2022 NBA Draft Prelude

[Deleterious]

Example #1 of being different just for the clicks.

2022 NBA Draft Big Board Top 100: Post-Lottery Edition

[Deleterious]

I get the logic of a trade.  But once again, OKC doesn't need extra draft picks.  They honestly have more than they need right now.   Unless the plan is to offer 8 first round picks for that French kid next year.

 

[NYLion]

10 hours ago, Deleterious said:

I get the logic of a trade.  But once again, OKC doesn't need extra draft picks.  They honestly have more than they need right now.   Unless the plan is to offer 8 first round picks for that French kid next year.

 

And they don't need another guard, seems like a weak rumor to me.

I do think the Kings are a prime candidate for a trade down though which will obviously impact the Pistons. I could see Indiana being interested to get a shot at the hometown kid Ivey to pair with Haliburton, with the rumors also being that they might very well trade Brogdon. I just have a feeling that something unconventional will happen with the Kings pick because.... Kings.

[NYLion]

On 5/24/2022 at 10:48 AM, RandyMarsh said:

Do you think he is a guy that can play in the modern NBA? I have no problem if he doesn't have superstar tendencies, if he can just be a plus player that can stay on the court in the playoffs(assuming we ever make it there) then I'd be fine taking him.  I still prefer Mathurin though cause to my amateur scouting he seems to offer the best combination of fit, upside and floor.  

My question with Murray is fit. Since I highly doubt that they trade Grant, I don't see where Murray fits in the Pistons lineup. Bey isn't a 2 and Murray isn't a 3 so not sure how that shuffle works. If they do take Murray, I'd assume that Grant is as good as gone unless they plan to start Murray off the bench which I suppose is possible.

[NYLion]

On 5/24/2022 at 11:07 PM, buddha said:

were not trading grant for #7.

I think you meant to say that Portland isn't trading #7 for Grant. I'm sure Troy would consider it although I bet that he values Grant higher than us fans do.

[buddha]

look, if grant wants to stand in the corner and watch cade, that's cool.  he can do that.  but he doesnt do that.  he gets the ball and plays hero ball while cade watches him.  that's the problem.

if grant could be a good #3 option like he was in denver while playing good, switchable defense, then he can stay.  if grant wants to show everyone he can "be a #1 option on HIS team," then he's got to go.

[NYLion]

2 minutes ago, buddha said:

look, if grant wants to stand in the corner and watch cade, that's cool.  he can do that.  but he doesnt do that.  he gets the ball and plays hero ball while cade watches him.  that's the problem.

if grant could be a good #3 option like he was in denver while playing good, switchable defense, then he can stay.  if grant wants to show everyone he can "be a #1 option on HIS team," then he's got to go.

I thought he played pretty well with Cade and Bey before he got "injured", seemed to be learning to defer more as Cade took on more on ball responsibilities. I like Grant the player, I loathe the idea of Grant the contract extension.

Edited May 26, 2022 by NYLion

[Deleterious]

We should draft Ron Harper Jr and Scottie Pippen Jr.  Then we have 3 family members from those Bulls championship teams.

[Betrayer]

Grant played much better with Cade and Bey after he came back from the thumb injury and Weaver had a talk with him about playing a more "efficient" brand of basketball. They talked about this in the post-season interview with Casey and Weaver. The team also was pretty close to .500 during that stretch.

So, I think Grant is fine as far as his ability to play with others. My problem with Grant is I don't want the Pistons to commit to a 20+ Million a year extension for a complimentary player at this stage of the rebuild. Get your 2 or 3 stars first, then fill out the rest. So, for that reason I hope we trade him and I think we will, even if it's not for the #7 pick.

However, I do worry about the fact that if we trade Grant and draft Murray we will have lost our only athletic starter. Can you imagine a starting lineup of Cade, CoJo, Bey, Murray, and Stewart? That's the least athletic lineup in the league.

For that reason I hope we draft a more athletic player rather than Murray or at least get the #7 pick to get another athlete. Again, I don't dislike Murray, but what he brings is too similar to what Bey brings and this team is in desperate need of athleticism in the starting lineup.

[RandyMarsh]

Ive heard that the NBA is seeking 75 billion for their next tv deal which is in I believe 24 or 2025. That's like quadruple what they are getting now so if they get that 20 million a year for Grant probably won't look too bad.

Edited May 26, 2022 by RandyMarsh

[Hart]

19 hours ago, buddha said:

look, if grant wants to stand in the corner and watch cade, that's cool.  he can do that.  but he doesnt do that.  he gets the ball and plays hero ball while cade watches him.  that's the problem.

if grant could be a good #3 option like he was in denver while playing good, switchable defense, then he can stay.  if grant wants to show everyone he can "be a #1 option on HIS team," then he's got to go.

I thought Grant played less hero ball when he came back from his injury and it was clearly Cade's team.  I was done with him to that point but it was encouraging to see him defer and play the role he played in Denver.  

[Hart]

19 hours ago, NYLion said:

My question with Murray is fit. Since I highly doubt that they trade Grant, I don't see where Murray fits in the Pistons lineup. Bey isn't a 2 and Murray isn't a 3 so not sure how that shuffle works. If they do take Murray, I'd assume that Grant is as good as gone unless they plan to start Murray off the bench which I suppose is possible.

If you draft Murray, I think that means the writing is on the wall that Grant isn't going to be here in two years.  

I am okay either way.  I like Murray the more I learn about him but I also like Grant.  Grant doesn't have near Murray's upside on offense but he is probably always going to be a considerably better defensive player.  

[Hart]

3 hours ago, Betrayer said:

Grant played much better with Cade and Bey after he came back from the thumb injury and Weaver had a talk with him about playing a more "efficient" brand of basketball. They talked about this in the post-season interview with Casey and Weaver. The team also was pretty close to .500 during that stretch.

So, I think Grant is fine as far as his ability to play with others. My problem with Grant is I don't want the Pistons to commit to a 20+ Million a year extension for a complimentary player at this stage of the rebuild. Get your 2 or 3 stars first, then fill out the rest. So, for that reason I hope we trade him and I think we will, even if it's not for the #7 pick.

However, I do worry about the fact that if we trade Grant and draft Murray we will have lost our only athletic starter. Can you imagine a starting lineup of Cade, CoJo, Bey, Murray, and Stewart? That's the least athletic lineup in the league.

For that reason I hope we draft a more athletic player rather than Murray or at least get the #7 pick to get another athlete. Again, I don't dislike Murray, but what he brings is too similar to what Bey brings and this team is in desperate need of athleticism in the starting lineup.

I think Murray is considerably more versatile on offense than Bey.  But I do agree with your point about needing athleticism.  And I don't know how you get that in the lineup with Bey, Cade, and Murray as your wings.  At least Grant gives you some of that.  

At the same time,  Murray, Cade and Bey would be an electric combination on offense.  So I don't know.  Maybe you draft Murray and then try to find your own version of Marcus Smart.  

[Deleterious]

The Pistons are in no position to worry about fit. Especially for a pretty average player like Grant. Aquire talent and figure the rest out later.

 

[Deleterious]

RAPM over a short college season is not the greatest.  

RAPM favors tall players so not shocked to see Chet or even Paolo on the good list.

Ivey is a pretty bad defender, so not shocked he shows up on the bad list.

This doesn't include players outside of the NCAA.  So someone like Dyson Daniels wont show up here even though he is considered one of the best defenders in the class.

 

[Betrayer]

 

[Deleterious]

Johnny Davis already has a Taco Bell commercial?  Does Cade have any national endorsements?  

[Betrayer]

I don't know, but he's on the cover of Slam magazine...

https://www.slamonline.com/the-magazine/cade-cunningham-slam-238/

[Deleterious]

Givony has a new mock out.  

Smith 

Chet

Paolo

Ivey

Murray

Daniels

Sharpe

Mathurin

Duren

Davis

I might take Daniels over Murray.  Either one is a nice get at #5.

[Deleterious]

Some Sharpe game film is starting to leak out.  These are both high school.  I would rather see the EYBL stuff since it is probably better compeition.

 

[buddha]

meh.

[Deleterious]

Givony mocks him in the second round.  He might be G-League bound no matter what option he picks.

 

[RandyMarsh]

Its starting to seem unlikely if you are to believe the mocks but I still really like Mathurin. He may not have the upside of a Daniels or Sharpe but I think he has a better chance of hitting his ceiling while maintaining a higher floor. I like Murray for much of the same reasons. 

To me now that we have our perceived superstar or number 1 its not as important to swing for the fences, if we end up with a plus starter to borderline All Star that is fine with me, what we can't afford to do is completely whiff on it and end up with a Killian Hayes like return.

[Deleterious]

I would have no problem with Mathurin at #5.

[Betrayer]

2 hours ago, RandyMarsh said:

Its starting to seem unlikely if you are to believe the mocks but I still really like Mathurin. He may not have the upside of a Daniels or Sharpe but I think he has a better chance of hitting his ceiling while maintaining a higher floor. I like Murray for much of the same reasons. 

To me now that we have our perceived superstar or number 1 its not as important to swing for the fences, if we end up with a plus starter to borderline All Star that is fine with me, what we can't afford to do is completely whiff on it and end up with a Killian Hayes like return.

Agree with the top half of your take. I like Mathurin. If you're taking the safe player, I'd rather have him than Keegan Murray because he has a higher ceiling. Of course, if drafting Murray means we're trading Grant to get the #7 pick, then by all means give me both of those players  😄 I want as many chances at finding that 1 in 10 All-Star or Superstar in this draft as possible, which brings me to the next point...

I disagree with the second half of your take. We were near .500 after the All Star break when Cade got going. This team is highly unlikely to get another top 5 pick lotto pick while Cade is here. All-Star free agents don't come to Detroit either. That means the only way you're getting another star next to Cade is by trading away other assets. A team with only one star is a sure fire way to play your way into NBA mediocrity - not good enough to compete for a championship but not bad enough to get a good lottery pick. Good teams that aren't hot NBA destinations get there by maximizing their draft picks and finding stars with house money (the draft). Just look at the teams in the finals - Tatum and Brown were both Celtics lotto draft picks that turned into stars. Curry and Klay were both GS lotto draft picks that turned in Stars.

I think this is a huge pick and probably the defining off-season for Weaver's rebuild. It's the first time he's had to make any real, meaningful decisions. Playing it safe to get a role player or a simple starter really doesn't do anything for you because you can sign those guys for affordable contracts in the NBA. This is one of your few remaining chances to hit on a draft pick that could make you a contender in a few years. So, if you think Mathurin is that guy, then you take him 100%. If not though, and you're just picking him because he's a safe role player, then that's a mistake in my eyes.

Edited June 1, 2022 by Betrayer