just a fluke (nyjer morgan anyone). Teams spend all offseason prepping their teams and getting the guys they like/want/afford in place. Unlikely teams are gonna make a change at at the 1130th hour for some other team cast off. Plus nobody is gonna give up much knowing guy X isn't good enough for your team. Especially not an unproven guy like Tork. Why would any team say give up a decent pitching prospect for a guy who already has his clock going that has major league struggles and the Tigers replaced? So your just getting crap back. Be better just to keep him. Quote
gehringer_2 Posted March 14 Posted March 14 3 hours ago, davidsb623 said: I think Colt Keith should be taking reps at 3B, 1B should be Tork's as long as he continues to produce. They seem dead set against that. I give them a strong benefit of the doubt that the docs have mandated that - because if even if Tork weren't a factor, it would seem pretty dumb not to explore that. Quote
monkeytargets39 Posted March 14 Posted March 14 I’m guessing- c- Rogers/Dingler inf- Keith, Torres, Ibanez, Baez, Sweeney, Torkelson of- Greene, Carpenter, Perez, Malloy, McKinstry If Meadows is a go then it gets interesting. Malloy and Tork make sense as pinch hitters for Carp and Keith…..but Perez is a lot more versatile. Quote
Toddwert Posted March 14 Posted March 14 12 hours ago, gehringer_2 said: They seem dead set against that. I give them a strong benefit of the doubt that the docs have mandated that - because if even if Tork weren't a factor, it would seem pretty dumb not to explore that. Keith screwed up his shoulder a couple years ago and i dont think he can throw 3rd to 1st... atleast the last i heard Quote
gehringer_2 Posted March 14 Posted March 14 17 minutes ago, Toddwert said: Keith screwed up his shoulder a couple years ago and i dont think he can throw 3rd to 1st... atleast the last i heard by the 2nd half of last season his throws on the DP seemed to be picking up and were very accurate. Statcast only aggregates the whole season but Colt's maximum throws last season at 2b would be a little below average throws for a 3b, so he's not far off, but it could certainly be as much a matter of the re-injury risk going up if he pushes it that hard more often as would be required at 3b. Quote
Tiger337 Posted March 14 Posted March 14 I am less excited about Keith as a 1B than at 2B. Short term, positions don't matter much, but long-term they have a big effect on a player's value. I believe Keith would be an above average hitter for a second baseman for a long time. He could do that at first too, but I am less sure. Quote
gehringer_2 Posted March 14 Posted March 14 (edited) 48 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: I am less excited about Keith as a 1B than at 2B. Short term, positions don't matter much, but long-term they have a big effect on a player's value. I believe Keith would be an above average hitter for a second baseman for a long time. He could do that at first too, but I am less sure. Right now he's extremely short to the ball, doesn't extend a lot, which netted him a 285 BA in the second half last season, but it's also a stroke that limits his power. Now for most young players I have no problem with that - learn to get the bat on the ball first then learn to pick your spots to swing away. But I think we agree that that means that at least at this point in his evolution as a hitter, he's not your ideal 1B ISO wise - at least not yet. The other thing for me is that I just hate to see anyone play below their defensive capability - decent defense with any kind of bat is too valuable at premium defensive positions. Now I guess if you think he was a lousy 2b that's not a concern. By mid-season I thought he was playing 2B pretty decently. So Torres has come out of the gate hitting well so sure - we maybe don't miss Keith's bat at 2b - but that's temporary. I would put the odds of Torres being a Tiger in 2026 at <10%. Edited March 14 by gehringer_2 Quote
monkeytargets39 Posted March 14 Posted March 14 Between sticking with Baez, and then Sweeney, Jung, Lee, McGonigle, Franyerber and Rainer…..Keith was probably going to get moved from 2B at some point anyway. Might as well be now. Quote
Tiger337 Posted March 14 Posted March 14 2 minutes ago, monkeytargets39 said: Between sticking with Baez, and then Sweeney, Jung, Lee, McGonigle, Franyerber and Rainer…..Keith was probably going to get moved from 2B at some point anyway. Might as well be now. I don't have a problem with the Tigers moving him to first. I just think he has less value there. Quote
gehringer_2 Posted March 14 Posted March 14 Just now, monkeytargets39 said: Between sticking with Baez, and then Sweeney, Jung, Lee, McGonigle, Franyerber and Rainer…..Keith was probably going to get moved from 2B at some point anyway. Might as well be now. I sort of disagree with that as a general principle - you can say Al Kaline ended up at first base so they should have moved him there in 1956 because it was 'inevitable'. Players abilities do shift through their careers but you always want to take advantage of the best they can do for as long as they can do it. And I never count an MiLB player in decisions about major leaguers - just too many ways for them to fail before they ever play their first MLB game. Maybe if you have a guy at AAA already knocking down the door, but the Tigers best prospects are still too far away to bank on. 2 Quote
Toddwert Posted March 14 Posted March 14 45 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said: I sort of disagree with that as a general principle - you can say Al Kaline ended up at first base so they should have moved him there in 1956 because it was 'inevitable'. Players abilities do shift through their careers but you always want to take advantage of the best they can do for as long as they can do it. And I never count an MiLB player in decisions about major leaguers - just too many ways for them to fail before they ever play their first MLB game. Maybe if you have a guy at AAA already knocking down the door, but the Tigers best prospects are still too far away to bank on. just like you should draft best player available ....you can always make room when your forced to there has been plenty of players not make the jump from low minors to the majors Quote
oblong Posted March 14 Posted March 14 51 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said: I sort of disagree with that as a general principle - you can say Al Kaline ended up at first base so they should have moved him there in 1956 because it was 'inevitable'. Players abilities do shift through their careers but you always want to take advantage of the best they can do for as long as they can do it. And I never count an MiLB player in decisions about major leaguers - just too many ways for them to fail before they ever play their first MLB game. Maybe if you have a guy at AAA already knocking down the door, but the Tigers best prospects are still too far away to bank on. as I always say..... "Prospects are prospects." Make them earn it. Put yourself in a position where they force your hand at the ML level rather than opening it up for them. 1 Quote
monkeytargets39 Posted March 14 Posted March 14 51 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said: I sort of disagree with that as a general principle - you can say Al Kaline ended up at first base so they should have moved him there in 1956 because it was 'inevitable'. Players abilities do shift through their careers but you always want to take advantage of the best they can do for as long as they can do it. And I never count an MiLB player in decisions about major leaguers - just too many ways for them to fail before they ever play their first MLB game. Maybe if you have a guy at AAA already knocking down the door, but the Tigers best prospects are still too far away to bank on. I agree. but you can look at this as Keith being moved off of second…..or look at it as Torkelson being moved off of first…. Quote
monkeytargets39 Posted March 14 Posted March 14 55 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: I don't have a problem with the Tigers moving him to first. I just think he has less value there. Individually compared to other 2Bs….yes. However, I think he will have more value at first than Torkelson will, and Torres will have more value at 2B than Keith plus an albatross contract 1B like Alonso would have. Quote
lordstanley Posted March 14 Posted March 14 The Athletic posted its Tigers’ Fan Survey for 2025 today. I think it’s paywalled so I can’t post it all, but I assume a few of the charts are OK. https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/6201650/2025/03/14/detroit-tigers-2025-fan-survey-results-optimism-on-rise/?source=user_shared_article Detroit Tigers 2025 fan survey results: Optimism is on the rise 80% of fans surveyed expect the Tigers to win 80-89 games, 12% in the 70s and 8% more than 90. Riley Greene is the favourite of 31% of Tigers fans, Skubal 27% and Parker Meadows 13%. 1 Quote
Toddwert Posted March 14 Posted March 14 so I wonder what the stupid HR celebration is going to be this season.. ince they seem to do cross marketing with other Ilitch Holdings maybe we'll see an orange flag and the fist full of singles as a tribute the parking lot guys 1 Quote
1984Echoes Posted March 14 Posted March 14 2 hours ago, Tiger337 said: I am less excited about Keith as a 1B than at 2B. Short term, positions don't matter much, but long-term they have a big effect on a player's value. I believe Keith would be an above average hitter for a second baseman for a long time. He could do that at first too, but I am less sure. Torres is only signed for 1 year. If Tork perks back up... and he shows that he's improved in the field... He may be back at 1B full-time in 2026, Torres gone to a big contract, Keith back at 2B... But I'm just guessing. And there are a lot of moving (and unproven) parts as well... Quote
gehringer_2 Posted March 14 Posted March 14 (edited) 1 hour ago, monkeytargets39 said: I agree. but you can look at this as Keith being moved off of second…..or look at it as Torkelson being moved off of first…. This is true. Long term, 1b is Tork’s to win back or not. If he hits 30+ again, the pressure would shift back on Keith, if not tough for Tork. That’s how it should always go. Edited March 14 by gehringer_2 Quote
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