chasfh Posted December 10, 2023 Share Posted December 10, 2023 23 hours ago, Tiger337 said: The idea that Trump is going to cheat in 2024 using tactics that he accused the Democrats of using is not news. I've assumed along that he's going to try it. In fact, he most likely tried it in 2020. And 2016. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted December 10, 2023 Share Posted December 10, 2023 15 hours ago, oblong said: I don’t think it was nefarious intent. She’s just too stupid to know it’s not how you do it. Well, good to know. I feel better about it all now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted December 10, 2023 Share Posted December 10, 2023 11 hours ago, Netnerd said: I agree with both takes. Still, running for the country’s highest office, how does the DeSantis campaign not walk that back, and quickly? Because in a land where the ignorant leads the ignorant, they didn’t do anything wrong. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted December 18, 2023 Share Posted December 18, 2023 Good poll for Haley in New Hampshire. This is the first glimmer of hope that someone could make a run at Trump if other opponents drop out. I am no fan of Haley, but if someone somewhat normal can defeat the dickbag psychopath, it would be a positive thing for our country. I don't agree at all with those who want trump to win because he has no chance of beating Biden. He has a great chance of beating Biden. https://www.politico.com/news/2023/12/17/cbs-poll-haley-closing-gap-new-hampshire-00132173 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romad1 Posted December 18, 2023 Share Posted December 18, 2023 1 minute ago, Tiger337 said: Good poll for Haley in New Hampshire. This is the first glimmer of hope that someone could make a run at Trump if other opponents drop out. I am no fan of Haley, but if someone somewhat normal can defeat the dickbag psychopath, it would be a positive thing for our country. I don't agree at all with those who want trump to win because he has no chance of beating Biden. He has a great chance of beating Biden. https://www.politico.com/news/2023/12/17/cbs-poll-haley-closing-gap-new-hampshire-00132173 Concur. My faith in the GOP electorate to vote for the daughter of an Indian Immigrant is low but damnit, she'd hopefully be a return to behaviour within the range of normal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted December 18, 2023 Share Posted December 18, 2023 2 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: Good poll for Haley in New Hampshire. This is the first glimmer of hope that someone could make a run at Trump if other opponents drop out. I am no fan of Haley, but if someone somewhat normal can defeat the dickbag psychopath, it would be a positive thing for our country. I don't agree at all with those who want trump to win because he has no chance of beating Biden. He has a great chance of beating Biden. https://www.politico.com/news/2023/12/17/cbs-poll-haley-closing-gap-new-hampshire-00132173 Totally. I've come to accept that the GOP has a very good shot at winning and of those running I think she's the most "normal", with Christie, but I don't think he has a prayer of getting the nomination. We have such low standards now that as long as the person is not totally bat**** crazy then I guess he or she will have to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfife Posted December 18, 2023 Author Share Posted December 18, 2023 Chris Christie brought up that poll yesterday in an interview on CBS and just take it with a grain of salt, it had a pretty low number of respondents and that gives a 5.5 -> 6 Margin of error, which is pretty large margin of error in political polling. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edman85 Posted December 18, 2023 Share Posted December 18, 2023 I'm registering with the R's to vote for her in the primary and suggest others yearning for that side to ditch crazy to swallow their pride and do the same. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RatkoVarda Posted December 18, 2023 Share Posted December 18, 2023 Haley, who BTW has never lost an election, I assume would be somewhere within the "normal" range if she was POTUS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smr-nj Posted December 18, 2023 Share Posted December 18, 2023 I have to confess to getting angrier every passing day. As a woman (way past birthing years) I am, and will remain, very very deeply concerned for EVERY female member of my family. If you have an “R” after your name, it’s more than probable that I will never cast my vote for you again, not for as long as I live. And regarding Nikki Haley - no to her as well. Early this year, at a Susan B Anthony event, this was her take on the issue - “I do believe there is a federal role on abortion”. I’m mad. Very. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted December 19, 2023 Share Posted December 19, 2023 6 hours ago, Edman85 said: I'm registering with the R's to vote for her in the primary and suggest others yearning for that side to ditch crazy to swallow their pride and do the same. In Massachusetts, we don't have to register as a Republican to vote in their primary. I plan to vote for her to do my part in ridding my country of the madman. I will vote Democrat in the general. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted December 19, 2023 Share Posted December 19, 2023 We don’t have to register in MI either but you have to pick a party’s ballot. You can’t mix and match races. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edman85 Posted December 19, 2023 Share Posted December 19, 2023 In Florida, because the primaries are months apart, I can register R for the presidential primary, then choose which party I want to register in August. Probably D then, but that depends on races and if there are any primaries. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Edman85 Posted December 19, 2023 Share Posted December 19, 2023 5 hours ago, smr-nj said: I have to confess to getting angrier every passing day. As a woman (way past birthing years) I am, and will remain, very very deeply concerned for EVERY female member of my family. If you have an “R” after your name, it’s more than probable that I will never cast my vote for you again, not for as long as I live. And regarding Nikki Haley - no to her as well. Early this year, at a Susan B Anthony event, this was her take on the issue - “I do believe there is a federal role on abortion”. I’m mad. Very. While this is true. I'm not asking people to vote for her for President. I'm asking them to vote for her as a nominee to try to put a dagger in Trump's political career. There is a difference. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Gilmore Posted December 19, 2023 Share Posted December 19, 2023 I think we all understand the idea and see that it has some tactical merit. However, voting for any of the turds that supported Trump and the Big Lie is something I can’t do. They don’t believe in the Constitution or the law and deserve scorn. Just being better than Trump, while still kissing his ring is just a slightly weaker form of evil. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romad1 Posted December 19, 2023 Share Posted December 19, 2023 8 hours ago, Dan Gilmore said: I think we all understand the idea and see that it has some tactical merit. However, voting for any of the turds that supported Trump and the Big Lie is something I can’t do. They don’t believe in the Constitution or the law and deserve scorn. Just being better than Trump, while still kissing his ring is just a slightly weaker form of evil. Very torn with the idea that we could use some spackling and some paint and fix the center-right party. That's the wrong diagnosis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted December 19, 2023 Share Posted December 19, 2023 I'm afraid we are too far beyond the normal range for that party to simply fix itself. Something dramatic will have to happen to snap us out of it, and it probably won't be painless. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMRivdogs Posted December 19, 2023 Share Posted December 19, 2023 3 minutes ago, chasfh said: I'm afraid we are too far beyond the normal range for that party to simply fix itself. Something dramatic will have to happen to snap us out of it, and it probably won't be painless. Was just reading a Tim Miller piece on this past weekend's gathering of MAGAs. If there is a post Trump era it just might be Matt Gaetz https://open.substack.com/pub/thebulwark/p/the-matt-gaetz-gop-future?r=45wcm&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=email Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted December 19, 2023 Share Posted December 19, 2023 35 minutes ago, chasfh said: I'm afraid we are too far beyond the normal range for that party to simply fix itself. Something dramatic will have to happen to snap us out of it, and it probably won't be painless. You guys seem so convinced that Trump is going to start a brutal right-wing dictatorship, that it seems logical that you would try to vote him out as early as possible. While I am not quite that fearful of a Trump presidency, I think he is a very unhealthy and dangerous influence on our country and the sooner we can end his political career, the better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigerbomb13 Posted December 19, 2023 Share Posted December 19, 2023 The whole party needs to burned to the ground for anything to happen. The second any of these “moderates” withdraw their candidacies, they are going right back in Trump’s pocket. The only way I can think of anything changing is if Republicans get wiped out in 2024. All of them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted December 19, 2023 Share Posted December 19, 2023 I'm not counting out the effect of the Dobbs decision to create that seismic shift. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted December 19, 2023 Share Posted December 19, 2023 20 minutes ago, Tigerbomb13 said: The whole party needs to burned to the ground for anything to happen. The second any of these “moderates” withdraw their candidacies, they are going right back in Trump’s pocket. The only way I can think of anything changing is if Republicans get wiped out in 2024. All of them. That's not going to happen though. Realistically, you can only hope for incremental changes. If Trump is proven unelectable, then there will be opportunities to make changes. I don't even think his policies (which seem to come mostly from watching TV) are especially conservative. What makes him dangerous is his psychopathy. I have almost no hope that he will be beaten, but having him lose would be a big positive for the country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted December 19, 2023 Share Posted December 19, 2023 20 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: You guys seem so convinced that Trump is going to start a brutal right-wing dictatorship, that it seems logical that you would try to vote him out as early as possible. While I am not quite that fearful of a Trump presidency, I think he is a very unhealthy and dangerous influence on our country and the sooner we can end his political career, the better. Maybe some of "us guys" think it will be a brutal dictatorship, and that's certainly within the range of outcomes. I think a more likely outcome is the kind of authoritarian regime they have in Russia: the kind where our rights get steadily eroded, and if you voice a strong opinion about it publicly there's a good chance you will get a visit. But if you keep your mouth shut and just live your everyday life not thinking about it, you will probably be fine as long as you don't need those rights at some point, which to be fair most people don't. But either way, once they take power, they will take immediate and drastic steps to curb elective democracy and maintain single-party autocracy permanently, which will be an undermining of the basic principles this country was founded on, but which has also functioned and been accepted in this country before (notably in the post-Reconstruction South). The question will be, how happy and willing will you be to live in such a way? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted December 19, 2023 Share Posted December 19, 2023 1 minute ago, Tiger337 said: That's not going to happen though. Realistically, you can only hope for incremental changes. If Trump is proven unelectable, then there will be opportunities to make changes. I don't even think his policies (which seem to come mostly from watching TV) are especially conservative. What makes him dangerous is his psychopathy. I have almost no hope that he will be beaten, but having him lose would be a big positive for the country. Changes are always incremental before the revolution happens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted December 19, 2023 Share Posted December 19, 2023 2 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: That's not going to happen though. Realistically, you can only hope for incremental changes. If Trump is proven unelectable, then there will be opportunities to make changes. I don't even think his policies (which seem to come mostly from watching TV) are especially conservative. What makes him dangerous is his psychopathy. I have almost no hope that he will be beaten, but having him lose would be a big positive for the country. Wait a minute: you think Trump is a lock to be elected president next year? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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