Grant traded to Portland

[RandyMarsh]

6 minutes ago, Betrayer said:

If we grab Hayward and let's say pick 13 from Charlotte, then this immediately becomes a really good move.

Grant for:

Pick #13
mid-20s 2025 1st round pick
36 instead of 47 in this year's draft
Hayward
2026 2nd round pick

Is a solid haul.

Yeah I would be happy with that. Also it's hard to say how Milwaukee's surrounding cast will look in 24-25 but with them relying so heavily on Giannis if he were to miss time and get injured that season we could get lucky and that pick could end up in the lottery. It's top 4 protected though but even a mid to late lottery pick would be a welcome bonus to the trade, assuming we still have that pick by then of course. 

[RandyMarsh]

But as Buddha has pointed out, taking on salary for extra draft capital is something Weaver has yet to do here so who knows if he is thinking that way, if I were a betting man I'd be more in the camp of him wanting the space to sign guys but who knows.  

[TP_Fan]

This move will be judged on what he does next. It seems obvious to maximize cap space for 23 and 24.  If you spend it all now, then it’s all questionable. If you take on other teams bad contracts for their 1st round pick(s) then we are cooking. 

[NYLion]

Boy am I a dummy for suggesting that Grant had more value than Wood. Weak value but it seems pretty obvious that Weaver is planning something big this offseason but clearing all that cap space and I'm pretty sure we won't like it since there are no stars out there worth cashing out on.

This also means that Murray is more than likely the pick which I'm also not a fan of. Not a good start to the offseason from my point of view.

Lol at you guys thinking that Weaver would do something smart by trading for Hayward with the picks attached. I fully expect Weaver to max Bridges.

Edited June 22, 2022 by NYLion

[buddha]

1 minute ago, RandyMarsh said:

But as Buddha has pointed out, taking on salary for extra draft capital is something Weaver has yet to do here so who knows if he is thinking that way, if I were a betting man I'd be more in the camp of him wanting the space to sign guys but who knows.  

brunson on a max and bagley.

it will be a perfect weaver offseason only if he signs a guy and then stretches him to get MOAR CAP SPACE to sign another big man.

[TP_Fan]

Just now, NYLion said:

Boy am I a dummy for suggesting that Grant had more value than Wood. Weak value but it seems pretty obvious that Weaver is planning something big this offseason but clearing all that cap space and I'm pretty sure we won't like it since there are no stars out there worth cashing out on.

This also means that Murray is more than likely the pick which I'm also not a fan of. Not a good start to the offseason from my point of view.

I don’t think this trades tips the hand on the pick at all. And all reports have the pistons not taking Murray.

And I’m ok signing Ayton if they decide to do that.  Just don’t sign two guys. 

[RandyMarsh]

Wood fetched pick 26 and Houston had to take on salary in doing so. we got pick 36, took on no salary and got a future 1st and 2nd as well. Granted those last 2 picks are down the road but I think this was better than what Houston got for Wood. 

Edited June 22, 2022 by RandyMarsh

[NYLion]

1 minute ago, TP_Fan said:

I don’t think this trades tips the hand on the pick at all. And all reports have the pistons not taking Murray.

And I’m ok signing Ayton if they decide to do that.  Just don’t sign two guys. 

Which reports? Like 90% of the mocks have them taking Murray with a few on Mathurin. I know that a lot of folks here really like Murray but I'm very underwhelmed by him, he's a #3 option at BEST if he reaches his max potential IMO and is more likely a role player that will never be as good as Grant even. 

[NYLion]

3 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:

Wood fetched pick 26 and Houston had to take on salary in doing so. we got pick 36, took on no salary and got a future 1st and 2nd as well. Granted those last 2 picks are down the road but I think this was better than what Houston got for Wood. 

They didn't get 36, they swapped 46 for 36. 2nds are virtually worthless in the NBA. It's essentially a likely late 1st when Weaver might not even be GM anymore if things go sideways and filler. The real value is not extending Grant and clearing cap space, the return is a nothing burger.

It's slightly better than the Wood return but pretty much in the ballpark and I look dumb for saying that Wood isn't comparable to Grant in terms of value.

Edited June 22, 2022 by NYLion

[buddha]

6 minutes ago, NYLion said:

They didn't get 36, they swapped 46 for 36. 2nds are virtually worthless in the NBA. It's essentially a likely late 1st when Weaver might not even be GM anymore if things go sideways and filler. The real value is not extending Grant and clearing cap space, the return is a nothing burger.

It's slightly better than the Wood return but pretty much in the ballpark and I look dumb for saying that Wood isn't comparable to Grant in terms of value.

grant is better than wood in value.  weaver gave up grant for less value im order to get flexibility.

flexibility to do what is the question.

if its ayton and brunson, were fucked.

[RandyMarsh]

3 minutes ago, NYLion said:

They didn't get 36, they swapped 46 for 36. 2nds are virtually worthless in the NBA. It's essentially a likely late 1st when Weaver might not even be GM anymore if things go sideways and filler. The real value is not extending Grant and clearing cap space, the return is a nothing burger.

I consider mid to late 2nd round picks worthless which is why I didn't count the pick swap, I do think early 2nd round picks provide just as much value as a late 1st like Houston got, so to me 26 and 36 aren't much of a difference, particularly looking at this draft. I do agree the extra 2nd they got will likely be worthless though so I shouldn't have even bothered including that. 

The overall point is that I think our package is quite a bit more appealing than what Houston got for Wood IF we parlay that savings from not taking on salary correctly. With Weaver that is definitely a big IF. 

 

[Deleterious]

So that Bucks pick.  The Pistons don't get a pick if it ends up top 4 that year.  The odds are small, but man, what a kick in the gut that would be.

[Motown Bombers]

I've said it before but I'm getting Grant Hill Piston vibes from this team. Who is the modern day version of Jerry Stackhouse? 

[NYLion]

13 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:

I consider mid to late 2nd round picks worthless which is why I didn't count the pick swap, I do think early 2nd round picks provide just as much value as a late 1st like Houston got, so to me 26 and 36 aren't much of a difference, particularly looking at this draft. I do agree the extra 2nd they got will likely be worthless though so I shouldn't have even bothered including that. 

The overall point is that I think our package is quite a bit more appealing than what Houston got for Wood IF we parlay that savings from not taking on salary correctly. With Weaver that is definitely a big IF. 

 

Yeah, that's the key. What Weaver does with this extra cap flexibility will determine the value of the trade, the picks are pretty worthless. The thing is, I see very few positive paths with this free agency class. I don't see Weaver as a creative enough GM like Presti to weaponize the cap space to add high picks so prepare for some combination of Ayton, Brunson, Bridges, Sexton.

[RandyMarsh]

2 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

I've said it before but I'm getting Grant Hill Piston vibes from this team. Who is the modern day version of Jerry Stackhouse? 

Grant probably would've been the best match, guy that can score but does so inefficiently and the team plays better without him on the floor. 

[Shinzaki]

I hope Weaver doesn't use the cap space to give us some variation of the "Blake Griffin"....a move or moves that saps resources and makes you just good enough to not be awful.  

[TP_Fan]

 

[RandyMarsh]

Would the Pistons be able to trade that Milwaukee pick right away or is there a certain wait period to it? Just curious cause I wonder if they do indeed want Ivey if they could package that with 5 to swap picks with Sacramento, or would Sacramento possibly just do 5 and 36 for the swap?

If the Kings are way higher on Ivey than Murray then I'm sure that wouldn't be enough but if they like both equally or maybe even like Murray more perhaps they would do it, get the guy they want at a slightly lower salary and pick up an extra pick.  

[Deleterious]

13 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:

Would the Pistons be able to trade that Milwaukee pick right away or is there a certain wait period to it? Just curious cause I wonder if they do indeed want Ivey if they could package that with 5 to swap picks with Sacramento, or would Sacramento possibly just do 5 and 36 for the swap?

If the Kings are way higher on Ivey than Murray then I'm sure that wouldn't be enough but if they like both equally or maybe even like Murray more perhaps they would do it, get the guy they want at a slightly lower salary and pick up an extra pick.  

They can trade it now.  Not sure how interested Sacramento would be since there is that small chance it turns into no pick.

5 and 36 ain't getting it done.

[Hongbit]

Admittedly, I don’t follow NBA as closely as most of the board regs, so can someone explain why Ayton is the one to build the franchise around with Cade.   

This league is moving away from the physical center that can rebound and be a defensive anchor.   I just don’t see him as a max player.   He doesn’t have that valuable of a skill set that you see in max centers like Jokic, Embiid, or a healthy Anthony Davis.   He doesn’t really provide any offensive except right around the basket    What are some of the things that people like about him to want to make him a key part of the franchise future?  

[Hart]

6 minutes ago, Deleterious said:

They can trade it now.  Not sure how interested Sacramento would be since there is that small chance it turns into no pick.

5 and 36 ain't getting it done.

Would the pick get bumped to a later year at least?  I have never heard of a team trading for a pick that could just totally be forfeited.

[Deleterious]

14 minutes ago, Hart said:

Would the pick get bumped to a later year at least?  I have never heard of a team trading for a pick that could just totally be forfeited.

Nope.

The problem is that two teams have a claim to the pick.  The Bucks traded it to New Orleans with protections on it from 5-30.  They also traded it to Portland with protections on it 1-4.  So the Bucks lose the pick either way.  Just remains to be seen who gets it.  Odds are in our favor big time, but there is a shot they could lose it.

[gehringer_2]

1 minute ago, Deleterious said:

Nope.

The problem is that two teams have a claim to the pick.  The Bucks traded it to New Orleans with protections on it from 5-30.  They also traded it to Portland with protections on it 1-4.  So the Bucks lose the pick either way.  Just remains to be seen who gets it.  Odds are in our favor big time, but there is a shot they could lose it.

wut? How does the league approve a trade of an asset that had already been conveyed?

[Deleterious]

2 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

wut? How does the league approve a trade of an asset that had already been conveyed?

I don't see an issue with it as long as all the teams agree.

Here is the text from RealGM.  They have not updated it yet so just sub in Detroit for Portland.

Quote

2025 first round draft pick to New Orleans or Portland
Milwaukee's 2025 1st round pick to New Orleans protected for selections 5-30 or to Portland (via New Orleans) protected for selections 1-4 (Milwaukee's obligation to New Orleans or Portland will thereafter be extinguished) [Denver-Milwaukee-New Orleans-Oklahoma City, 11/23/2020; New Orleans-Portland, 2/8/2022]

 

[NYLion]

1 hour ago, TP_Fan said:

 

James Edwards tweeted that the Pistons will be heavily pursuing Ayton. I trust Edwards way more than whoever this random twitter guy is.