Tiger337 Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 (edited) 4 hours ago, chasfh said: There’s a chance buyers receive the shoes, but they will fall apart on the wearer’s feet within a month, provided they’re not too uncomfortable to keep on their feet right out of the box. You can get the same sneakers (without the ugly paint job) for $19.99 at Walmart. Inflation 2000%. Dump campaigns on inflation and then sells ridiculously over priced shoes, but people are still too dumb to see it. Edited February 18 by Tiger337 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted February 19 Author Share Posted February 19 16 hours ago, Tiger337 said: You can get the same sneakers (without the ugly paint job) for $19.99 at Walmart. Inflation 2000%. Dump campaigns on inflation and then sells ridiculously over priced shoes, but people are still too dumb to see it. And the best part is that he will say if it weren’t for Biden and inflation he could have sold the sneakers for $99. But if you buy today you will be sending a message to the corrupt Biden that you can’t keep America from being great again … Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMRivdogs Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 Those sneakers really clash with the MAGA hats. No self respecting MAGA would be caught dead or alive wearing that combination of gold and scarlet. It definitely clashes with the orange bronzer. But there are no self respecting MAGAs 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 On 2/18/2024 at 8:03 AM, casimir said: Not only will he not pay any of these fines, he's not going to be jailed either. I understand the defeatism / refrain here because it is an ever-persistent feature of the Trump era, but as far as the fines go, they will have to be paid one way or another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 1 hour ago, mtutiger said: I understand the defeatism / refrain here because it is an ever-persistent feature of the Trump era, but as far as the fines go, they will have to be paid one way or another. He's not paying them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 3 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: He's not paying them. You might be right, but they will be paid one way or another. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMRivdogs Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 It was rigged.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 3 hours ago, mtutiger said: I understand the defeatism / refrain here because it is an ever-persistent feature of the Trump era, but as far as the fines go, they will have to be paid one way or another. What is the mechanism to get the money? When he doesn’t write a check what happens? I’m not smart enough to understand accounting rules to rule out the ability of lawyers and such to hide money under other entities. I’m not being argumentative or rhetorical. Maybe Elon will pay it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 (edited) 14 minutes ago, oblong said: What is the mechanism to get the money? When he doesn’t write a check what happens? I’m not smart enough to understand accounting rules to rule out the ability of lawyers and such to hide money under other entities. I’m not being argumentative or rhetorical. Maybe Elon will pay it. https://apnews.com/article/trump-fraud-carroll-fines-82d423b8e7a7f9a32470729c5f4410e5 Quote What if Trump simply refuses to pay the money? Legally, Trump would face the same consequences as any American refusing to pay a legal judgment, including the possibility of having his assets seized and his wages garnished. “The president is not a king and the president’s assets are not sacrosanct just because he happened to be the president,” Weiner said. On Friday, the judge overseeing Trump’s civil fraud case appointed an additional monitor to oversee the Trump Organization’s finances, finding they could not be trusted to follow the law. In the event that Trump refused to hand over payments, the courts would have additional discretion to go after Trump and his businesses. “They have a huge amount of power particularly for someone like Trump who has physical assets inside the state,” Thomas, the law professor, said. “The court might say we’re going to freeze your bank account. Or even worse, they could say, ’We’re seizing Trump Tower and we’re putting it up for sale.’” The whole article is informative and is worth a read as well... I understand the skepticism that anything will happen to him criminally, and honestly take more of a "seeing is believing" approach to it myself. But on the civil side, there's just not a lot of recourse. And I think his attitude toward these cases suggest they hurt as well. Edited February 19 by mtutiger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 Yank Mar-a-Lago from underneath his feet and sell it at auction. If it doesn't cover the bill... New York Trump Tower next. And... keep on going until... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 6 hours ago, mtutiger said: I understand the defeatism / refrain here because it is an ever-persistent feature of the Trump era, but as far as the fines go, they will have to be paid one way or another. Hold on with the defeatism. 2 hours ago, mtutiger said: https://apnews.com/article/trump-fraud-carroll-fines-82d423b8e7a7f9a32470729c5f4410e5 The whole article is informative and is worth a read as well... I understand the skepticism that anything will happen to him criminally, and honestly take more of a "seeing is believing" approach to it myself. But on the civil side, there's just not a lot of recourse. And I think his attitude toward these cases suggest they hurt as well. There it is. I’m in the seeing is believing camp. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motor City Sonics Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 10 minutes ago, casimir said: Hold on with the defeatism. There it is. I’m in the seeing is believing camp. As am I. I think he'll basically get away with everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 The facts in the article speak for themselves. I'd encourage people to read it to understand what the implications of the recent civil rulings are versus just falling back on unverifiable and unfalsifiable mantras to explain everything. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 2 hours ago, 1984Echoes said: Yank Mar-a-Lago from underneath his feet and sell it at auction. If it doesn't cover the bill... New York Trump Tower next. And... keep on going until... None of that is going to happen. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 7 minutes ago, mtutiger said: The facts in the article speak for themselves. I'd encourage people to read it to understand what the implications of the recent civil rulings are versus just falling back on unverifiable and unfalsifiable mantras to explain everything. Nothing about Trump ever conforms to history. You keep talking about Trump like he is a normal person. People have talking for 8 years about stuff that's going to happen to him. None of it ever happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 6 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: None of that is going to happen. Dude... I'm living in Never-Neverland right now... It ABSOLUTELY is going to happen... 😉 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 Just now, Tiger337 said: Nothing about Trump ever conforms to history. You keep talking about Trump like he is a normal person. 1. Trump has already paid out some of the money in the E. Jean Carroll case, per the article. 2. If, hypothetically, he does not pay, the State of New York has legal recourse upon which to get said money. As mentioned in the article above. That is something that is completely independent of Trump's actions. 5 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: People have talking for 8 years about stuff that's going to happen to him. None of it ever happens. These rulings are things that actually did happen to him, his business and associates (including his spawn Don Jr. And Eric). Hence why we are discussing them. Unless people are asserting that NYS will simply not enforce them at all, which I find to be unlikely, the money will be paid out one way or another. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 New York state is not a small business owner. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted February 20 Share Posted February 20 14 hours ago, Motown Bombers said: New York state is not a small business owner. https://www.marketwatch.com/story/meet-the-former-organized-crime-prosecutor-now-overseeing-the-trump-organization-077d4c34 Quote For the first time in the history of the Trump Organization, many of the key financial decisions will not be made by a Trump. Following a ruling by a New York state judge Friday barring Donald Trump and his two eldest sons from having any role in running the real-estate empire that was founded in 1927 by the former president’s father, the company has been placed in the hands of a court-appointed monitor. Barbara Jones, a lawyer and former federal judge, will now have total oversight of the real-estate conglomerate that played a central role in shaping the public image that helped Trump win the White House in 2016. Jones, 76, has been serving as a monitor at the Trump Organization since November 2022, when she was appointed by New York State Supreme Court Justice Arthur Engoron to oversee certain financial matters at the company. The appointment came shortly after New York Attorney General Letitia James brought civil fraud charges against Trump and members of his family, accusing them of ripping off banks and insurers by routinely misstating the value of their properties. Following Jones’s initial appointment, the company was required to inform her of any financial move it made after the fact. But now it will need her approval before taking any steps involving financial disclosures to third parties — primarily meaning loan applications to banks. In a way, they kind of are with the latest ruling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted February 20 Share Posted February 20 What I meant is that New York state has more resources than Trump and won't be bullied like a small business. They can keep fighting him. At the very least, Trump is going to spend the rest of his life paying lawyers. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted February 20 Share Posted February 20 (edited) 26 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said: What I meant is that New York state has more resources than Trump and won't be bullied like a small business. They can keep fighting him. At the very least, Trump is going to spend the rest of his life paying lawyers. For sure, I know what you meant... because NYS contains NYC and Wall Street, I think people underestimate the degree to which the NYS has experience in going after white collar fraud and enforcing consequences on judgments. But even still, the fact that the father and sons are barred from running the business for three years and there's a court-appointed monitor overseeing the company that has to approve all third party transactions is a pretty good example of there being actual consequences to these rulings. Or that Trump cannot take out loans with any bank chartered through the NYS Department of Financial Services, is another example of an actual consequence of this ruling that has an impact, especially when you consider how many banks are chartered in New York and the impact that would have on institutions outside of New York evaluating the credit-worthiness of Trump. I don't know the degree to which any of this impacts or doesn't impact the Presidential Election, obviously... but the point being made is that comparing the criminal cases and the civil cases against Trump are like comparing apples and oranges. We very well may not see anything come of the criminal stuff for many reasons, but even today, there are real world consequences playing out in the civil cases. That's just reality. Edited February 20 by mtutiger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewsieg Posted February 20 Share Posted February 20 Maybe Trump will become a pastor and find ways to hide money like Kwame. Without reading that article due to some time constraints, I suspect the E Jean Carrol and Trump org cases are different. (personal vs corporate responsibility) I would expect NY would be able to garnish profit from Trump org if they had to. Plus they put a court appointed monitor to oversee all financial transactions. I'm not sleeping on the idea that Trump and his family will try and stall or find a way to hide money away from the monitor, but I just don't think they'll be successful. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewsieg Posted February 20 Share Posted February 20 2 hours ago, mtutiger said: I don't know the degree to which any of this impacts or doesn't impact the Presidential Election, obviously... but the point being made is that comparing the criminal cases and the civil cases against Trump are like comparing apples and oranges. We very well may not see anything come of the criminal stuff for many reasons, but even today, there are real world consequences playing out in the civil cases. That's just reality. I'm not sure either, but it does worry me a bit that this Trump Org case and now the Bragg case looks like it's next.... I just think it'll be easy for Trump supporters to ignore it with simple but legitimate arguments like "of course he'll lose a fraud case when no one has been defrauded in a NYC court" and "really, Stormy Daniels still?" My concern is by the time GA comes around some on the fence GOP'ers might just ignore it. Hope not, but even as a never Trumper that thinks he's crooked as hell, I see that 300m+ fine and think it's a bit crazy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted February 20 Author Share Posted February 20 23 hours ago, mtutiger said: https://apnews.com/article/trump-fraud-carroll-fines-82d423b8e7a7f9a32470729c5f4410e5 The whole article is informative and is worth a read as well... I understand the skepticism that anything will happen to him criminally, and honestly take more of a "seeing is believing" approach to it myself. But on the civil side, there's just not a lot of recourse. And I think his attitude toward these cases suggest they hurt as well. I think the issue is the political cost of going after his money in a heavy-handed manner, and feeding into his victim complex. Hey, I am all for bankrupting the mother****er, same as everyone else here is, but there is not just one guy or his (crime) family being affected here. It's his red hat army up to 100 million strong. They need to go after the money, for sure, but they can't do so while ignoring the potential for social chaos once they do. They have to take it into account and figure out a way to mitigate that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted February 20 Author Share Posted February 20 4 hours ago, Motown Bombers said: What I meant is that New York state has more resources than Trump and won't be bullied like a small business. They can keep fighting him. At the very least, Trump is going to spend the rest of his life paying lawyers. Thanks a lot, now I have coffee sprayed all over my laptop and desk. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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