Tiger Cubs (notes on the minors)

[RatkoVarda]

was the B team today for position players: Vilade, Madris, Benboom and Kennedy.

but Hurter and Wilmer did not have great AAA debut

[RatkoVarda]

Lakeland set: Briceno, McGonigle and Clark will start there; pitching thin until HS arms move up from rookie ball.

One oddity: Tigers start seasons with 5 position players on IL; all are catchers.

[Toddwert]

24 minutes ago, RatkoVarda said:

Lakeland set: Briceno, McGonigle and Clark will start there; pitching thin until HS arms move up from rookie ball.

One oddity: Tigers start seasons with 5 position players on IL; all are catchers.

very interested in Briceno.... maybe we'll have some fun players at West Michigan by the end of season

[gehringer_2]

17 hours ago, RatkoVarda said:

was the B team today for position players: Vilade, Madris, Benboom and Kennedy.

but Hurter and Wilmer did not have great AAA debut

and Hanifee let both runners he inherited score on consecutive doubles.

[LongLiveMaroth]

 

 

[RatkoVarda]

will be a Flying Tiger; 6-8, 280; 25 next month; literally a man among boys

[Tigermojo]

Everyone can watch Jobe's first start on Sunday at 1pm for free. Dylan Crews is on the opposing team.

https://www.mlb.com/tigers/news/watch-minor-league-baseball-games-for-free?t=mlb-pipeline-coverage

[LongLiveMaroth]

 

 

 

[gehringer_2]

Malloy after 4 games: 5H, 5BB, 5K.

[Edman85]

I want to reiterate despite some of the brash dismissals to this last week. If there wasn't room in Toledo for Ty Madden, Bryan Sammons wouldn't be in the rotation. 

[LongLiveMaroth]

Toledo L 5-4 /10

Perez 1/5 K SB
Malloy 1/2 3BB K
Jung 0/2 RBI 2BB 2K SF
Bigbie 0/5
Leonard 1/4 K 
Brieske 2IP 3ER BB 3K

[1984Echoes]

2 hours ago, Edman85 said:

I want to reiterate despite some of the brash dismissals to this last week. If there wasn't room in Toledo for Ty Madden, Bryan Sammons wouldn't be in the rotation. 

Bryan Sammons was in the Toledo rotation for most of last year. He's almost 29 and a 5th starter... at Toledo. He can easily be skipped in the rotation because he doesn't matter. 5th starter. Easy to skip over. This is what you think the Org should do with Madden?

Sammons doesn't matter, at all, in this situation. Not to be mean to him, but he is almost a non-entity. Easily replaced as a 5th starter, in Toledo, by any other non-real-prospect that Detroit wants to throw out there.

Again, this is the situation you want Madden to be in?

It's better for Madden to be in Erie, as the #2 starter behind Jobe... where he can work on control and new pitches and tunneling and such... than as the 5th starter in Toledo, easily being skipped over. He won't be skipped over in Erie.

Even if he ends up in the bullpen at some point in the future, as I've already stated.

[Edman85]

Bryan Sammons was signed in June and started 13 games for Toledo. Hardly most of last year.

He's a placeholder. If they thought Madden was ready for Toledo, he would be there and the placeholder would be in Erie.

If Madden was in Toledo you would maneuver around him. I really don't understand the argument here.

[RatkoVarda]

to me, it sounds like Madden is likely going to be another developmental success story for the Tigers; they reworked his delivery and pitches; looks like he will be a ML contributor either at the back of the rotation or in the bullpen.

[gehringer_2]

6 minutes ago, Edman85 said:

Bryan Sammons was signed in June and started 13 games for Toledo. Hardly most of last year.

He's a placeholder. If they thought Madden was ready for Toledo, he would be there and the placeholder would be in Erie.

If Madden was in Toledo you would maneuver around him. I really don't understand the argument here.

it would seem to me that MiLB pitcher placement is going to have two factors pushing in opposite directions depending on what the development objective is for that pitcher. If you have a guy on whom you are doing major mechanical or approach modifications, new pitches etc., I think you want to put him where he can remain competitive while he works on those things, otherwise he simply won't be able to stay in games long enough to do so or will be forced back to old approaches. OTOH, if you have a pitcher who needs to hone sequencing, general command, his "compete level" as they call it in hockey, you want to promote him to the highest level of competition he can handle - where he can't skate by on stuff, and force those "art of pitching" issues to the fore. Where do we think Madden is on that continuum today?

I have to think that an org that claims development as its highest priority is being driven primarily by the balance of those considerations rather than the needs of a guy it appears they brought on to be career AAA fill. But that's not to say they don't give some consideration to keeping a competitive team on the field in Toledo, it's just not very much.

[Tigermojo]

Gipson-Long should be back soon so he'll probably bump someone out of Toledo's rotation.

[Toddwert]

2 hours ago, gehringer_2 said:

it would seem to me that MiLB pitcher placement is going to have two factors pushing in opposite directions depending on what the development objective is for that pitcher. If you have a guy on whom you are doing major mechanical or approach modifications, new pitches etc., I think you want to put him where he can remain competitive while he works on those things, otherwise he simply won't be able to stay in games long enough to do so or will be forced back to old approaches. OTOH, if you have a pitcher who needs to hone sequencing, general command, his "compete level" as they call it in hockey, you want to promote him to the highest level of competition he can handle - where he can't skate by on stuff, and force those "art of pitching" issues to the fore. Where do we think Madden is on that continuum today?

I have to think that an org that claims development as its highest priority is being driven primarily by the balance of those considerations rather than the needs of a guy it appears they brought on to be career AAA fill. But that's not to say they don't give some consideration to keeping a competitive team on the field in Toledo, it's just not very much.

or is it possible that the pitching coach is someone they trust to make adjustments with young pitchers then the coach at Toledo? he could  as easily come up to the Majors from AA as AAA

Edited April 3, 2024 by Toddwert

[RandyMarsh]

I remember after that draft there were a couple national guys that pegged Madden as one of the guys they thought could reach the majors first from the class. 

Atleast one of them brought up the Chris Sale comparison in regards to how he could be fast tracked and used. 

Considering we are now 3 years later and he is still in AA tells me that he hasnt quite developed the way the Tigers were hoping. 

Edited April 3, 2024 by RandyMarsh

[SoCalTiger]

Everything that I have read focuses on maddens need for a breaking pitch. It seems everything else is in order so without developing a third offering he looks like a bullpen guy with one he’s a starter. Hope he develops it this year. might be his last chance.

[Tenacious D]

We’re writing off Ty Madden?

[RandyMarsh]

I'm not giving up on him but after hearing what Mark had to say it does feel like the Tigers have lost a little faith in him in terms of being a long term starter and they obviously know alot more about him than we do.

Also he's certainly not old having just turned 24 but considering he was a 3 year college player at a high level program and is now in his 3rd year of pro ball and it seems like he still hasn't developed that third pitch makes me skeptical that he ever will. 

With that said even if he doesn't develop that and is relegated to the bullpen in this day and age where starters are pitching less innings and more relievers are pitching multiple innings he could still provide quite a bit of value if he ends up being a really good multi inning guy.   

[LongLiveMaroth]

 

[Tigermojo]

Malloy got hit pretty hard by a pitch on his elbow pad. He was in pain, but he stayed in the game. Bigbie pinch hit in his next at bat. Hopefully Malloy is ok.

 

[gehringer_2]

2 hours ago, RandyMarsh said:

I'm not giving up on him but after hearing what Mark had to say it does feel like the Tigers have lost a little faith in him in terms of being a long term starter and they obviously know alot more about him than we do.

Also he's certainly not old having just turned 24 but considering he was a 3 year college player at a high level program and is now in his 3rd year of pro ball and it seems like he still hasn't developed that third pitch makes me skeptical that he ever will. 

With that said even if he doesn't develop that and is relegated to the bullpen in this day and age where starters are pitching less innings and more relievers are pitching multiple innings he could still provide quite a bit of value if he ends up being a really good multi inning guy.   

I think sometimes when scouts call a player 'advanced' (as Madden was) it's the kiss of death - like it really means they are as far as they are going to get. Dylan Crews was generally also slotted above Langford on the basis of being more "advanced". Wyatt says "Hi" from Texas.

[gehringer_2]

57 minutes ago, Tigermojo said:

Malloy got hit pretty hard by a pitch on his elbow pad. He was in pain, but he stayed in the game. Bigbie pinch hit in his next at bat. Hopefully Malloy is ok.

 

Hanifee got rocked. Two rough outings.