5/8 2:10 Tigers @ Astros

[mtutiger]

Bullpen games are what they are, but I dont understand why you can't bring in a pitcher who maybe has better peripherals or stuff to handle the inning with the top of the lineup.

It isn't like there's a rule saying the two long guys have to pitch back to back....

Edited May 8, 2022 by mtutiger

[chasfh]

Oh, look, were the worst team in the league again. How about that. 

[Dtrain72]

I know some here think this team would/could win a serieas against Cincy this season, I'm not sold on that at all...and Cincy scores more than these bad news Tigers so far...

 

[chasfh]

12 minutes ago, mtutiger said:

It feels like they'll lose by more today

Even Dan said just now on the radio that it felt like the Astros had the lead even when it was 0-0. When even the guy being paid to put a diplomatic spin on bad play says something like that, thats a real indication of how rotten things are under the hood.

[chasfh]

1 minute ago, Dtrain72 said:

I know some here think this team would/could win a serieas against Cincy this season, I'm not sold on that at all...and Cincy scores more than these bad news Tigers so far...

 

What are these numbers? There are four different possibilities. 

[mtutiger]

Just now, chasfh said:

Even Dan said just now on the radio that it felt like the Astros had the lead even when it was 0-0. When even the guy being paid to put a diplomatic spin on bad play says something like that, thats a real indication of how rotten things are under the hood.

Could be worse... Bally State Media is blacked out for me this series, but I can only imagine how they are polishing this turd

[1776]

It would be nice to think Avila and Hinch would sit down over coffee tomorrow and have a conversation about how this season, in less than 30 games, has turned into a total disaster. But, probably not.

[Jim Cowan]

And now it's Odorizzi on the ropes.  Back to back walks, 17 pitches, 1 out.

[chasfh]

2 minutes ago, 1776 said:

It would be nice to think Avila and Hinch would sit down over coffee tomorrow and have a conversation about how this season, in less than 30 games, has turned into a total disaster. But, probably not.

Avila gets much more of the blame than Hinch. Avila’s the guy who oversaw the roster construction in the years leading up to now. Hinch can only work with what’s been made available to him. 

[Dtrain72]

6 minutes ago, chasfh said:

What are these numbers? There are four different possibilities. 

 

[mtutiger]

5 minutes ago, chasfh said:

Avila gets much more of the blame than Hinch. Avila’s the guy who oversaw the roster construction in the years leading up to now. Hinch can only work with what’s been made available to him. 

Idk, Hinch makes some mistakes too. And the degree of disapproval of Al (not unjustified) kinda helps shield him from any scrutiny when he does make them.

Edited May 8, 2022 by mtutiger

[chasfh]

9 minutes ago, mtutiger said:

Idk, Hinch makes some mistakes too. And the degree of disapproval of Al (not unjustified) kinda helps shield him from any scrutiny when he does make them.

Oh, I’m not saying Hinch hasn’t made any mistakes. I’m saying he’s not the main reason, or even a big reason, we’re going to be 8-19 tomorrow morning. That’s mostly roster-driven, with a dollop of Pythagorean bad luck added in. I’m not convinced things like batting TORK! too high or running Jimenez out there with slim leads is actually evidence of Hinch losing us ballgames.

If there’s anything on the ground leading to poor performance, it’s probably coaching. I’m thinking specifically hitting coaching. And to the degree that Hinch is responsible for the hiring of Scott Coolbaugh, then yes, Hinch deserves the blame. 

Edited May 8, 2022 by chasfh

[Jim Cowan]

There was a time last year when people were saying that the Renaissance began on the day that Hinch was hired, not just on the field but throughout the organization.  Those front office changes, beefing up the analytics...Hinch's fingerprints were all over those.

Well the team is arguably worse now, and suddenly Hinch isn't in the front office anymore.

[Dtrain72]

2 minutes ago, chasfh said:

Oh, I’m not saying Hinch hasn’t made any mistakes. I’m saying he’s not the main reason, or even a big reason, we’re going to be 8-19 tomorrow morning. That’s mostly roster-driven, with a dollop of Pythagorean bad luck added in. I’m not convinced things like batting TORK! too high or running Jimenez our there with slim leads is actually evidence of Hinch losing us ballgames  

If there’s anything on the ground leading to poor performance, it’s probably coaching. I’m thinking specifically hitting coaching. 

The ghost of Lloyd McClendon haunts this team...and he's not even deceased.

Edited May 8, 2022 by Dtrain72

[Jim Cowan]

The Tigers have thrown 89 pitches through 4 innings.

[mtutiger]

4 minutes ago, chasfh said:

Oh, I’m not saying Hinch hasn’t made any mistakes. I’m saying he’s not the main reason, or even a big reason, we’re going to be 8-19 tomorrow morning. That’s mostly roster-driven, with a dollop of Pythagorean bad luck added in. I’m not convinced things like batting TORK! too high or running Jimenez out there with slim leads is actually evidence of Hinch losing us ballgames.

If there’s anything on the ground leading to poor performance, it’s probably coaching. I’m thinking specifically hitting coaching. 

I am absolutely convinced that this ballgame wouldn't be 4-0 right now if he had chosen to pick just about any other reliever out of that bullpen to pitch to the top of the Astros order, as opposed to the guy with the absolute worst peripherals. And saved that guy for the following inning to begin by facing the lower part of the order.

But somehow, that's probably Al's fault.

Edited May 8, 2022 by mtutiger

[1776]

5-0

[mtutiger]

5 minutes ago, Jim Cowan said:

There was a time last year when people were saying that the Renaissance began on the day that Hinch was hired, not just on the field but throughout the organization.  Those front office changes, beefing up the analytics...Hinch's fingerprints were all over those.

Well the team is arguably worse now, and suddenly Hinch isn't in the front office anymore.

It's ridiculous, I know.

[Dtrain72]

[chasfh]

5 minutes ago, Jim Cowan said:

There was a time last year when people were saying that the Renaissance began on the day that Hinch was hired, not just on the field but throughout the organization.  Those front office changes, beefing up the analytics...Hinch's fingerprints were all over those.

Well the team is arguably worse now, and suddenly Hinch isn't in the front office anymore.

Hinch had nothing to do with any of the roster decisions prior to 2021, but the organization is overwhelmingly populated with players from before 2021. 

[romad1]

Is this the most punchless you've seen a team that was supposed to be good?  It looks a bit like the 2008 team but that team had a young Miggy and others who could put the ball in play.  Its like one team is using a different ball (and that never happens, right Rob Manfred?)

[mtutiger]

Just now, chasfh said:

Hinch had nothing to do with any of the roster decisions prior to 2021, but the organization is overwhelmingly populated with players from before 2021. 

But when they got it going and turned it around last year with the big club, it was all because of Hinch and the coaching staff. Too bad the old forum is gone, because the receipts would be easy to find. And when it happens again this year (because it probably will to a degree), it'll be because of Hinch.

So now that things aren't going, why does Hinch avoid credit for that as well? It logically doesn't make sense.

I like AJ and hope he manages here for a long time, but the fanbase sort of wants it both ways when they credit him in the good times and deflect blame from him during the bad.

[Sports_Freak]

1 minute ago, mtutiger said:

But when they got it going and turned it around last year with the big club, it was all because of Hinch and the coaching staff. Too bad the old forum is gone, because the receipts would be easy to find. And when it happens again this year (because it probably will to a degree), it'll be because of Hinch.

So now that things aren't going, why does Hinch avoid credit for that as well? It logically doesn't make sense.

I like AJ and hope he manages here for a long time, but the fanbase sort of wants it both ways when they credit him in the good times and deflect blame from him during the bad.

The whole team is slumping at once. What would you do, just release them all? Gotta ride it out. I call him out when I think he screws up, like putting W. Castro in LF. I don't like him out there with Haase on the bench.

[Jim Cowan]

Just now, Sports_Freak said:

The whole team is slumping at once. What would you do, just release them all? Gotta ride it out. I call him out when I think he screws up, like putting W. Castro in LF. I don't like him out there with Haase on the bench.

It was worse than that, Hill was on the bench.  

[chasfh]

2 minutes ago, mtutiger said:

But when they got it going and turned it around last year with the big club, it was all because of Hinch and the coaching staff. Too bad the old forum is gone, because the receipts would be easy to find. And when it happens again this year (because it probably will to a degree), it'll be because of Hinch.

So now that things aren't going, why does Hinch avoid credit for that as well? It logically doesn't make sense.

I like AJ and hope he manages here for a long time, but the fanbase sort of wants it both ways when they credit him in the good times and deflect blame from him during the bad.

That's fine, you can conclude that Hinch is largely at fault. I disagree that he is largely at fault. We can leave it there.

I'm not saying that Hinch is blameless, and I've begun to explain as much, but people want to believe that's what I'm saying regardless, so ... 🤷‍♂️