Red Wings GDTs: March 2025

[slothfacekilla]

 

Insanely bad luck + playing against hot goalies, bad recipe

[lordstanley]

7 minutes ago, slothfacekilla said:

 

Insanely bad luck + playing against hot goalies, bad recipe

Yeah, it hasn’t been a total collapse in play like it was during last year’s 7 gamer. Clunker hosting Columbus, nice comeback at Columbus that should have gotten at least a point, clunker hosting Carolina, good 1st period but then fell off hosting Utah, good first two periods but then fell apart at Washington, played well enough last night in Ottawa to get at least a point. So 1-4-1 would probably have been a fairer representation of their play than 0-6-0. But even with those extra 3 points they’d still be in precarious position. 

[Hongbit]

I wonder if the season will solve the mysterious question of is worse to have a head coach that looks like Gru from Minions or one that looks like he’s on the tail end of a 3 day bender? 

[Shinzaki]

You compare the Pistons FA additions from the summer..Beasley, Harris and Hardaway jr...all of those guys have played a huge part in the team's resurgence. To SY off-season adds and it's pretty easy to see why the Pistons are in the playoff mix and the Wings are fading

Is SY the 4th best GM in town?

[gehringer_2]

51 minutes ago, Shinzaki said:

You compare the Pistons FA additions from the summer..Beasley, Harris and Hardaway jr...all of those guys have played a huge part in the team's resurgence. To SY off-season adds and it's pretty easy to see why the Pistons are in the playoff mix and the Wings are fading

Is SY the 4th best GM in town?

I keep getting drawn back to the parallels with Avila. Of the various tasks a GM has to do, Al did one pretty well -drafting); started others in the right direction but was too slow - development infrastructure; and at others was outright terrible - acquiring major league talent via trade and FA. He also keep a bad manager too long but then did hire a good one. 

The parallels with SY are striking - and of course in the end Avila's performance was judged by virtually all to be not good enough. Hard to be a total failure in an aspect as important as trades and FA and succeed no matter what else you are doing right. I agree with what's been said before  - that to retain his credibility SY would be advised to drop the hammer on the parts of his org that are clearly under performing and bring in some new ideas.

Edited 11 hours ago by gehringer_2

[buddha]

steve yzerman directed tampa bay to the stanley cup finals and built the foundation of a team that won multiple cups.

comparing him to al avila is stupid.

[gehringer_2]

20 minutes ago, buddha said:

steve yzerman directed tampa bay to the stanley cup finals and built the foundation of a team that won multiple cups.

So did Kenny Holland yet he ended up ineffective. Sometime guys find a combination in one place or time and can't reproduce it in others. They got a big energy boost from a new coach but that's not looking sustainable. By any objective measure this team is not improving very fast and the FO has been making moves over multiple years that  can't be defended. By that  measure the comparison is spot on whether we like it or not. We just keep hearing that it's the next crop  of kids to come up will be the difference. If it were any one other than Yzerman and his track record he'd be on a very hot seat for this performance in this place.

Edited 2 hours ago by gehringer_2

[buddha]

18 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

So did Kenny Holland yet he ended up ineffective. Sometime guys find a combination in one place or time and can't reproduce it in others. They got a big energy boost from a new coach but that's not looking sustainable. By any objective measure this team is not improving very fast and the FO has been making moves over multiple years that  can't be defended. By that  measure the comparison is spot on whether we like it or not. We just keep hearing that it's the next crop  of kids to come up will be the difference. If it were any one other than Yzerman and his track record he'd be on a very hot seat for this performance in this place.

then compare him to kenny holland, not al avila.

plus there isnt much comparison to kenny either considering yzerman took over one of the worst teams in nhl history with one of the worst farm systems in the league.

avila also took over one of the worst farm systems in thr league....that helped to create.

sometimes you cant make an analogy work, its ok.  

[gehringer_2]

15 minutes ago, buddha said:

then compare him to kenny holland, not al avila.

plus there isnt much comparison to kenny either considering yzerman took over one of the worst teams in nhl history with one of the worst farm systems in the league.

avila also took over one of the worst farm systems in thr league....that helped to create.

sometimes you cant make an analogy work, its ok.  

no - I'll defend the parallel because of what the team is actually doing - in a long wait for young players, committing money to the wrong players, making bad trades, having to dump a bad coach but (maybe) finding a good one, and keeping people around too long who probably should be broomed, those are all nearly exact correspondences.

Which is logical since most teams that aren't getting any where don't get anywhere for most of the same reasons.

Edited 2 hours ago by gehringer_2

[buddha]

one of the worst things about this site is when you have a big long post prepared, go to another tab to look at some data, and then come back to that stupid ad pop up that wipes out your whole post.  

suffice to say, half this board was clamoring for johnny gaudreau two years ago.  and stamkos/marssasseault/elias lindholm this last year.  how'd that work out?

did you want chris tanev for SIX YEARS?

did you want him to trade first round picks for 33 year olds this year?  come on.

now, there's plenty of legit criticism, but remember the context.  they had one of the worst teams in nhl history with the worst farm system in the league in 2019.  it takes a long time to overcome that.  the teams that have done it have had lottery luck.  

toronto was awful.  they drafted nylander (8), matthews (1) and marner (4) back to back to back.  

who did we get when we were bad?  rasmussen (9), zadina (6), and seider (6).

see the difference?  

yeah, this summer was ****.  he owns that.  but every other move was at least explainable.  asp is coming and might even be here this year.  danielson gets here next year. cossa the year after that or next year. in two years that is the foundation of the team.  then chairot, holl, petry, copp, tarasenko, gustafsson, et al are all off the books.

judge then.  if its still bad, then he deserves to be fired.

[buddha]

1 minute ago, gehringer_2 said:

no - I'll defend the parallel because of what the team is actually doing - in a long wait for young players, committing money to the wrong players, making bad trades, having to dump a bad coach but (maybe) finding a good one, and keeping people around too long who probably should be broomed, those are all nearly exact correspondences.

avila built the house he lived in.  yzerman was handed the keys after kenny gutted the interior and stripped all the appliances.

[gehringer_2]

4 minutes ago, buddha said:

avila built the house he lived in.  yzerman was handed the keys after kenny gutted the interior and stripped all the appliances.

Let's be fair - DD & Mike Ilitch did a lot of of the design on the house Avila inherited.

[gehringer_2]

19 minutes ago, buddha said:

asp is coming and might even be here this year.  danielson gets here next year. cossa the year after that or next year

I agree on this, these three are going to make or break Yzerman's  and the Wing's near future.  If they are not impact players, this franchise is in purgatory for another 5 yrs. Maybe you can add Augustine to that group.

[Hongbit]

Augustine has nothing more to prove at the NCAA level.  If he goes pro after this season what happens?  

Do both he and Cossa fight it out for playing time with the Griffins?  

Does Cossa come up and become the Wings backup or maybe a 1A platoon situation?  

Do they trade one of them this offseason before seeing what either can do in the NHL?

Do they try to convince Augustine to spend one more year at MSU?

Door #2 seems like the best option but what do I know. 

[buddha]

1 minute ago, Hongbit said:

Augustine has nothing more to prove at the NCAA level.  If he goes pro after this season what happens?  

Do both he and Cossa fight it out for playing time with the Griffins?  

Does Cossa come up and become the Wings backup or maybe a 1A platoon situation?  

Do they trade one of them this offseason before seeing what either can do in the NHL?

Do they try to convince Augustine to spend one more year at MSU?

Door #2 seems like the best option but what do I know. 

i would br open to trading one of them, depending of course on what you can get.

if this trade deadline was any indication than all you could have gotten was a 30 year old rental.  no thanks.

[Hongbit]

Just now, buddha said:

i would br open to trading one of them, depending of course on what you can get.

if this trade deadline was any indication than all you could have gotten was a 30 year old rental.  no thanks.

Who do you trade?  Augustine has skills that are off the charts for his age but lacks the ideal size of today’s NHL goaltenders.  Cossa is the perfect size and while less skilled is still very good.   Augustine is two years younger which again could be viewed as both good or bad depending on the viewpoint.    

[gehringer_2]

bring them both up, prove their NHL bone fides splitting time (assuming they both are good enough!) then trade one once he can bring back another difference maker.