NBA Playoffs Round 1. (3) New York Knicks vs. (6) Detroit Pistons

[Deleterious]

52 minutes ago, Betrayer said:

Interesting because that's exactly the reason I would use last year. The main thing that changed was the coach, illustrating his impact on what most people called "the same roster" at the start of the season, with no All-Stars added.

Then I'm sure Kenny Atkinson will appreciate you voting for him.

[buddha]

51 minutes ago, Betrayer said:

Interesting because that's exactly the reason I would use last year. The main thing that changed was the coach, illustrating his impact on what most people called "the same roster" at the start of the season, with no All-Stars added.

i think jb has done a good job.

i also think this season's advance is more of a sign of JUST HOW BAD MONTY WILLIAMS WAS AS COACH.  it was the worst coaching job ive ever seen.

and it isnt "the same roster".  no wiseman is huge.  a cancer and a terrible player.  adding beasley was massive considering the season he's had.  ausar and duren's improvement.  a healthy cade.  adding a sparkplug in holland.  those are improvements.  losing ivey matters a lot, but natural improvement from younger players also contributed.

[NYLion]

23 hours ago, buddha said:

do i remember last year?  yes.

competent coaching, a healthy cade, an out of his mind malik beasley, and jumps from young players combined to take the pistons from horrifically bad to slightly above average.

that's a wonderful thing.  i love it.  i am not discounting it.

but i'm also not discounting the coaching job it takes to come within 2 games of setting the league record for wins in a season and having the highest scoring difference in nba history.  that's amazing.

perhaps it comes down to the fact that i find the criteria of "coach whose team wasnt regarded highly enough" wins coach of the year to be faulty.  i'd rather reward excellence.  or perhaps some folks just really pay attention to their own team and not the rest of the league, and consequently overrate them.  im guilty of that all the time.

i would put JB third.  that's awesome.

Come on Buddha, we've been posting here a long time and you've never EVER been guilty of overrating a Detroit team lol. You're quite the opposite actually, lets be honest here.

This is not an award, or shouldn't be, for the coach that coached the best team. It should be coach of the year, the coach that did the best job, did the most with least. Again, OKC and Cleveland were already very successful teams while the Pistons were arguably the worst team in league history and the Pistons are solidly a playoff team just like THAT under Bickerstaff. I'm sure you, just like everybody else, thought that 30 wins would be a successful season so lets not pretend like any of this was close to expected then they lose Ivey and even less so. Just about everybody pegged OKC and Cleveland as real contenders coming into the season and, yes, each team took another step forward but there was a base of a title contending core with both. Those coaches did a great job but Bickerstaff took on the much harder job with far less resources and somehow turned it around in one year engineering one of the biggest turnarounds in league history, to reiterate. That's coach of the year to me

[NYLion]

2 hours ago, Betrayer said:

Interesting because that's exactly the reason I would use last year. The main thing that changed was the coach, illustrating his impact on what most people called "the same roster" at the start of the season, with no All-Stars added.

The roster is arguably worse than last year, they had Cade and Ivey last year. The Pistons added some solid vets but most people were scoffing, here included, at the Harris and Beasley signings and THJ trade so some serious hindsight here if anybody says to the contrary although I think a few liked the Beasley signing as a decent vet add. Every young player has progressed this season and while these are talented guys, I'd like to think coaching has at least something to do with it and/or distancing from the Monty stench.

Actually, Del brought up a good point about Tyronne Lue. He should also get consideration keeping them in the playoff race with all the injuries they've had to deal with, I've always felt like Lue was underrated as coach but I digress.

Edited Tuesday at 07:06 PM by NYLion

[Deleterious]

Series price is moving a bit. 

Knicks -400

Pistons +310

[buddha]

1 hour ago, NYLion said:

Come on Buddha, we've been posting here a long time and you've never EVER been guilty of overrating a Detroit team lol. You're quite the opposite actually, lets be honest here.

This is not an award, or shouldn't be, for the coach that coached the best team. It should be coach of the year, the coach that did the best job, did the most with least. Again, OKC and Cleveland were already very successful teams while the Pistons were arguably the worst team in league history and the Pistons are solidly a playoff team just like THAT under Bickerstaff. I'm sure you, just like everybody else, thought that 30 wins would be a successful season so lets not pretend like any of this was close to expected then they lose Ivey and even less so. Just about everybody pegged OKC and Cleveland as real contenders coming into the season and, yes, each team took another step forward but there was a base of a title contending core with both. Those coaches did a great job but Bickerstaff took on the much harder job with far less resources and somehow turned it around in one year engineering one of the biggest turnarounds in league history, to reiterate. That's coach of the year to me

i had him 3rd, i think that's pretty good.  i dont get the "hey, your team was supposed to be good so having one of the greatest regular seasons in nba history isnt good enough."

since there is no criteria for "coach of the year" we can just argue in circles about this for days.

[Sports_Freak]

On 4/14/2025 at 11:31 AM, Deleterious said:

A little shocked by how much credit OG is getting on defense against Cade this series.

I think Cade is going to cook OG.  Especially if they single cover him. 

 

They won't. They'll try to smother Cade. Make somebody else make some shots.

[Sports_Freak]

On 4/14/2025 at 3:34 PM, buddha said:

do i remember last year?  yes.

competent coaching, a healthy cade, an out of his mind malik beasley, and jumps from young players combined to take the pistons from horrifically bad to slightly above average.

that's a wonderful thing.  i love it.  i am not discounting it.

but i'm also not discounting the coaching job it takes to come within 2 games of setting the league record for wins in a season and having the highest scoring difference in nba history.  that's amazing.

perhaps it comes down to the fact that i find the criteria of "coach whose team wasnt regarded highly enough" wins coach of the year to be faulty.  i'd rather reward excellence.  or perhaps some folks just really pay attention to their own team and not the rest of the league, and consequently overrate them.  im guilty of that all the time.

i would put JB third.  that's awesome.

Well, I guess it's lucky for Piston fans that you don't get a vote..😅

[Deleterious]

 

[buddha]

i hate the two days off in between some games.

[NYLion]

21 hours ago, buddha said:

i had him 3rd, i think that's pretty good.  i dont get the "hey, your team was supposed to be good so having one of the greatest regular seasons in nba history isnt good enough."

since there is no criteria for "coach of the year" we can just argue in circles about this for days.

I'm not saying that the historically great season isn't good enough, what I'm talking is the baseline these coaches had to work with before this season. Bickerstaff took over one of the worst teams in league history with a roster that had question marks all over it including Cade btw while the other two coaches took over teams that had contending rosters already. Not taking away from what Atkinson and Daigneault have done and if either won CotY I wouldn't begrudge it but the reality is that they had tremendous, proven rosters to work with coming into this season so they had a very strong baseline to work with. There is something to be said for the jump from good to great to be tougher than the jump from bad to relevant but the Pistons bad was so bad so historically bad that to jump to a playoff position immediately is arguably the biggest turnaround in league history so I just have a hard time not having Bickerstaff first because of that. 

Anyway, as you said there is no criteria for coach of the year so it's all just opinions at the end of the day and it's fine to agree to disagree. Coach of the Year doesn't mean much in the grand scheme either way.

[Deleterious]

The 10 best and worst statistical categories for each team.

 

[casimir]

I don’t care who wins coach of the year.  It’s just nice to have the Pistons in that kind of a conversation.

[buddha]

2 hours ago, casimir said:

I don’t care who wins coach of the year.  It’s just nice to have the Pistons in that kind of a conversation.

so youre the guy who goes to the games and just hopes both teams have fun.

[Deleterious]

Glad they are going traditional. 

 

[casimir]

9 hours ago, buddha said:

so youre the guy who goes to the games and just hopes both teams have fun.

Would you like an orange slice?

[Hongbit]

10 hours ago, buddha said:

so youre the guy who goes to the games and just hopes both teams have fun.

I think it’s a stupid award especially since most quality coaching gets done in the playoffs.    

[Deleterious]

Knicks in 5.

I have tried every way possible to pick the Pistons and just can't get there.  Cade is good enough to get them one win but he wont have enough help to do much else. 

[buddha]

18 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

Knicks in 5.

I have tried every way possible to pick the Pistons and just can't get there.  Cade is good enough to get them one win but he wont have enough help to do much else. 

ausar gives brunson fits and kat disappears every 4th quarter because stewart is really mean to him.

still....knicks in 6.

[Hongbit]

Having trouble deciding if it’s Knicks sweep or if we can get one.

They are further along in the rebuild process than the Pistons.   We have the best player but they have the better overall roster. 

The biggest issue is see is that the Pistons physicality is going to be a huge deterrent in this series.   We have the physical advantage but they will have the ref bias advantage.  I fully expect many egregious fouls called in favor of the Knicks.  Any physical advantage that  Beef Stew may have over KAT will quickly be exterminated by ticky-tack whistles.   I can also see potential ejections and quick technicals against the Pistons, who haven’t done a great job keeping their cool with refs in these situations.  

[Deleterious]

Ausar staying out of foul trouble will be huge.  I expect NY to run some double action at him.  Early screens to try and force Hardaway to switch onto Brunson and then go into their PnR with Hardaway/Duren defending instead of Thompson/Duren.  Even if the Pistons don't switch, it's an extra screen for Thompson to run through and maybe pick up a foul.

I was encouraged to see Stew on KAT in the 4th last week.  But it probably needs to happen earlier.  If Brunson and KAT are murdering the Pistons with the PnR in the 1st half, it might not matter who plays the 4th quarter. 

Cade needs to be efficient.  Scoring 28 on 25 shots won't cut it.  He also needs to watch the unforced TO's.  He has a habit of throwing some of the dumbest/laziest passes sometimes.  KAT is a marshmallow so Cade can get to the rim with ease.  Might even see some double big lineups with Robinson if Cade is getting to the rim a lot. 

Cade needs his Robin.  He needs another player to be in that 20 point range. 

 

[RandyMarsh]

Considering it's the Knicks and it should(hopefully) be a competitive series unlike some 1/8 and 2/7 matchups you'd think all the games would get the prime TV times.

[Deleterious]

Lakers get it on Saturday.  I can understand that.

 

 

[Deleterious]

I haven't listened yet.  But look who Sam has on 1st team all NBA.

 

[RandyMarsh]

1 minute ago, Deleterious said:

I haven't listened yet.  But look who Sam has on 1st team all NBA.

 

It feels like Sam has always been higher on Cade than others in the NBA media.