Motown Bombers Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 1 minute ago, buddha said: see chas's post. Just now, Motown Bombers said: But the thing is, it's reported no other team offered him what he wanted. If the Tigers offer at at least $275 million was a lowball, then why didn't he sign a $300+ million contract? If no other team was offering more than the Tigers, it seems like they read the market just fine and all indications are no team was offering more. I would also be shocked if the Tigers offer didn't include an opt out after two years at the latest. You even mentioned uncharacteristically healthy since Correa has a bit of an injury history, the Tigers offer is a safe offer that probably still allowed him to chase a larger deal. Done Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kdog Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 They wanted good pr before the lockout. Objectively, the Baez and E-rod deals are reasonable value. But no chance they wanted to wait till after the new CBA when smart teams get good value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 3 minutes ago, chasfh said: I have come to believe that having to deal with the market for things like trades is the job Al likes the least. The guy is a scout, not a businessman. The trades have all the earmarks of someone procrastinating this unpleasant thing they have to do until the last minute, and then accepting the failure so they can just block out the experience and get past it. exactly. he is above his station. as you say, he was peter principled into a job he is not very good at. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 Just now, Motown Bombers said: Done ok, then you should understand why you were wrong before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 1 minute ago, buddha said: exactly. he is above his station. as you say, he was peter principled into a job he is not very good at. Seager, Semien, and Story all signed for more money than Correa, and Baez for that matter, so those GM's all misread the market? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 2 minutes ago, buddha said: ok, then you should understand why you were wrong before. Seems to me the guy that was expected to sign for the largest contract and ended up being the last one to sign for the least money is the one who misread the market. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 Just now, Motown Bombers said: Seager, Semien, and Story all signed for more money than Correa, and Baez for that matter, so those GM's all misread the market? semien was a terrible signing. seager will pan out. not sure about story. yes mb, there are other bad gms besides Al Avila. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 Seager will look ugly in year 8 of that contract. But that's not gonna matter to the Rangers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 1 minute ago, Motown Bombers said: Seems to me the guy that was expected to sign for the largest contract and ended up being the last one to sign for the least money is the one who misread the market. he set the market for next year and got the most money per year this year. this year had six free agents at his position, next year he's a free agent in a market that will have one premier player at baseball's premier position: him. in the meantime, he's making $35 million. oh, and now were stuck with javy baez for 6 years. are you happy with that scenario? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 and the conversation isnt really about whether correa played the market wrong, its whether avila did. so taking the idea that correa played it wrong, did avila take advantage of that? or did he low ball him, get rejected, and then sign an inferior player to a long term contract? he did. which is why - again - he played the market for correa wrong if they wanted correa (which they did if they offered him $275 million). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 19 minutes ago, chasfh said: Which is perfect for a marketplace. I am just pointing out that owners and front offices might respect people in the game for different reasons than fans might. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 5 minutes ago, buddha said: he set the market for next year and got the most money per year this year. this year had six free agents at his position, next year he's a free agent in a market that will have one premier player at baseball's premier position: him. in the meantime, he's making $35 million. oh, and now were stuck with javy baez for 6 years. are you happy with that scenario? He's trying next year for the contract he thought he would receive this year but didn't get because he misread the market. There were 5 other SS so there was no need for the Tigers to go to $350 million like he wanted. All the other SS signed and he had to settle for a contract with a guarantee of about 1/3 of what the Tigers offered. There is some risk given his injury history and no guarantee the market will be better next year. As for Baez, I'm not upset with the scenario yet. There's guarantee the Tigers are stuck with him for 6 years. We not even half way through the first year. He could have one of his patented hot streaks next year and opt out. We knew this was who he was which is why he cost less than Correa. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 4 minutes ago, buddha said: and the conversation isnt really about whether correa played the market wrong, its whether avila did. so taking the idea that correa played it wrong, did avila take advantage of that? or did he low ball him, get rejected, and then sign an inferior player to a long term contract? he did. which is why - again - he played the market for correa wrong if they wanted correa (which they did if they offered him $275 million). How did Avila lowball him when he offered him more money than any other team? Also, Avila didn't offer him that money, Illitch did. Avila would offer Baez as much as Illitch was willing to pay him. It seems more logical considering all the other SS signed for market value except Correa that Correa overplayed his hand. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 1 minute ago, Motown Bombers said: He's trying next year for the contract he thought he would receive this year but didn't get because he misread the market. There were 5 other SS so there was no need for the Tigers to go to $350 million like he wanted. All the other SS signed and he had to settle for a contract with a guarantee of about 1/3 of what the Tigers offered. There is some risk given his injury history and no guarantee the market will be better next year. As for Baez, I'm not upset with the scenario yet. There's guarantee the Tigers are stuck with him for 6 years. We not even half way through the first year. He could have one of his patented hot streaks next year and opt out. We knew this was who he was which is why he cost less than Correa. but that's what were saying: there was no reason to go to $350 million. the twins got him for $35. instead we have baez for $18 for the next six years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 the tigers wanted correa, they didnt get him, instead their rivals got him, but somehow that means avila did a good job? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 Just now, buddha said: but that's what were saying: there was no reason to go to $350 million. the twins got him for $35. instead we have baez for $18 for the next six years. What I'm saying is that Correa settled for $105 million after all the teams signed SS and he had no options. It's possible they could have waited but there is still no guarantee that Correa signs that deal with Detroit vs another team. They gave him the best offer, he declined, they moved on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 1 minute ago, buddha said: the tigers wanted correa, they didnt get him, instead their rivals got him, but somehow that means avila did a good job? You're more than welcome to find the words "good job" in any of my posts on this matter. I do believe Avila read the market just fine. I don't think Minnesota read the market at all. They were a team that was never going to be able to afford Correa but when he overplayed his hand, he fell into their lap. It seems unreasonable to expect Avila to read that Correa was going to misread his market and end up having to sign for much less guaranteed than anyone expected. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 Just now, Motown Bombers said: What I'm saying is that Correa settled for $105 million after all the teams signed SS and he had no options. It's possible they could have waited but there is still no guarantee that Correa signs that deal with Detroit vs another team. They gave him the best offer, he declined, they moved on. i understand. i'm saying that at the time they made that offer it was a low ball offer (look at what seager got). instead of waiting and seeing how the market played out, they paid javy baez. in the end, if they would have waited, they may have been able to get correa for $36 million this year. we'll never know. what we DO know is that correa did eventuay sign a deal for short term money. and that a rival team got a better player than us on a better deal, ergo why i think avila played the market badly. again. maybe if he had a history of making good deals i would be more charitable to him,but his history of poor management and timing leads me to believe he simply got played again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 1 minute ago, Motown Bombers said: You're more than welcome to find the words "good job" in any of my posts on this matter. I do believe Avila read the market just fine. I don't think Minnesota read the market at all. They were a team that was never going to be able to afford Correa but when he overplayed his hand, he fell into their lap. It seems unreasonable to expect Avila to read that Correa was going to misread his market and end up having to sign for much less guaranteed than anyone expected. could be. i think youre wrong, but we'll never know for sure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 Just now, buddha said: i understand. i'm saying that at the time they made that offer it was a low ball offer (look at what seager got). instead of waiting and seeing how the market played out, they paid javy baez. in the end, if they would have waited, they may have been able to get correa for $36 million this year. we'll never know. what we DO know is that correa did eventuay sign a deal for short term money. and that a rival team got a better player than us on a better deal, ergo why i think avila played the market badly. again. maybe if he had a history of making good deals i would be more charitable to him,but his history of poor management and timing leads me to believe he simply got played again. What Seager got doesn't matter. It's what teams were willing to pay Correa and reports are the Tigers offered him the most. Somehow Avila got played by Correa who ended up signing for $150 million less than what he wanted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 2 hours ago, microline133 said: And that draft netted Avila and Dirks. I remember when Dirks hurt his back and was on his way back doing rehab at Toledo I'm looking in the boxscore and he is attempting to steal bases. Daylight madness. He looked like he could have been serviceable player. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 45 minutes ago, chasfh said: I agree with you, Correa would have done the same deal with the Tigers if we'd come to him with it first. if the Tigers had signed Correa to the Twins deal he would be gone in a year just like he will be gone from Mn in a year. A one yr deal on SS really wasn't going to do the Tigers much good. Baez's two year deal doesn't do us that much good either, but a little more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 1 minute ago, gehringer_2 said: if the Tigers had signed Correa to the Twins deal he would be gone in a year just like he will be gone from Mn in a year. A one yr deal on SS really wasn't going to do the Tigers much good. Baez's two year deal doesn't do us that much good either, but a little more. Yeah I'm really not sure the point of a one year deal when it seemed unlikely the Tigers were going to be serious contenders, but I would be quite certain that the Tigers 10 year deal they offered Correa had an opt out probably no later than two years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aar000n Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 My only question is why can't the Tigers spend more? When the Wings had no cap they spent money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted June 16, 2022 Share Posted June 16, 2022 5 minutes ago, Aar000n said: My only question is why can't the Tigers spend more? When the Wings had no cap they spent money. What was big money in Hockey at that time is chump change in baseball today. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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