Cleanup in Aisle Lunatic (h/t romad1)

[chasfh]

15 hours ago, Tiger337 said:

If someone is planning something large scale like 9/11, a wall is not going to stop them.  A wall doesn't stop anyone who really wants to get here.  It's a waste of money.  

And not even Mexico’s money, as explicitly promised, that it’s a waste of.

[pfife]

Another theme was that there were people w/ the FBI that were there that were encouraging the insurrectionist rioters to go into the capitol.    I think a name they've raised is Ray Epps.   

Of course, no one says why they think Trump's FBI would do this to Trump's fans but instead it's Democrats fault somehow.

[Motor City Sonics]

15 hours ago, Tiger337 said:

If someone is planning something large scale like 9/11, a wall is not going to stop them.  A wall doesn't stop anyone who really wants to get here.  It's a waste of money.  

It's like the weed laws never really stopped anyone who wanted it.   It was a waste of resources and created more crime. 

[pfife]

2 hours ago, oblong said:

Rand wrote that book before she got her first social security check, correct?

 

1 hour ago, romad1 said:

Aaron Rogers thinks everyone should be an elite NFL QB or they aren't worth protecting from disease.

Apparently this is trending hard now.   I just mentioned it here after he said it on the show..... This is pretty good:

 

[ewsieg]

27 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

Canada has taken in thousands of Middle Eastern refugees and has vastly more Arabs and Muslims than Mexico. The odds of a Middle Eastern terrorist entering the US would be much higher on the Canadian border than the Mexican border. The fact is, one hasn't entered the US through either border. The argument is being made for tighter security on the Mexican border because a terrorist, most likely Muslim or Arab, will just walk across the border. That isn't even an issue. It's prioritizing imaginary crimes and fear mongering. The same people who have this concern of terrorists walking across the border don't always share that concern for the northern border. It's just a diversion for their real concern. 

It's much harder to get into the Canada in the first place though.  The only border they share is with the US and the refugees they let in are vetted, just like the refugee's we let into the United States.  Human trafficking into the US is a big business now though, and while the cartels make their money on Latin Americans mostly, they'll take money from anyone that gives it to them.  I've listened to interviews with the president of the border patrol union and he has stated that he has seen chinese, africans, and middle easterners come through the southern border illegally.  So in theory, if you stop that, you at least help ensure folks go through some process, either through the US or Canada, which even if you don't think Canada is doing the best they can, they certainly aren't at the level of having Cartels running the show up there.

In terms of national security, I do agree that the republicans appear to want to point to the southern border and make it appear to be bigger of an issue that it has ever proved to be.

 

[romad1]

There needs to be a 9/11 memorial sized monument to the Jan 6 events.  America should learn how close it came to fascist tyranny.  Never again.  

[pfife]

3 minutes ago, romad1 said:

There needs to be a 9/11 memorial sized monument to the Jan 6 events.  America should learn how close it came to fascist tyranny.  Never again.  

It really seems like it is getting totally whitewashed on the right.    Polling recently shows Approval of the insurrectionist rioters and skepticism that Biden won are both increasing in the GOP.  I think we're at a really important time in this nations history and we are not meeting the challenge. 

[Motor City Sonics]

10 minutes ago, romad1 said:

There needs to be a 9/11 memorial sized monument to the Jan 6 events.  America should learn how close it came to fascist tyranny.  Never again.  

Its going to happen again.   Maybe even on Thursday.  

[CMRivdogs]

Quote

It is interesting that Navarro believes that this version of events clears Trump of any responsibility for the violence on January 6. He writes in his book that he, Bannon, and Trump were “the last three people on God’s good Earth who want to see violence erupt on Capitol Hill” because “it was this violence that finally put an abrupt end to any hope the president had for taking back an election likely stolen from him.”

In other words: He, Bannon, and Trump were in the middle of executing a legal coup, which the violent coup attempt foiled. Therefore, he, Bannon and Trump couldn’t possibly be responsible for the violent attempted coup. Which is a defense, of sorts.

What Navarro is arguing is that he had a good coup in mind. The rioters were trying to do a bad coup. He’s the good guy. The rioters—and, funnily enough, Mike Pence, whom Navarro accuses of “betrayal”—are the bad guys who got in the way of this good coup. Navarro describes The Green Bay Sweep as “a well-thought-out plan based on sound, constitutional law and existing legislative precedent.”

“And all it required was peace and calm on Capitol Hill for it to unfold,” Navarro said.

 

https://www.thebulwark.com/the-good-coup/

These people are turning us into a third world country.

 

[gehringer_2]

1 hour ago, Motown Bombers said:

The fact is, one hasn't entered the US through either border

not quite true. There was Ahmed Ressam in 1999. Ferried to Washington State from Vancouver with 100lbs of explosives. Planned to set off a bomb at LAX. I thought there was one other group apprehended in BC a number of years ago as well but I can't find anything that matches. Maybe it was this same story and I had it muddled.

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/trail/inside/cron.html

Edited January 4, 2022 by gehringer_2

[Motown Bombers]

2 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

not quite true. There was Ahmed Ressam in 1999. Ferried to Washington State from Vancouver with 100lbs of explosives. Planned to set off a bomb at LAX.

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/trail/inside/cron.html

And border security caught him before he could enter the US. He also tried to enter on a ferry, something a wall wouldn't have been able to stop. He also tried entering from Canada and not Mexico. 

I also believe the the WTC bomber in 1993 entered from Canada. Seems like we have a Canadian border problem. 

[gehringer_2]

3 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

And border security caught him before he could enter the US. He also tried to enter on a ferry, something a wall wouldn't have been able to stop. He also tried entering from Canada and not Mexico. 

I also believe the the WTC bomber in 1993 entered from Canada. Seems like we have a Canadian border problem. 

Just grazing google there have been a couple of Al Qaeda plots caught inside Canada since 9/11, so their screening procedures aren't all that perfect.

[Tiger337]

34 minutes ago, romad1 said:

There needs to be a 9/11 memorial sized monument to the Jan 6 events.  America should learn how close it came to fascist tyranny.  Never again.  

MAGAs want an authoritarian leader.  I think that's pretty clear.  

[romad1]

9 minutes ago, Tiger337 said:

MAGAs want an authoritarian leader.  I think that's pretty clear.  

and a good chunk of the voting population wants things to return to normal pre-MAGA.  Those people are the most delusional and dangerous bloc.  "I'm not political, I just want to save the babies" is a large group we have to worry about. 

[oblong]

I wish I could find it but i saw a reference to what MAGA really is about is Christian Nationalism.  I know quite a few of these people.  To them the religious fight is the real battle and Trump somehow embodies that.  

 

[Motown Bombers]

I've seen people on Facebook share memes of Trump with light shining down on him as if he is the son of God. It is a religious cult. Donald Trump is a televangelist. I watched a Youtube video that compared him to Peter Popoff and the similarities were uncanny. 

[Mr.TaterSalad]

5 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

I've seen people on Facebook share memes of Trump with light shining down on him as if he is the son of God. It is a religious cult. Donald Trump is a televangelist. I watched a Youtube video that compared him to Peter Popoff and the similarities were uncanny. 

Just like a televangelist Jimmy Swaggert he's been caught having multiple affairs with multiple woman.

[RatkoVarda]

The GOP is a real threat to the USA; a homage to treason

 

[Archie]

35 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

I've seen people on Facebook share memes of Trump with light shining down on him as if he is the son of God. It is a religious cult. Donald Trump is a televangelist. I watched a Youtube video that compared him to Peter Popoff and the similarities were uncanny. 

As you can probably expect I visit a lot of conservative pages and sites.  I've never seen anything like what you mention or anything "worshiping" Donald Trump.  Its probably stuff made up on your liberal sites.

[Mr.TaterSalad]

1 hour ago, oblong said:

I wish I could find it but i saw a reference to what MAGA really is about is Christian Nationalism.  I know quite a few of these people.  To them the religious fight is the real battle and Trump somehow embodies that.  

I don't think that's what it's all about. For someone like my dad, a white male over 70, it's about racial grievance and the feeling that being white in America is under attack. It's also about white superiority over others. My dad is the least religious person you'll ever meet, so Christian Nationalism is far from his mind. He's a George Carlin when it comes to believing in God.

He wants whites to be recognized as superior beings in society. He read a book called the Bell Curve years ago and has used that book as evidence that whites, and specifically certain sects of Jewish people, are just smarter than blacks and brown-skinned Hispanic people. To him, it is a scientific, irrefutable fact that there are intellectual differences between blacks and whites.

He yearns for a time where blacks and whites live separate lives. Where schools, cultures, and daily lives were separate. He yearns for an America where you could go into polite society, the workplace, wherever and make jokes about Asians, Blacks, Jews, Muslims, etc. He also hates immigrants from the Central/South America, Mexico, the Middle East, Asia, and the Indo/Pakistan region. He believes that America is losing its heritage and standing in the world because of these people. He believes they are taking jobs from Americans and white people, driving down wages all the while.

He also hates woman and taking direction from woman. Woman are out to get him and ruin his life. Feminism has made it harder to get ahead as a man and has oppressed men's rights and standing in the world, all in the name of false equity in his mind.

To him, MAGA is about restoring white identity and a man's role in the world. He'll tell you he's a conservative and what not, but that's all bullshit. My dad doesn't have a pot to piss in after losing all his investments, savings, and home through multiple financial crashes since being bought out by his company in 1999. He literally lives off of Social Security, Medicare, and a part time job at a theater he works at. He's the last person that should be some strident fiscal conservative or libertarian.

When my father was a child he moved around a lot and ended up settling in Ecorse, MI. Ecorse was always a multi-racial working poor town with blacks, Hispanics, and whites all living in close quarters. My father and his two brothers were violently abused as children by their father and for a period of time, abandon by their mother after she left his dad. When he was 13 his dad threw him and his two brothers out of the house and they ended up going to Ecorse to live with their mom and sister. They lived poor as church mice in a two bedroom home.

After graduating high school in Ecorse my dad and his brothers were all drafted to fight in Vietnam. So after being abused and abandon as Children, they all had to go and kill for Uncle Sam in Vietnam. After Vietnam he went to work in the steel mills on Zugg Island and then got himself into the corporate world at AT&T once he got tired of working in the mills. He put himself through college at both UofM Dearborn and Wayne State. He spent 25+ years at AT&T until he was bought out when the company downsized during the dot com bubble era. From there, he would go onto lose his shirt financially and life savings through multiple economic downturns and stock market crashes.

My dad is a broken individual, who never got the help he needed from the horrific childhood he experienced. Abused by his father, abandon for a time by his mother to his abusive father, and asked to kill people in Vietnam. Those are life experiences that are hard to overcome and shape you into being a toxic and self destructive person. It's why my dad drinks, it's why he reads books like The Bell Curve to feel justified in his moral superiority, it's why he's racist, xenophobic, sexist, and more.

First and foremost, beyond his identity politics, he wants everyone to be equally miserable like he has been. I think for many in the MAGA community they are just miserable human beings and want others to feel the same way they do. So the hope and optimism of a Barack Obama, Joe Biden, Hillary Clinton, or Elizabeth Warren is a turnoff to them. Beyond being miserable, as I mentioned above, they want the whiteness of America restored, which to them is the Great Again part of MAGA. Having a woman, person of color, or someone of a different religion in power is a troubling sign that they are losing their grasp on what makes America, America. Again, you can talk to my dad about him being a small government conservative, but that's all bullshit. Misery loves company and so do racists. Intolerance, grievance, and misery are what really drive my dad towards the MAGA movement. I suspect it drives others as well.

For the record, I still have a great relationship with my dad and so does my sister. We argue about politics from time to time and he sends me stupid right-wing chain emails about current events or whatever and I just ignore and delete them. My father was good to me as a kid, when he wasn't drinking and yelling all the time. He could never bring himself to spank me or my sister as kids because he knew how much he hated it as a child. He is a far better father to us than he was husband to either of his ex-wives. That said, he's still who he is and wants America restored to some former glory it never really had.

Edited January 4, 2022 by Mr.TaterSalad

[1984Echoes]

Truth spoken by Tater...

[romad1]

Truth. 

All the worst demagogues feed on the broken and aggrieved. 

[Motown Bombers]

23 minutes ago, Archie said:

As you can probably expect I visit a lot of conservative pages and sites.  I've never seen anything like what you mention or anything "worshiping" Donald Trump.  Its probably stuff made up on your liberal sites.

It was my own aunt who posted it. I'm no longer friends with her and her profile is private. There is an actual Facebook group titled Trump is God with posts like this:

https://www.facebook.com/TrumpIsTheGod/

[Mr.TaterSalad]

2 minutes ago, romad1 said:

Truth. 

All the worst demagogues feed on the broken and aggrieved. 

Agreed! People are broken and aggrieved for different reasons. But as you said, demagogues like Trump in America, Orban in Hungry, Lukashenko in Belarus, they find their way into the minds of people like my dad and exploit what troubles them for political gain. You can be conservative or libertarian without being like that. Bob Dole, George H.W. Bush, George Will, Jack Kemp, Ron Paul, William F. Buckley, and countless others over generations of the conservative movement proved that. Unfortunately, they and their ilk have been casted aside for the Donald Trump's, Louie Gohmert's, Matt Gaetz's, Lauren Bobert's, and MGT's of the political world and it doesn't look like the Republican Party is coming back from that rink anytime soon.

[Jim Cowan]

I clicked on the link and saw the picture of Jesus guiding Trump's hand as he signed some documents.  How about a picture of Jesus guiding Trump's hand down between a woman's legs without her permission?