2022 DETROIT TIGERS REGULAR SEASON THREAD

[Hongbit]

 

[sabretooth]

16 hours ago, Tiger337 said:

Gathering Crowds.

There is no way to explain to young fans today how we looked forward to a half hour baseball highlights show each week. 

That was great stuff....GREAT stuff....the Gathering Crowds music was such a thrill to hear at Tiger Stadium, and the highlights on the old black-and-white screen above the CF bleachers.  LOVED it.

[sabretooth]

Honestly, whenever me and my friends would act out great plays, someone would always hum the trumpet line to that music.

Similarly, if someone was going to demonstrate a feat of strength, you had to do imitate the Six Million Dollar man flexing sound effect.

[lordstanley]

4 hours ago, oblong said:

Is that the show that had Lasorda on as the wizard?  I remember it. 

Yes, he shows up at 22 minute mark of that clip.

[casimir]

8 hours ago, Tenacious D said:

Tigers transaction.  Good stats in the last couple of seasons in the minors.  Not sure if he’s heading to Toledo or the big squad. 
 

 

For cash?  Sure, why not.

[mtutiger]

Unpopular opinion: I'm fine with it, given the time of the year and the nature of the injury that Kershaw just sustained.

Grab some bench, Passan

[SoCalTiger]

Man you have to let him try. What's the difference between 80 and 100 pitches. he was cruising effortlessly. Only 23 of those ! Thats' just over thinking the room.

[RatkoVarda]

nope. he missed playoffs last year because of injury. right call to pull him

[casimir]

9 hours ago, mtutiger said:

Unpopular opinion: I'm fine with it, given the time of the year and the nature of the injury that Kershaw just sustained.

Grab some bench, Passan

Originally I thought I was full into the Dodgers' decision.  I'm a bit more off of that now.  I guess if it were my decision, it'd be Kershaw's decision, but with stipulations.  The bullpen is going to be working and ready for a quick hook, which probably happens right after the first base runner.  Not only is player health a primary concern, but it was also a 3-0 lead, so it wouldn't be out of the realm to see the BP come into the game in the 8th & 9th if pitch count weren't a factor.  But I think early on pitch count is a factor.  How can it not be?  MLB & MLBPA has allowed expanded rosters to accommodate for a shortened spring training. 

LA hadn't allowed any other SP go past 5 in its 4 other starts.  Pitch counts were 78, 67, 62, 57 (bad outing).  They are also going into this season looking for a ring, not a perfect game, and its pretty obvious that's what they are working toward right now.

I think its easy to criticize the decision that was made, but I also think too often people can be too much favor of the immediate impact.

Here's a thought.  Maybe this was Kershaw's decision and Roberts is fine with taking the heat for it.  Maybe they are both in alignment that the long game is the priority (and maybe it took a little convincing).

[theroundsquare]

20 hours ago, sabretooth said:

Honestly, whenever me and my friends would act out great plays, someone would always hum the trumpet line to that music.

Similarly, if someone was going to demonstrate a feat of strength, you had to do imitate the Six Million Dollar man flexing sound effect.

Last night the Sux game was the MLB TV free game of the day so I tuned in to it for a bit.  The NBC sports Chicago broadcast had a highlights segment between innings and played this music.  That was the only good thing about watching a Sux game.

[mtutiger]

17 minutes ago, casimir said:

Here's a thought.  Maybe this was Kershaw's decision and Roberts is fine with taking the heat for it.  Maybe they are both in alignment that the long game is the priority (and maybe it took a little convincing).

This is pretty clearly the case. Was at the time of the decision, confirmed after the decision was made in post game comments.

If this is the case, I just don't get the attitude of Passan and others... just comes across as "old man yelling at cloud" stuff.  And I get it, long term I hope the sport looks for ways to maybe extend out pitchers more again... that seems to be what fans want.

But we need to be open to the idea that, with a 34 year old pitcher coming off a major injury and limited spring training, there's an argument that it isn't wise to tempt fate as well.

[oblong]

Are perfect games overrated?  You don't have to be great to throw one and your legacy doesn't change if you do.  Nobody says 'well this guy was better because he pitched a no hitter and the other guy didn't".  Nolan Ryan has the record and he's not on any serious lists for best pitcher ever.  

 

[mtutiger]

1 hour ago, oblong said:

Are perfect games overrated?  You don't have to be great to throw one and your legacy doesn't change if you do.  Nobody says 'well this guy was better because he pitched a no hitter and the other guy didn't".  Nolan Ryan has the record and he's not on any serious lists for best pitcher ever.  

 

The local sports talkers where I live kept bringing him up whlie talking about this subject this morning. The general gist seemed to be that, back in the good ol days, guys like Nolan and Luis Tiant would throw upwards of 200 pitches a game, which was good for the game, while a great pitcher like Kershaw can't go 80.

Setting aside the context (again, early in a season with an abbreviated spring training, guy coming off major injury), comparing anyone against Nolan Ryan in terms of longevity seems a bit much. 

Either way, as you suggest, the perfect game thing is definitely represented by a lot of pitchers who aren't great. I honestly forgot Phil Humber and Dallas Braden both threw one until DD/JP were talking about it on yesterday's broadcast.

Edited April 14, 2022 by mtutiger

[oblong]

They are a convenient grouping of stats that looks nice... like the Triple Crown.  But you can quite easily have a better pitched game with a walk or base hit than a no hitter.  

[Tiger337]

22 hours ago, Hongbit said:

 

Those ads were ubiquitous.  I always thought the kids lined up taking the exact same swing together looked kind of creepy.  

[chasfh]

I'm fine with what the Dodgers did because, come on, what team wouldn't want the guy who just effortlessly mowed down 21 straight guys on 80 pitches to continue on exactly the same for two more innings, so he could get his guaranteed perfect game in which he comes out of it at 100% health? No team would ever turn that opportunity down on those terms. But the Dodgers pulled him instead. Why?

It's obvious there was more going on than just that one discrete moment. Baseball had a super short spring training—basically half a training—and nearly every pitcher is not at 100% midseason form. Teams all around Baseball understand this. In the first 174 games of the season only one starting pitcher has gone 8, and only six have gone 7. In terms of pitches, only one has thrown even 100 pitches (Eovaldi, 101, against us yesterday). No one is stretching their pitchers at this point because teams need their pitchers to start additional games in a relatively healthy manner more than they need the super-cool headline in this particular game on April 13.

Add to the fact that 34-year-old Kersahw's season was cut short by injury last year, and it might have been borderline negligence to let him pitch to even one more batter.

[oblong]

I really liked Kapler's explanation on bunting against the Padres up 8 or whatever it was.  It's not just about that game.  It's about the series.  Make their bullpen work. Maybe by extending innings you make a guy unavailable tomorrow. I never heard that as a reason given before but it's totally appropriate.

 

[lordstanley]

1 hour ago, oblong said:

Are perfect games overrated?  You don't have to be great to throw one and your legacy doesn't change if you do.  Nobody says 'well this guy was better because he pitched a no hitter and the other guy didn't".  Nolan Ryan has the record and he's not on any serious lists for best pitcher ever.  

 

I think perfect games, unlike an odd no-hitter, do change your legacy or at least make you more memorable. I couldn’t name all 23 perfect game pitchers but I’d recognize all their names and probably if prompted tell you when they pitched it, within a year or two. 

[Hongbit]

12 minutes ago, chasfh said:

I'm fine with what the Dodgers did because, come on, what team wouldn't want the guy who just effortlessly mowed down 21 straight guys on 80 pitches to continue on exactly the same for two more innings, so he could get his guaranteed perfect game in which he comes out of it at 100% health? No team would ever turn that opportunity down on those terms. But the Dodgers pulled him instead. Why?

It's obvious there was more going on than just that one discrete moment. Baseball had a super short spring training—basically half a training—and nearly every pitcher is not at 100% midseason form. Teams all around Baseball understand this. In the first 174 games of the season only one starting pitcher has gone 8, and only six have gone 7. In terms of pitches, only one has thrown even 100 pitches (Eovaldi, 101, against us yesterday). No one is stretching their pitchers at this point because teams need their pitchers to start additional games in a relatively healthy manner more than they need the super-cool headline in this particular game on April 13.

Add to the fact that 34-year-old Kersahw's season was cut short by injury last year, and it might have been borderline negligence to let him pitch to even one more batter.

6 outs from perfection with a low pitch count is the only situation where you need to strongly consider changing the plan.   IMO , I felt they made a mistake not letting him try.  
 

I disagree on both devaluing a perfect game into being just a “super cool headline” and also that it would be borderline negligent to send him out past 80 pitches but that’s just a difference in opinion not a right or wrong thing.  
 

 

[casimir]

38 minutes ago, oblong said:

I really liked Kapler's explanation on bunting against the Padres up 8 or whatever it was.  It's not just about that game.  It's about the series.  Make their bullpen work. Maybe by extending innings you make a guy unavailable tomorrow. I never heard that as a reason given before but it's totally appropriate.

 

I didn't hear Kapler's comments, but I agree about making the bullpen work for the series and reducing the opponent's options for the next game if it is the same matchup.  If its a getaway game, maybe you just pack it up and move along.  Or then again, maybe not, maybe you try something out for the next series.  Maybe its advanced scouting, maybe it puts something to worry about in the mind of the opponent.

I also heard on MLB radio yesterday about the angle of run differential and how that is a tie breaker this season.  An extra run now is just as valuable as an extra run during a playoff push in September.

[oblong]

3 minutes ago, casimir said:

I didn't hear Kapler's comments, but I agree about making the bullpen work for the series and reducing the opponent's options for the next game if it is the same matchup.  If its a getaway game, maybe you just pack it up and move along.  Or then again, maybe not, maybe you try something out for the next series.  Maybe its advanced scouting, maybe it puts something to worry about in the mind of the opponent.

I also heard on MLB radio yesterday about the angle of run differential and how that is a tie breaker this season.  An extra run now is just as valuable as an extra run during a playoff push in September.

another good point.  Also it was the 6th inning. The giants scored their runs in 3 innings.  No reason the Padres couldn't do the same.

 

[chasfh]

2 hours ago, Hongbit said:

6 outs from perfection with a low pitch count is the only situation where you need to strongly consider changing the plan.   IMO , I felt they made a mistake not letting him try.  
 

I disagree on both devaluing a perfect game into being just a “super cool headline” and also that it would be borderline negligent to send him out past 80 pitches but that’s just a difference in opinion not a right or wrong thing.  
 

 

I do not work in the Dodgers’ front office. I’m a fan, too. I wanted to see Kershaw complete his perfect game, same as you. I wasn’t rooting for the Dodgers to take him out.

All I was saying is that I understand why the Dodgers did take him out, for all the reasons I posted above. From their perspective, it made the most sense. They wanted to both protect him/his arm, and to protect the team’s chances in subsequent games by keeping him as healthy and available to start as they possibly can. To the degree the Dodgers would benefit more from Kershaw throwing a perfect game than from simply winning the game, they didn’t see enough of a benefit increase to risk the health of their ace, and the effect on the team of his being hurt, to take the risk.

I can see why they did it, is all I was saying. I don’t know why I’m seeing it from that perspective. I can’t explain that. It must be my upbringing or something. It certainly doesn’t serve me well as a fan talking to other fans. I just do. It’s one of the many unique curses of being me. 😁

[Tiger337]

I would have been rooting for them to leave him in, but I understand why they didn't.    

[Dave Christian]

1 minute ago, Tiger337 said:

I would have been rooting for them to leave him in, but I understand why they didn't.    

My feelings as well!

[mtutiger]

17 minutes ago, chasfh said:

I do not work in the Dodgers’ front office. I’m a fan, too. I wanted to see Kershaw complete his perfect game, same as you. I wasn’t rooting for the Dodgers to take him out.

All I was saying is that I understand why the Dodgers did take him out, for all the reasons I posted above. From their perspective, it made the most sense. They wanted to both protect him/his arm, and to protect the team’s chances in subsequent games by keeping him as healthy and available to start as they possibly can. To the degree the Dodgers would benefit more from Kershaw throwing a perfect game than from simply winning the game, they didn’t see enough of a benefit increase to risk the health of their ace, and the effect on the team of his being hurt, to take the risk.

I can see why they did it, is all I was saying. I don’t know why I’m seeing it from that perspective. I can’t explain that. It must be my upbringing or something. It certainly doesn’t serve me well as a fan talking to other fans. I just do. It’s one of the many unique curses of being me. 😁

This may be closer to my feelings on it as well. I guess my initial post was more of a reaction to the reaction from a lot of the baseball media to the move by the Dodgers. And the reaction, imo, sort of stands in contrast to the concern that many of the same folks may had toward/about the players during the CBA.

Bringing it back to the Tigers, part of me sees it from the perspective of watching our team lose its most established starter last year a few weeks after throwing a 117 pitch no-hitter. It's probably not strictly that game that led Turnbull to end needing TJ, but it sort of brought home to me that there can be risks in overexposing guys.