POLITICS SCHMALITICS

[oblong]

9 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

If Jesus was actually real and if he came back to Earth and MAGA saw that he actually looked more like what we think of as a modern day Arab/Middle Eastern person then he does a lily white guy they'd flip their lid.

and when he says "Why are you guys following this idiot Trump" they would immediately renounce their Christianity or call him "Fake news".

 

[Mr.TaterSalad]

1 minute ago, oblong said:

and when he says "Why are you guys following this idiot Trump" they would immediately renounce their Christianity or call him "Fake news".

When it comes to helping the poor and those in need the Christian Right are bootstrappers through and through. They are some of the most vocal opponents of public assistance programs like TANF benefits, SNAP, WIC, free/reduced school lunch programs, SChip for children's healthcare, Medicaid expansion, Obamacare with preexisting protection previsions, woman's healthcare initiatives, universal healthcare programs, mental health reforms, student debt forgiveness, and more. They are also proponents of Social Security privatization and ending Social Security altogether. They also worship a man who goes on profanity laced tirades, runs scam charities for veterans, and bilks people out of their money with a fraudulent real estate college/courses. Lest we not forget they oppose marriage for LGBTQ individuals and basic rights for them.

The Christian Right denounces Christianity every single day when they selectively live by the words of the Bible and selectively quote it as well. Some of my favorite Bible versus include.

Proverbs 14:31 Whoever oppresses a poor man insults his Maker, but he who is generous to the needy honors him.

Proverbs 19:17 Whoever is generous to the poor lends to the Lord, and he will repay him for his deed.

Matthew 19:24 Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.”

Job 34:17 Can he who hates justice govern? Will you condemn the just and mighty One? Is he not the One who says to kings, ‘You are worthless,’ and to nobles, ‘You are wicked,’ who shows no partiality to princes and does not favor the rich over the poor, for they are all the work of his hands?

[oblong]

It's the Dave Ramsey folks.  They see wealth as a virtue.  It means you did something right.

Tax cuts for the rich is in the bible somewhere isn't it?

[Mr.TaterSalad]

The Christian Right also seemingly has no problem donating billions of dollars and making a cottage industry of the very God they claim to support while millions go hungry or without adequate medical care. They do this by propping up grifters  like Billy Graham, Benny Hinn, Pat Robertson, Creflo Dollar, Jim and Tammy Faye Baker, Jimmy Swaggert, Joel Osteen, Joyce Meyer, Kenneth Copeland, and their mega churches with their tides and monetary donations. Imagine if all the money that went into building Joel Osteen's $10.5 million home and his mega church went to feeding and clothing the poor. Instead, when Hurricanes hit the Houston area Jesus hustler Joel Osteen closed his doors at the Lakewood Church to those in need.

[1984Echoes]

12 minutes ago, oblong said:

It's the Dave Ramsey folks.  They see wealth as a virtue.  It means you did something right.

Tax cuts for the rich is in the bible somewhere isn't it?

Only for the top 1%

[Motown Bombers]

I remember Dave Ramsey giving advice to a woman struggling with her finances. She had an embryo or sperm from her husband frozen a while ago so she could be artificially inseminated. Long story short, she made a $1,200 deposit and was going to lose it if she didn't go through with it. Clearly she couldn't afford a child and Dave Ramsey advised her to get pregnant to not lose the $1,200. 

[Motown Bombers]

This reminds me, how's Foxconn doing in Wisconsin? 

 

[Tigeraholic1]

1 hour ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

When it comes to helping the poor and those in need the Christian Right are bootstrappers through and through. They are some of the most vocal opponents of public assistance programs like TANF benefits, SNAP, WIC, free/reduced school lunch programs, SChip for children's healthcare, Medicaid expansion, Obamacare with preexisting protection previsions, woman's healthcare initiatives, universal healthcare programs, mental health reforms, student debt forgiveness, and more. They are also proponents of Social Security privatization and ending Social Security altogether. They also worship a man who goes on profanity laced tirades, runs scam charities for veterans, and bilks people out of their money with a fraudulent real estate college/courses. Lest we not forget they oppose marriage for LGBTQ individuals and basic rights for them.

The Christian Right denounces Christianity every single day when they selectively live by the words of the Bible and selectively quote it as well. Some of my favorite Bible versus include.

Proverbs 14:31 Whoever oppresses a poor man insults his Maker, but he who is generous to the needy honors him.

Proverbs 19:17 Whoever is generous to the poor lends to the Lord, and he will repay him for his deed.

Matthew 19:24 Again I tell you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who is rich to enter the kingdom of God.”

Job 34:17 Can he who hates justice govern? Will you condemn the just and mighty One? Is he not the One who says to kings, ‘You are worthless,’ and to nobles, ‘You are wicked,’ who shows no partiality to princes and does not favor the rich over the poor, for they are all the work of his hands?

+1,000 Well said.

[Mr.TaterSalad]

1 hour ago, Motown Bombers said:

This reminds me, how's Foxconn doing in Wisconsin? 

 

Another Biden economic win! Are you tired of winning yet?

[Motown Bombers]

 

[buddha]

2 hours ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

If Jesus was actually real and if he came back to Earth and MAGA saw that he actually looked more like what we think of as a modern day Arab/Middle Eastern person then he does a lily white guy they'd flip their lid.

this post says more about your prejudices than it does about christians.

[Mr.TaterSalad]

1 hour ago, buddha said:

this post says more about your prejudices than it does about christians.

I didn't realize the MAGA movement (of which the Christian Right belongs) embraced the Arab community and Americans of the Muslim faith. Last I heard they were all in for the MAGA Muslim Travel Ban and banning people from certain Arab states (Libya, Syria, Yemen). When I want to start banning Arab people from the Middle East and people of Muslim faith from coming to America like MAGA did get back to me.

Considering the geographic region he lived in, it's highly probable that Jesus was an Arabic Jew and considering MAGA's (of which the Christian Right belongs) warm embrace of Arab people, what makes you think they'd be tolerant of brown-skinned Jesus?

Edited January 21, 2022 by Mr.TaterSalad

[gehringer_2]

1 hour ago, buddha said:

this post says more about your prejudices than it does about christians.

3 hours ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

If Jesus was actually real and if he came back to Earth and MAGA saw that he actually looked more like what we think of as a modern day Arab/Middle Eastern person then he does a lily white guy they'd flip their lid.

Well, I think your 'prejudices are in the right place. Anyone who cares to actually read the book knows that the #1 target of Jesus' scorn were the organized 'church' and orthodox practitioners of his day. And of course according to the available reporting, it was 'churchmen' that did him in.

Edited January 21, 2022 by gehringer_2

[buddha]

1 hour ago, gehringer_2 said:

Well, I think your 'prejudices are in the right place. Anyone who cares to actually read the book knows that the #1 target of Jesus' scorn were the organized 'church' and orthodox practitioners of his day. And of course according to the available reporting, it was 'churchmen' that did him in.

jesus actually hung out with jewish "extremists" in his day.  if you're all for supporting religious extremists, let me know.

i think its difficult to extrapolate jesus political and religious views to today's politics.  both sides do it and neither is really all that successful.

[buddha]

1 hour ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

I didn't realize the MAGA movement (of which the Christian Right belongs) embraced the Arab community and Americans of the Muslim faith. Last I heard they were all in for the MAGA Muslim Travel Ban and banning people from certain Arab states (Libya, Syria, Yemen). When I want to start banning Arab people from the Middle East and people of Muslim faith from coming to America like MAGA did get back to me.

Considering the geographic region he lived in, it's highly probable that Jesus was an Arabic Jew and considering MAGA's (of which the Christian Right belongs) warm embrace of Arab people, what makes you think they'd be tolerant of brown-skinned Jesus?

yeah yeah jesus was brown, ha!  i showed you, you stereotypical ignorant white southern red neck!

you have no idea what jesus looked like.  neither do i. all we can do is guess.  heck, we know very little about his actual life and never will.  you bring this up to make a comment that you think religious southerners who disagree with your politics are racists.  got it.  but it has nothing to do with jesus or the interpretation of the bible.

the bible is such a big book of stories that anyone can take passages from it to justify just about anything.  slavery, capitalism, communism, gay rights, gay persecution, whatever you want.

how you quote the bible and what you choose to think in it is relevant depends on your world view and what you think is important.

like that meme about brown skinned jesus, it says more about you than it does about jesus.  

[Mr.TaterSalad]

35 minutes ago, buddha said:

yeah yeah jesus was brown, ha!  i showed you, you stereotypical ignorant white southern red neck!

you have no idea what jesus looked like.  neither do i. all we can do is guess.  heck, we know very little about his actual life and never will.  you bring this up to make a comment that you think religious southerners who disagree with your politics are racists.  got it.  but it has nothing to do with jesus or the interpretation of the bible.

the bible is such a big book of stories that anyone can take passages from it to justify just about anything.  slavery, capitalism, communism, gay rights, gay persecution, whatever you want.

how you quote the bible and what you choose to think in it is relevant depends on your world view and what you think is important.

like that meme about brown skinned jesus, it says more about you than it does about jesus.  

Here's the difference between me, many on the left, and the Christian Right. I am not religious and don't try to impose my agnostic nature on others and neither do many others on the left. Sure, people on the left have tried to have the word God removed from the dollar bill and the Ten Commandments or other religious markers taken off of public buildings, and I agree with them that we should because the state should not be endorsing any religion. But we aren't trying to make Christianity or any religion our national religion, we aren't trying to strip away a woman's right to choose, we aren't calling gay marriage an abomination and trying to block marriage equality, we aren't against adoption rights for gay/lesbian couples, we aren't refusing to bake cakes for wedding ceremonies involving LGBTQ individuals, etc. While we are pushing for equity on the left, we aren't trying to legislate morality in near the same way the Christian Right is. Removing the Ten Commandments from a public government space isn't even comparable to telling a gay couple they are an abomination and cannot marry whom them love (not saying you think it is either).

Furthermore, while there will never be conclusive evidence as to what Jesus looked like, there are historians and scholars who believe he quite possibly could have been a brown-skinned Jew given the region he was born in. It is probable that his biological parents were darker in complexion given they were from Nazareth and what people living in that region looked like at the time. It's highly unlikely that Jesus was the pasty white Barry Gibb look-a-like you see hanging on the cross at Church. And if we did get definitive evidence that he was brown skinned or that he looked like a sandy haired, blue eyed Swede, I wouldn't care one way or the other and neither would most people on the left. I'll tell you who would care a lot more than me or anyone on the left, the Christian Right. Why, because they've staked their claim on Jesus, who he was, and what he looked like. They've staked their claim on white grievance, ethnocentrism, and casting judgement on others who aren't like them. That doesn't sound like deep love to me, that sounds more like living in a world of fools.

Edited January 21, 2022 by Mr.TaterSalad

[gehringer_2]

31 minutes ago, buddha said:

jesus actually hung out with jewish "extremists" in his day.  if you're all for supporting religious extremists, let me know.

Not sure where you get that. There was an anti-Roman zealot movement that had been tied to the Macabees, but Jesus was most definitely not associated with that movement. Nor was he associated anything like the aims of a separatist movement such as the Essenes, though there is speculation that he knew of them. He was an itinerant preacher, the only thing extreme was the radical nature of what he preached and that was purely personnel, he never exhorted anyone to any kind of external action in support of what he preached. 

[buddha]

7 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

Not sure where you get that. There was an anti-Roman zealot movement that had been tied to the Macabees, but Jesus was most definitely not associated with that movement. Nor was he associated anything like the aims of a separatist movement such as the Essenes, though there is speculation that he knew of them. He was an itinerant preacher, the only thing extreme was the radical nature of what he preached and that was purely personnel, he never exhorted anyone to any kind of external action in support of what he preached. 

jesus's relationship with the essenes has been rexamined since the dead sea scrolls and many scholars believe he was influenced by them.  john the baptist too.

[buddha]

28 minutes ago, Mr.TaterSalad said:

Here's the difference between me, many on the left, and the Christian Right. I am not religious and don't try to impose my agnostic nature on others and neither do many others on the left. Sure, people on the left have tried to have the word God removed from the dollar bill and the Ten Commandments or other religious markers taken off of public buildings, and I agree with them that we should because the state should not be endorsing any religion. But we aren't trying to make Christianity or any religion our national religion, we aren't trying to strip away a woman's right to choose, we aren't calling gay marriage an abomination and trying to block marriage equality, we aren't against adoption rights for gay/lesbian couples, we aren't refusing to bake cakes for wedding ceremonies involving LGBTQ individuals, etc. While we are pushing for equity on the left, we aren't trying to legislate morality in near the same way the Christian Right is. Removing the Ten Commandments from a public government space isn't even comparable to telling a gay couple they are an abomination and cannot marry whom them love (not saying you think it is either).

Furthermore, while there will never be conclusive evidence as to what Jesus looked like, there are historians and scholars who believe he quite possibly could have been a brown-skinned Jew given the region he was born in. It is probable that his biological parents were darker in complexion given they were from Nazareth and what people living in that region looked like at the time. It's highly unlikely that Jesus was the pasty white Barry Gibb look-a-like you see hanging on the cross at Church. And if we did get definitive evidence that he was brown skinned or that he looked like a sandy haired, blue eyed Swede, I wouldn't care one way or the other and neither would most people on the left. I'll tell you who would care a lot more than me or anyone on the left, the Christian Right. Why, because they've staked their claim on Jesus, who he was, and what he looked like. They've staked their claim on white grievance, ethnocentrism, and casting judgement on others who aren't like them. That doesn't sound like deep love to me, that sounds more like living in a world of fools.

right, you dont agree with their political views so you call them all stupid and make fun of them.  i get it.

secondly, no one has any idea what jesus looked like.  no one.  you can guess, but that's all youre doing.

again, you bring this up to mock a stereotype of religious people that you have.  that's all.

 

[Mr.TaterSalad]

22 minutes ago, buddha said:

right, you dont agree with their political views so you call them all stupid and make fun of them.  i get it.

secondly, no one has any idea what jesus looked like.  no one.  you can guess, but that's all youre doing.

again, you bring this up to mock a stereotype of religious people that you have.  that's all.

I'm stereotyping the Christian Right? So you're saying the Christian Right isn't against a woman's right to choose, marriage equality, LGBTQ rights, parental and adoption rights for LGBTQ individuals, etc.? Separate but equal, segregation, Jim Crow, anti-Semitic laws, were promoted in the south up until the 1960's and Civil Rights came along. More recently same sex marriage bans and Muslim travel bans were promoted. Who was it promoting these laws most vocally? Politicians who considered themselves evangelicals and their followers on the right.

There are multiple studies that prove secular societies are more tolerant and that cultural changes proceed gains and improvements in wealth, education and democracy.

Study #1: Cross-National Correlations of Quantifiable Societal Health with Popular Religiosity and Secularism in the Prosperous Democracies

Study #2: Secularism and tolerance of minority groups predicts future prosperity of countries

Edited January 21, 2022 by Mr.TaterSalad

[1984Echoes]

1 hour ago, buddha said:

... you have no idea what jesus looked like.  neither do i. all we can do is guess...

On this point, you're full of shit.

He was Jewish, 2,000 years ago Mediterranean. 

We know exactly what he looked like (demographically, not photographically).

[buddha]

7 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said:

On this point, you're full of shit.

He was Jewish, 2,000 years ago Mediterranean. 

We know exactly what he looked like (demographically, not photographically).

no you dont.

[gehringer_2]

So, both my grandfathers were born in Anatolia, and both had blue eyes. The local joke in that part of the world was to call people that fair “crusader babies” because the locals knew well how those those traits got into the population. 🛡🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🛡

[1984Echoes]

14 minutes ago, buddha said:

no you dont.

Yeah, we do.

[1984Echoes]

14 minutes ago, buddha said:

no you dont.

What, do you have a blonde-haired blue-eyed portrait of Jesus on your wall so that's why you're so upset.. that we burst your bubble?