Motown Bombers Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MichiganCardinal Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 The point wasn't to re-litigate Hillary's 2016 campaign or the 2016 primaries. Both are long dead, and the autopsy reports would be hundreds of pages long. The point was that Bernie supporters - rightly or wrongly - felt ostracized by the Party, when Hillary needed their votes. I think many stayed home and I'm sure some voted for Trump. You can blame that on whomever you want, Bernie certainly isn't blameless. In 2024 though, the Party needs all the votes. It doesn't need Democratic Reps coming out publicly against him, working to create an in-group and out-group within the Party. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 8 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said: but all these morons on twitter are saying.... I've unfollowed about 10 "pundits" over this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 I think it bears keeping in mind that when it comes to organization, the weakness of the Democratic Party is its diversity. It is essentially a coalition of many different factions with many differing agendas. It's really hard to pull everyone together, even in the best of circumstances, if each group is not getting their bed feathered and preventing their ox being gored. That is one way in which the Republican Party has an advantage: they are monolithic in demography and ideology, so they are all on board, 100%. What that means is if/when someone in the Republican Party flips on Trump, that's huge and surprising news, because of the monolithism. But when Democrats flip on Biden, It's news, but not so surprising, because of the different factions with differing goals that run counter to those of Biden and mainline Democrats. IOW, I think that when a lot of those Democrats call for Biden to step down, they are hoping for someone to replace him who will feather their beds better, and keep their oxen from being gored more effectively. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 1 minute ago, chasfh said: I think it bears keeping in mind that when it comes to organization, the weakness of the Democratic Party is its diversity. It is essentially a coalition of many different factions with many differing agendas. It's really hard to pull everyone together, even in the best of circumstances, if each group is not getting their bed feathered and preventing their ox being gored. That is one way in which the Republican Party has an advantage: they are monolithic in demography and ideology, so they are all on board, 100%. What that means is if/when someone in the Republican Party flips on Trump, that's huge and surprising news, because of the monolithism. But when Democrats flip on Biden, It's news, but not so surprising, because of the different factions with differing goals that run counter to those of Biden and mainline Democrats. IOW, I think that when a lot of those Democrats call for Biden to step down, they are hoping for someone to replace him who will feather their beds better, and keep their oxen from being gored more effectively. And when someone flips in the Republican Party, they get excommunicated like Liz Cheney. I hoped with the stakes at hand Dems would be more united but they are as spineless as ever. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMRivdogs Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 (edited) 1 hour ago, Motown Bombers said: Biden’s physical is public record. He had a physical in February, the White House did release a summary. No cognitive test was given at the time. Meanwhile I don't believe any tests released by the Trump campaign. He probably had someone take them for him. Edited July 8 by CMRivdogs 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewsieg Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 2 hours ago, Motown Bombers said: It’s quite the opposite. Dems on the ground are mad at these rat****ers in the Democratic Party. Debbie Dingell changed her tune after she went and talked to people on the ground. Mark Warner gave up on his coup attempt after it got leaked and the base lit up his office. These rat****ers miscalculated. Yes, many are upset because (both sides alert!!!) how dare anyone ever question a democrat. He saved us from Trump and restored the American dream and to question him is blasphemous. People on the ground that have already determined they are voting for Biden, like you say, some blindly follow democratic talking points and regurgitate it like zombies (just like many MAGA's they mock about doing the same). But trust me, there are many like me that will vote for a Ham sandwich over Trump but in the end, aren't confident in how well a ham sandwich could run this country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMRivdogs Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 I've met several ham sandwiches and based on conversations we've had on several nights I believe they would do a better job than Trump. But then again it could have been the pickles and provolone talking 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewsieg Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 3 minutes ago, CMRivdogs said: He had a physical in February, the White House did release a summary. No cognitive test was given at the time. Meanwhile I don't believe any tests released by the Trump campaign. He probably had someone take them for him. Reports have surfaced that Biden has seen a doctor known for his work with Parkinson's several times as well. Doesn't mean he has that, but if true, his medical team has some concerns as well. Maybe if Biden can just get a letter out to the press of 50 well respected doctors to say they don't show anything wrong with him this will be put to bed. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
antrat Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 I think a lot of these Dems who want Biden to drop out are sniffing their chance at power. Either the nom or a VP slot. I hate politicians. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 7 minutes ago, CMRivdogs said: He had a physical in February, the White House did release a summary. No cognitive test was given at the time. Meanwhile I don't believe any tests released by the Trump campaign. He probably had someone take them for him. A neurological test was given at the time. There were no issues. Biden’s medical records are going to be the new Obama birth certificate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 I did see it said that he has something that I won't dare pronounce or spell, but it's a condition where the feet go numb. That's why his gait is the way it is. My wife says it's not even age related. Someone who is 35 can get it. While I can't say it's common, it's something she as a therapist is very familiar with and sees quite often in patients. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 10 minutes ago, ewsieg said: Yes, many are upset because (both sides alert!!!) how dare anyone ever question a democrat. He saved us from Trump and restored the American dream and to question him is blasphemous. People on the ground that have already determined they are voting for Biden, like you say, some blindly follow democratic talking points and regurgitate it like zombies (just like many MAGA's they mock about doing the same). But trust me, there are many like me that will vote for a Ham sandwich over Trump but in the end, aren't confident in how well a ham sandwich could run this country. This doesn’t make sense. Democratic voters pick the leader of their party. They chose Biden and still stand behind him. Republicans don’t just get to swoop in and disenfranchise Democratic voters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMRivdogs Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 8 minutes ago, oblong said: I did see it said that he has something that I won't dare pronounce or spell, but it's a condition where the feet go numb. That's why his gait is the way it is. My wife says it's not even age related. Someone who is 35 can get it. While I can't say it's common, it's something she as a therapist is very familiar with and sees quite often in patients. Neuropathy seems to be fairly common. It's usually related to diabetes. In JB's case doctors say it's not according to the White House release. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 15 minutes ago, oblong said: I did see it said that he has something that I won't dare pronounce or spell, but it's a condition where the feet go numb. That's why his gait is the way it is. My wife says it's not even age related. Someone who is 35 can get it. While I can't say it's common, it's something she as a therapist is very familiar with and sees quite often in patients. Neuropathy. My dad has it. He was diagnosed with it in his 40's. He also has it in his hands. The only issue was he worked on the assembly line at Ford so it did affect his ability to do the job. Not that he is retired, it has no affect on his day to day life. Unless Biden is doing manual labor, it shouldn't be an issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 27 minutes ago, ewsieg said: Reports have surfaced that Biden has seen a doctor known for his work with Parkinson's several times as well. Doesn't mean he has that, but if true, his medical team has some concerns as well. Maybe if Biden can just get a letter out to the press of 50 well respected doctors to say they don't show anything wrong with him this will be put to bed. Maybe he should be examined by Ben Carson and Dr Oz. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smr-nj Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 Neuropathy - I’m dealing with that now for a few years, and for sure it affects your walking gait. So what. It changes nothing when your choice is a continuation of our democracy or a criminal heading a fascist dictatorship regime. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CMRivdogs Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 28 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said: A neurological test was given at the time. There were no issues. Biden’s medical records are going to be the new Obama birth certificate. A neurological test is medical. A cognitive test is usually conducted by a psychologist. It determines ability to reason, memory, judgement, etc. JB has admitted he hasn't taken the test and doesn't need it. This is the test that Trump brags about acing, and has received the highest score ever. Hey, I'm not calling for Biden to back out. I would love to see the two of them go head to head in a basic cognitive exam and see a true physical from DJT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 3 minutes ago, CMRivdogs said: A neurological test is medical. A cognitive test is usually conducted by a psychologist. It determines ability to reason, memory, judgement, etc. JB has admitted he hasn't taken the test and doesn't need it. This is the test that Trump brags about acing, and has received the highest score ever. Hey, I'm not calling for Biden to back out. I would love to see the two of them go head to head in a basic cognitive exam and see a true physical from DJT Neurological tests are used to diagnose someone for Alzheimer's. Doctors don't just give cognitive tests if they don't suspect any decline. The fact is Biden is currently running the country and doing it more than competently. The fact that Trump took a cognitive test leads me to believe his doctor suspected cognitive decline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hongbit Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 17 minutes ago, CMRivdogs said: A neurological test is medical. A cognitive test is usually conducted by a psychologist. It determines ability to reason, memory, judgement, etc. JB has admitted he hasn't taken the test and doesn't need it. This is the test that Trump brags about acing, and has received the highest score ever. Hey, I'm not calling for Biden to back out. I would love to see the two of them go head to head in a basic cognitive exam and see a true physical from DJT Cmon CM, you’re at it again. There’s no need for a physical. The guy has recently won 2 club championships in golf. Not the Senior group but the entire club! He’s regularly beating players half his age. He’s so good that many courses across the world have been named after him. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 2 hours ago, MichiganCardinal said: In 2024 though, the Party needs all the votes. It doesn't need Democratic Reps coming out publicly against him, working to create an in-group and out-group within the Party. On this score, despite the self-righteousness of a lot of the "Biden must drop out" crowd, I don't think they are helping. Even though they think they are. Today on X dot com, they are currently debating about "the elites" being responsible for Biden still being in it, despite the fact that may of the loudest commentators (the Matt Yglesias's and Bulwark types) *are* elites themselves and have written extensively on this subject for months. It's just inane. The biggest issue is the sense that, even if he steps aside, what then? You look at the Bill Kristol types (not even a Democrat lol) who have made their entire identity into this subject over the course of the last few weeks, and when they discuss the possibility of him actually stepping aside, they launch into fantasies about a firehouse, last second primary among delegates in Chicago, as if that's the answer to everything. As if that purportedly respects the actually will of the voters. I still don't know what's going to happen here, but my overall takeaway is that a lot of people have done a great job in showing their *** throughout all of this. I just hope, whether it's Biden or Harris (and yes, it will be one or the other), they can somehow unify. That's the biggest casualty in all of this. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 Democrats: We need to defeat Trump because he lead an insurrection to overturn the results of an election Also Democrats: How can we overturn the results of the election to install our favorite white governor because I got scared of a debate? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Motown Bombers Posted July 8 Share Posted July 8 Which Dem is going to make the call to the DNC chair asking to find 1,968 delegates? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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