Tiger337 Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 19 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: We get the Royal Flush if that happens. I don't want to count on that... certainly not quite yet... But we'll see. If that does happen... I wonder if the general attitude in here just might change... It will take a few years before we find out. Hopefully, there is new management by that time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edman85 Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 19 hours ago, TigerNation said: The Tigers recent history of drafting and developing pitchers is pretty good though. Is it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenacious D Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 3 hours ago, Edman85 said: Is it? Yes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyMarsh Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 I think it's a little premature to say that, yes Brieske and Faedo are off to good starts in their MLB career but who knows if that is going to last. If they are indeed legit that helps the argument but if they aren't who can you really point to at this point as a success at the MLB level outside of Skubal and a relatively small sample of Turnbull before he had a major injury? Just about every team in the league can point to that type of "success", particularly if they drafted as many high end pitchers as we have. I will say it has been nice seeing guys like Flores and a couple others take positive steps in the minor leagues and along with the aforementioned turnarounds of Brieske and Faedo I have a little more confidence in the pitching development than I did say a year or so ago but I think it's too early to say that they have been good at it. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted June 20, 2022 Author Share Posted June 20, 2022 15 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said: I think it's a little premature to say that, yes Brieske and Faedo are off to good starts in their MLB career but who knows if that is going to last. If they are indeed legit that helps the argument but if they aren't who can you really point to at this point as a success at the MLB level outside of Skubal and a relatively small sample of Turnbull before he had a major injury? Just about every team in the league can point to that type of "success", particularly if they drafted as many high end pitchers as we have. I will say it has been nice seeing guys like Flores and a couple others take positive steps in the minor leagues and along with the aforementioned turnarounds of Brieske and Faedo I have a little more confidence in the pitching development than I did say a year or so ago but I think it's too early to say that they have been good at it. I'm watching for turnarounds on guys that have stagnated. That would be the indication that the new PD staff has more pixie dust than the old one. W Perez, Parker Meadows, Lipcius, Bryant Packard. Not necessarily even that guys suddenly look MLB viable but just how many guys that have been around for a while not doing much at least improve their games from where they were under the old regime. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 (edited) https://www.detroitnews.com/story/sports/mlb/tigers/2022/06/19/detroit-tigers-farm-wenceel-perez/7677097001/ Quote He can be overlooked, even forgotten, when Colt Keith, Ryan Kreidler, Cristian Santana, Izaac Pacheco — and others tend to be the Tigers’ spicier farm-system celebrities. But be careful with Wenceel Perez. He’s an infielder. Aiming for Detroit. “He’s really put himself back on the map,” said Ryan Garko, the Tigers vice president who oversees player-development. Perez last week got what everyone knew soon was coming: a ticket to Double-A Erie after he had worn out his apprenticeship at Single-A West Michigan. Perez, 22, and a switch-hitter, batted .286, with nine homers, in 55 games for the Whitecaps. He had an .893 OPS, courtesy of slugging (.529) and on-base (.364) averages, the latter of which featured 27 walks versus 38 strikeouts. Solid stuff there. The kind that can push you to the big leagues if they hold up at Erie. "He can really hit,” said Gabe Alvarez, who manages Erie, and who watched Perez go 5-for-15 in his first three games for the SeaWolves. “And he’s just as good from the right side as he is from the left side.” Not much about Perez in 2022 is all that surprising. The Tigers liked him long ago, so much that they signed him in 2017 for $550,000 — heavy money for Latin American teens. He survived 2019 as a 19-year-old at West Michigan, all before COVID wiped out the 2020 minor-league season. He split last year at Single A Lakeland and with the high-A Whitecaps before settling in this year, playing mostly second base, with third base and designated hitter occasional options. “Before I was here, and before COVID, he was one of our fastest risers,” said Garko, who is in his first year running Detroit’s player-development side. “Last year wasn’t what he had hoped to do (.245 average, .661 OPS in 90 games for the Whitecaps, “but he’s a great story. "When a new group came in for PD (player development), everybody got a clean slate to go out and perform and play. Wenceel (pronounced: WEN-sul) is really a professional. Gets on base, knows the strike-zone, gives you a really good at-bat, and hits line drives all over the field, from both sides. “Just really professional at-bats — and with young players, it’s hard to find that.” Perez was signed as a shortstop, which happens to be the position his cousin, Cristian Santana, also plays. Santana is working now at low-A Lakeland two years after signing for $2.95 million, the most money the Tigers ever have invested in an international teen. Santana looks as if he’ll be sticking at short for the long term. Perez, at 5-foot-11, 203 pounds, is a better big-league bet elsewhere. “Defensively, I think second base is going to be his spot,” Garko said. “We want to make sure he can play second at this (Double A) level. He’s still got work to do. But he earned his promotion.” No argument from Alvarez. “He has plenty of range, more than enough,” the SeaWolves skipper said. “He’s a quick-twitch kid, and can really play.” Pretty complimentary stuff from Ryan Garko on Wenceel Perez.... encouraging Edited June 20, 2022 by mtutiger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 (edited) 33 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said: I think it's a little premature to say that, yes Brieske and Faedo are off to good starts in their MLB career but who knows if that is going to last. If they are indeed legit that helps the argument but if they aren't who can you really point to at this point as a success at the MLB level outside of Skubal and a relatively small sample of Turnbull before he had a major injury? Just about every team in the league can point to that type of "success", particularly if they drafted as many high end pitchers as we have. I will say that I find it a bit frustrating that fans tend to rush to make a lot of judgments about players and their future prospects when they play poorly (ie. Torkelson) but, when you get Faedo or Brieske who have performed reasonably well under the circumstances, the reaction is more "just give it time" With Brieske in particular, there's a natural skepticism because of where he was drafted and his quick rise through the system. But when you look at his progression through the season, he has improved a lot since he first made his major league debut. He's getting more swing and miss, his slider is starting to be a better pitch, and his peripheral stats (still not great) have steadily improved as well. Development isn't linear, obviously, and he's likely to have some struggles.... he's ceiling isn't more than a fourth starter. But I don't think he's a fraud either. Edited June 20, 2022 by mtutiger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdog Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 I applaud their successes in pitching development. I’m not even cynical about it. But the attrition rate is so high on pitchers that the guy you like today will be hurt next week. Hitters don’t get hurt as much…if they had more mid level hitting prospects, this org would be in much better shape. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyAbbott Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 I have moved to the camp of always drafting the most talented position player, so long as the farm system has enough "just a guy" pitchers to field a team. Hand as much of the development risk off to other teams when it comes to pitchers. Trade the excess position players for pitching if need be, or look for reasonable pitching reclamation projects. Other than that, save your FA pennies to pony up for pitching. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ancient Fan Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 4 hours ago, RandyMarsh said: I think it's a little premature to say that, yes Brieske and Faedo are off to good starts in their MLB career but who knows if that is going to last. If they are indeed legit that helps the argument but if they aren't who can you really point to at this point as a success at the MLB level outside of Skubal and a relatively small sample of Turnbull before he had a major injury? Just about every team in the league can point to that type of "success", particularly if they drafted as many high end pitchers as we have. I will say it has been nice seeing guys like Flores and a couple others take positive steps in the minor leagues and along with the aforementioned turnarounds of Brieske and Faedo I have a little more confidence in the pitching development than I did say a year or so ago but I think it's too early to say that they have been good at it. What about Mize? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 5 hours ago, mtutiger said: https://www.detroitnews.com/story/sports/mlb/tigers/2022/06/19/detroit-tigers-farm-wenceel-perez/7677097001/ Pretty complimentary stuff from Ryan Garko on Wenceel Perez.... encouraging I really like Wenceel... But I keep inexplicably forgetting to put him on my "Top" lists for some reason... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenacious D Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 5 hours ago, HeyAbbott said: Other than that, save your FA pennies to pony up for pitching. Like Jordan Zimmerman or Eduardo Rodriguez? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted June 20, 2022 Share Posted June 20, 2022 1 hour ago, Tenacious D said: Like Jordan Zimmerman or Eduardo Rodriguez? the fact that al avila failed at doing something isnt evidence that the "something" isnt a sound strategy. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edman85 Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 12 hours ago, Tenacious D said: Yes How so? I'm curious. 5 hours ago, Ancient Fan said: What about Mize? A 1-1 pick with a 4.3 ERA in 188 innings before missing two years with TJ Surgery is not a developmental success. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongLiveMaroth Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 Saw this on Twitter, obviously I am not thinking Pacheco is staying at SS, probably ends up at 3B but that being said he is pretty close stat line wise with Mayer. That being said Lawler and Merrill look pretty good but these are all SSS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HeyAbbott Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 14 hours ago, buddha said: the fact that al avila failed at doing something isnt evidence that the "something" isnt a sound strategy. Very True. One still has to be able to identify talent, and to ascertain its quality. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 (edited) 41 minutes ago, HeyAbbott said: Very True. One still has to be able to identify talent, and to ascertain its quality. It also seems kinda early to compare ERod to Jordan Zimmermann.... yet people keep doing it anyway. Edited June 21, 2022 by mtutiger 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shinzaki Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 IIRC, one of the fears re Pacheco was his projected K rate...he seems to be walking more and striking out less than the expectations....which is good Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SeattleMike Posted June 21, 2022 Share Posted June 21, 2022 5 hours ago, LongLiveMaroth said: Saw this on Twitter, obviously I am not thinking Pacheco is staying at SS, probably ends up at 3B but that being said he is pretty close stat line wise with Mayer. That being said Lawler and Merrill look pretty good but these are all SSS. Santana kind of holding his own at low A as an 18-year old. Encouraging. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted June 22, 2022 Author Share Posted June 22, 2022 (edited) Wenceel has pushed his OPS to 1000 with a 2/5 3B night for Erie. Carpenter 2/5 2B, 2K Maddon: 5IP, 2H 0R 1BB 5K Edited June 22, 2022 by gehringer_2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted June 22, 2022 Author Share Posted June 22, 2022 Baddoo on base streak with the Hen's ends tonight. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 1 hour ago, gehringer_2 said: Wenceel has pushed his OPS to 1000 with a 2/5 3B night for Erie. Carpenter 2/5 2B, 2K Maddon: 5IP, 2H 0R 1BB 5K Andre Lipcius had a big night for Erie as well, 3/4, 2B, 4 RBI... always forget about him, but he's picked it up lately Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RandyMarsh Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stanley70 Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 SSS but it looks to be pretty clear that that there is an uptick in progress from the hitters this year. Most of the prospects with the highest ceilings are a year or more away but it is still nice to see. Looking at the MILB top 100 prospects it looks like about a third are from latin american signings, it will be nice when the Tigers get on on there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted June 22, 2022 Share Posted June 22, 2022 Random, but since Toledo is playing Scranton/Wilkes Barre this week: Would it be worth it for the Tigers to trade for Miguel Andujar, who the Yankees have stashed away playing 3rd and OF down there? What would it take from this system to get him? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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