oblong Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 Just now, mtutiger said: I would also add that the mocking disdain you see from figures on the right over concerns about Trump's rhetoric (Mike Lee being the best example, with his constant invoking of "I'll take the mean tweets") is also pretty frustrating when you are trying to project decent values onto your kids. But it's not 1997 anymore - even then, maybe all the concerns over "values" was just hogwash It was. Values gave them the cover to ignore some pretty centrist policies of Clinton. They just couldn't stomach a baby boomer draft dodger becoming President. It was almost as bad as... a black guy named Hussein. The baby boomers were broadly defined by the Vietnam War and the first Boomer POTUS should have been a decorated veteran, not some hippie with an independent wife. Naturally Kerry didn't count in 2004. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 21 minutes ago, oblong said: It was. Values gave them the cover to ignore some pretty centrist policies of Clinton. They just couldn't stomach a baby boomer draft dodger becoming President... And one with such... "loose morals". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewsieg Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 32 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: I just did that in 3 sentences. I mean, I agree with you... most regular Joe's aren't going to get into these weeds. But it isn't really that difficult to grasp the basic outlines of making smart moves instead of dumb moves. I should know... most of my family is MAGA. I've had these arguments... a LOT. But here's the real reason they can be such idiots: I explain. They get it. They understand. And then they respond with: "I don't care. I just want Trump to break everything". Myopic. Shortsightedness in its worst form. They want Mexican rapists kicked out of the country. And nothing else matters. I have a bone to pick with that attitude. You have to trust Joe Biden in order to grasp it like this, and most average voters do not trust any politician. I can listen to you say that it's smart for him to negotiate the tariff away and agree that you might be right. But again, when you say Soybean farmers were destroyed by Trump over these tariffs, but it's alright that Biden is still destroying them because it's the smart thing to do and if there is any blame for soybean farmers going bankrupt in years 4, 5, and 6 they should still blame Trump and not Biden, that's tough for the average voter to swallow. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 (edited) 27 minutes ago, oblong said: the first Boomer POTUS should have been a decorated veteran, not some hippie with an independent wife. I've sort of touched on this before, but from 1968 on the Woodstock side of the boomer generation seized the media/historical narrative for our generation and pretty much never let go. But I tend to believe the truth was we were never the majority of the cohort. The Young Rebubs for Reagan, all the guys who got drafted and served, all the girls who got married in lace and taffeta. There was a silent majority, but it wasn't Nixon's cohort, it was all the conservative boomers who were culturally invisible. Those people eventually came to resent people like Bill Clinton, and right wing boomers today are still a core element of Trump's support. Edited February 2 by gehringer_2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 7 minutes ago, ewsieg said: You have to trust Joe Biden in order to grasp it like this, and most average voters do not trust any politician. I can listen to you say that it's smart for him to negotiate the tariff away and agree that you might be right. But again, when you say Soybean farmers were destroyed by Trump over these tariffs, but it's alright that Biden is still destroying them because it's the smart thing to do and if there is any blame for soybean farmers going bankrupt in years 4, 5, and 6 they should still blame Trump and not Biden, that's tough for the average voter to swallow. 1) Soybean farmers adapt. Trump bailed them out (sort of... he ****ed that up too) in years 1 nd 2. By Year 3 they are no longer planting soybeans, but corn or some other crop... 2) If we're talking effectiveness; Biden has ACTUALLY implemented policies that are GROWING our manufacturing base again. Why? Because he knows what he's doing. And Tariffs are a MINOR part of that. 3) And what does MAGA see? They're too hung up on "tariffs" or, especially "TRUMP, I LOVE YOU!!!!!" to actually notice anything else. Even if it is easily explained to them. They just don't CARE. They're entrapped inside a cult and they DO NOT CARE. That's called myopia. That's called dysfunctional. That's called abject stupidity, BY CHOICE. They've CHOSEN to close their eyes to anything and everything. "God" (I'm an atheist) help us all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfife Posted February 2 Author Share Posted February 2 I didn't vote for Biden or against Trump because of tarrifs so I'm not a hypocrite per esweig Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 This is amazing stuff - Aaron Blake in WaPo reporting on SC polling. Quote A new Washington Post-Monmouth University poll features a somewhat unsurprising top-line number: Trump leads Haley by 26 points, 58 percent to 32 percent, in South Carolina. But within the poll is a remarkable finding. Not only don’t Haley’s home-state GOP primary voters want to elect her as president, they don’t even seem to like her much anymore. Haley was a popular governor of South Carolina, with polls generally showing about 8 in 10 Republicans approved of her. Polls of the GOP primary electorate in September and November showed her popularity was holding up pretty well. Now that she is Trump’s lone remaining obstacle — and as she has stepped up her criticisms of him to include things like his mental sharpness — Republicans have far less regard for her. .... Since the same Post-Monmouth South Carolina poll was conduced in September: Haley’s favorable rating among “strong” Republicans has plunged from 43 points positive (65-22) to 10 points negative (38-48). Among MAGA supporters, she has gone from plus-26 (56-30) to minus-32 (26-58). While 52 percent of Trump voters liked her in September, she is down to 22 percent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 20 minutes ago, pfife said: I didn't vote for Biden or against Trump because of tarrifs so I'm not a hypocrite per esweig I voted for Biden because I wanted an Adult in the White House and not a TWO-year-old Temper Tantrum in there breaking everything. Including our Democracy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted February 2 Share Posted February 2 President Biden is, you know, ACTUALLY doing a good job: 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMRivdogs Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 Dean Phillips finished third to Maryanne Williamson who is rapidly becoming the Harold Stassen of the Democrats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romad1 Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 10 minutes ago, CMRivdogs said: Dean Phillips finished third to Maryanne Williamson who is rapidly becoming the Harold Stassen of the Democrats. And that one guy Bill Ackman funded Dean Philips strictly because he was offended that Biden was offended by some crass comment about Biden being silent after talking about his son. According to this well-funded article which seeks to explain that Ackman wasn't at fault, it still appears that they had a misunderstanding. Also, Ackman's only real campaign platform for his guy Phillips is DEI being bad. https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2024/01/what-really-happened-between-joe-biden-and-bill-ackman.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romad1 Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 This is a good thread Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 On 2/2/2024 at 12:37 PM, pfife said: I didn't vote for Biden or against Trump because of tarrifs so I'm not a hypocrite per esweig I didn't even know there were still tariffs prior to this week and I don't paticularly care. Trump is still trash as he has been for 40+ years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romad1 Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 Someone is defiantly not on team trump anymore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfife Posted February 4 Author Share Posted February 4 I think it's not w good intentions though, I think it all stems back to Trump not hating immigrants enough for blonde skeletor 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 (edited) I'm going to make an odd statement here... And it's sort of directed at ewsieg... But I want to make a very specific point, see if you can spot it: If Trump were to, somehow... win the DEMOCRATIC nomination for President (Biden: "I'm tired. I'm going home.") And Nikki Haley then gains the Republican nominee for President. Then I am voting for Nikki Haley. I don't care what her platform is. Don't care if it's a conservative Republican platform. I vote for her. No. Hesitation. Whatsoever. Just my 2 cents. Edited February 4 by 1984Echoes 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motor City Sonics Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 2 hours ago, GoBlue23 said: Got out of bed this morning, went to the window and opened the curtains and the first thing that caught my eye was a Ford Escape with a big "We Love Trump" sign on the side. It's gonna be a long year. 😒 Look at me, everybody ARE YOU LOOKING ? YOU NEED TO LOOK AT ME ! WHY AREN'T YOU LOOKING AT ME ? I NEED ATTENTION ! BECAUSE REASONS !!!!!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motor City Sonics Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 5 hours ago, romad1 said: Someone is defiantly not on team trump anymore Makes me think of the William Hurt line in A History Of Violence. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romad1 Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 3 hours ago, GoBlue23 said: Got out of bed this morning, went to the window and opened the curtains and the first thing that caught my eye was a Ford Escape with a big "We Love Trump" sign on the side. It's gonna be a long year. 😒 Yeah, it really gives one pause. You have to reevaluate the level of violence that person is prone to given how they reacted last time he lost. Probably you should keep the special deep state 911 number on speed dial. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 On 2/1/2024 at 2:04 PM, mtutiger said: Thread: Worth reading in its entirety, but the upshot being that the Trump campaign is likely to have a lot of money issues in 2024. Particularly with all the legal bills that Trump himself is facing Someone, or ones, are going to swoop in to save his day with big money. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted February 4 Share Posted February 4 On 2/2/2024 at 10:40 AM, mtutiger said: But it's not 1997 anymore - even then, maybe all the concerns over "values" was just hogwash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1776 Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 WSJ reporting: AIKEN, S.C.—Republican presidential candidate Nikki Haley has applied for Secret Service protection because of increasing threats she has received as Donald Trump’s last major opponent for the 2024 GOP nomination. Haley confirmed the application for protection in an interview Monday afternoon with The Wall Street Journal. “We’ve had multiple issues,” the former South Carolina governor and United Nations ambassador said after a campaign event here. “It’s not going to stop me from doing what I need to do.” Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMRivdogs Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 https://politicalwire.com/2024/02/05/trump-wants-immediate-debate-with-biden/ Quote Donald Trump pushed for an early debate with President Biden, CNBCreports. Said Trump: “I’d like to debate him now because we should debate. We should debate for the good of the country.” Biden replied: “Well, if I were him I’d want to debate me too. He’s got nothing else to do.” Biden should challenge him to a "live" cognitive test and one of those six minute walks my pulmonary guy makes me take every six months or so Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 By debate, does he mean talkig **** non-stop for two hours in an unsuccessful efforst to get Biden to stutter? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted February 6 Share Posted February 6 (edited) It may be traditional and Biden may be trying to be a traditional politician but there I see zero upside for him getting on the same stage with Trump. Trump never abides by any rules of the game, so you are a fool if you offer to play. OTOH, if given that Trump has ducked GOP debates, he may well be bluffing, in which case to accept and have Trump back out is the best of both worlds... Edited February 6 by gehringer_2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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