1984Echoes Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 10 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said: Why not both? Go for it... I will accede to your request. He is both the biggest douchebag on the planet, and in all of mankind's history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 (edited) 16 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said: Why not both? I know this is probably the point (ie. owning the libs, etc.) but it never ceases to amaze that people tolerate (or even like) the kind of behavior out of their leaders that they would ground their kids for a month over at home. I love this country, but in many ways we are not a serious people. Edited October 19, 2021 by mtutiger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 11 hours ago, Tiger337 said: ... I don't even think he incited the riot.... I disagree with that. He was broadcasting his request for that in December. He gave a speech that said "be tough" (in code: go use violence to help me remain in power). He absolutely incited the riot. They only came there because he asked them to... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 1 minute ago, mtutiger said: but in many ways we are not a serious people that's a good description. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ben9753 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 21 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said: that's a good description. If you follow Tim Nichols on twitter, that’s basically his mantra. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 55 minutes ago, mtutiger said: What a douchecanoe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 10 minutes ago, ben9753 said: If you follow Tim Nichols on twitter, that’s basically his mantra. The conventional wisdom would be to say that comes from having life too easy, so you would think growing economic insecurity, 20 years of war and now 3/4 of a million deaths might be somewhat of an antidote to it. Hasn't seemed to have been. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 Just now, Tiger337 said: 55 minutes ago, mtutiger said: What a douchecanoe Expand People are going to say the same kind of thing when Trump dies (because he'll deserve it) and his supporters are going to be indignant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 52 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: I disagree with that. He was broadcasting his request for that in December. He gave a speech that said "be tough" (in code: go use violence to help me remain in power). He absolutely incited the riot. They only came there because he asked them to... I think the rioters and their organizers had been waiting for the opportunity to do something like that for a long time. He gave them permission. I am not absolving him of blame. He is 100% guilty. I just don't think he's the mastermind behind anything. He makes stuff up as he goes along. Whatever makes him look good or gives him some kind of advantage at the moment. Whatever it takes to sell his product (which is Donald Trump) 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 1 hour ago, mtutiger said: I know this is probably the point (ie. owning the libs, etc.) but it never ceases to amaze that people tolerate (or even like) the kind of behavior out of their leaders that they would ground their kids for a month over at home. I love this country, but in many ways we are not a serious people. The United States is a great country. Perhaps, we don't deserve what we have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archie Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 19 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: The United States is a great country. Perhaps, we don't deserve what we have. Yes it is a great country but we deserve a heck of a lot better than we have in office now and the one before. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, Archie said: Yes it is a great country but we deserve a heck of a lot better than we have in office now and the one before. Who voted for them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, gehringer_2 said: The conventional wisdom would be to say that comes from having life too easy, so you would think growing economic insecurity, 20 years of war and now 3/4 of a million deaths might be somewhat of an antidote to it. Hasn't seemed to have been. On the micro level, I do believe there's more that unites than divides us. But on the macro level, there are a lot of forces working to pull people on all sides apart. Starting with social and partisan media sources. Edited October 19, 2021 by mtutiger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archie Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 36 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: Who voted for them? There wasn't much of a choice and hasn't been for a few elections now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archie Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 37 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: Who voted for them? I don't know who voted for Biden since they were mostly mail in ballots. Sorry I couldn't resist since you asked.😁 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 15 minutes ago, Archie said: There wasn't much of a choice and hasn't been for a few elections now. There were a variety of choices in the primaries, but the people chose Trump, Clinton and Biden. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 16 minutes ago, Archie said: I don't know who voted for Biden since they were mostly mail in ballots. Sorry I couldn't resist since you asked.😁 You don't know who anyone voted for in person either since all votes are private. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 2 hours ago, 1984Echoes said: He is both the biggest douchebag on the planet, and in all of mankind's history. I agree with this. You could argue that their have been worse human beings in the history of the world, but it would be hard to argue that there have been bigger douchebags. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 (edited) 34 minutes ago, Archie said: There wasn't much of a choice and hasn't been for a few elections now. I understand this POV, but isn't the design of our system part of the problem? We have an antiquated system of elections which is both a "first past the post" system and one dependent on a system that assigns electors based on states rather than popular vote. Which, theoretically, if neither candidate wins the majority of said electors, ends up being decided by Congress You couldn't possibly design a system of government more likely to encourage less viable choices for voters to choose from if you tried. But at the same time, many who complain about having to choose the lesser of two evils (particularly on the right) tend not to want to look at the flaws that bring us to this place. Edited October 19, 2021 by mtutiger 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted October 19, 2021 Author Share Posted October 19, 2021 1 hour ago, Tiger337 said: I think the rioters and their organizers had been waiting for the opportunity to do something like that for a long time. He gave them permission. I am not absolving him of blame. He is 100% guilty. I just don't think he's the mastermind behind anything. He makes stuff up as he goes along. Whatever makes him look good or gives him some kind of advantage at the moment. Whatever it takes to sell his product (which is Donald Trump) To 1984's point, there is a distinction between "masterminding" and "Inciting". Trump definitely incited the riot. The thing that distresses me is how the right wing media are whitewashing the riot, which we have clear video evidence of, as being a peaceful protest, and how much traction that gaslighting is getting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 2 minutes ago, chasfh said: The thing that distresses me is how the right wing media are whitewashing the riot, which we have clear video evidence of, as being a peaceful protest, and how much traction that gaslighting is getting. Yes, that is very disturbing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 18 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: I agree with this. You could argue that their have been worse human beings in the history of the world, but it would be hard to argue that there have been bigger douchebags. There* I hate not being able to edit. 😃 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archie Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 30 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: There were a variety of choices in the primaries, but the people chose Trump, Clinton and Biden. I'm still surprised Trump made it through the primary. I beleive Clinton and Biden were more the choice of the democrat party seeing how and when some of their competition dropped out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Archie said: I'm still surprised Trump made it through the primary. I beleive Clinton and Biden were more the choice of the democrat party seeing how and when some of their competition dropped out. The reality with Democratic Primary politics is that the most important constituency in the party is African American voters, particularly Gen-X and Above and particularly AA Women. In both cases (particularly with Biden, but with Clinton as well) the writing was on the wall as soon as South Carolina happened, because it foreshadowed everything that would occur once Super Tuesday hit. Clinton and Biden were more establishment candidates, but the structure of Democratic politics simply elevates establishment candidates in a way that Republican politics doesn't because of the importance of that constituency and what they tend to value in candidates. Edited October 19, 2021 by mtutiger Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted October 19, 2021 Share Posted October 19, 2021 20 minutes ago, Archie said: I'm still surprised Trump made it through the primary. I beleive Clinton and Biden were more the choice of the democrat party seeing how and when some of their competition dropped out. One could argue that Trump was the choice of the media as they haven't stopped talking about him for five years. They have enriched each other greatly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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