1984Echoes Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 1 hour ago, ewsieg said: ... I guess I'm just saying I hope that if a legitimate deal can be done, no one tries to derail it under the guise of inflicting more pain on Russia at the expense of further damage to Ukraine. I don't think anyone will do anything to derail a ceasefire. Except Putin. If he wants a deal/ exit ramp from Ukraine, he'll get it. The guise you mentioned above I believe is a non-existent one... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 54 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said: land mine? Look at the video again, in the upper left corner early on you'll see what looks like a mortar round fired, or some kind of artillery... and then they shift down to the tank and watch it get blown up a few seconds later. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 2 hours ago, mtutiger said: Just to add, I find the sidelining or disregarding of what the Ukrainian government (and seemingly it's people) want in these conversations to be wildly chauvinistic. And yeah, this is something I see on both sides of the debate, not just from the Gabbard/useful idiot side of the debate. As long as the Ukrainians are willing to fight and die for their country, I don't see an issue with supporting their endeavor to the best of our abilities given that the lines are pretty clear on who the aggressor is here. I went back and reread what I had posted "It is worth a weakened (fascist) Russia to have a successful military stalemate between Ukraine and Russia for the time being." And thought hmmm, that could lead to what you have been posting... so I thought I would add some clarity: I don't think Ukraine is being disregarded. NATO/ US are considering every request and either acting upon it, or saying sorry. And NATO/ the United States DO have the right and responsibility to say no. If Zelenskyy asked us to send a few nukes Russia's way are we not allowed to say no? I'm not being glib, it's a legitimate question and right of refusal. Zelenskyy has asked for a no-fly zone, and NATO/ US have said no as that would be a direct act of war with Russia (NATO shooting down their jets). They have that right. As for the "stalemate" in my point above... I don't believe NATO/ US are pushing for "stalemate" (I could have worded that better) but, a stalemate is the facts on the ground. Other options may or may not be better: A) Putin runs roughshod over Ukraine taking over the entire country - not better. B) Ukraine outright pushing Russian forces out of Ukraine - better, but not likely. C) NATO not supplying Ukraine with supplies - not better. D) NATO supplying everything they can to Ukraine in the way of supplies and defensive weapons (even though they made a military decision and decided they could not send Polish or Romanian MIG's to Ukraine) - is the best they feel they can do, in addition to all the sanctions & other related responses, under the current circumstances. E) NATO willing to go into a direct war with Russia - this is not happening on the ground. Personally, I believe we could/ should, and I believe the war would be immediately ceased by Putin, who would sue for terms (Ukrainian permanent neutrality) and that would obviously be better for Ukraine. But since this hasn't happened, we are left with the default situation based on the above: F) Russia not able to make forward progress, stalled outside of all of its major objectives, Ukraine able to hold its ground for the most part and exact a heavy price upon Russia's military forces and equipment/ supply lines - this is the current situation, so by default we are stuck in a "stalemate". This is what I really meant above, not that anyone "benefits" from this stalemate, which is what my post above sort of sounds like... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 41 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: Look at the video again, in the upper left corner early on you'll see what looks like a mortar round fired, or some kind of artillery... and then they shift down to the tank and watch it get blown up a few seconds later. good catch, missed that. I read that the army wanted a laser guided mortar - looks like they got one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romad1 Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 3 hours ago, Tigeraholic1 said: It looked kinetic. However, the fact that the tank is going through a known obstacle could mean that a mine or something was there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romad1 Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 Glomar response if you ask me about this. I think the higher number seems reasonable. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigerbomb13 Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 This is the brewery that has converted to making Molotov cocktails. They have opened their recipes for other breweries to make to raise money for relief, and some breweries here are starting to do this. Pretty cool. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oblong Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 22 minutes ago, Tigerbomb13 said: This is the brewery that has converted to making Molotov cocktails. They have opened their recipes for other breweries to make to raise money for relief, and some breweries here are starting to do this. Pretty cool. Who here is doing it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romad1 Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romad1 Posted March 15, 2022 Share Posted March 15, 2022 Yeah, them cope cages aka Javelin cages...not so great Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 11 hours ago, Archie said: Interesting coming from China. What are they doing now? Giving Russia aid is doing nothing to de-escalate the situation. Just read the piece. Of course the Ambassador may just be dissembling but taken at face value there was little comfort there for Putin. And I would have to think the Chinese respect Western Intelligence capabilities enough not to think they can do much to resupply Putin without being found out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romad1 Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 Ok, now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigerbomb13 Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 5 hours ago, oblong said: Who here is doing it? Haven’t heard of any local ones doing this yet, but Eastern Market Brewing is doing an “anti imperial” stout for the International Red Cross https://www.instagram.com/p/CbGrd2VrFa2/?utm_medium=copy_link 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romad1 Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 another notch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 I'll be happy if the guns go silent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 The Russians literally shot and killed a photo journalist who works for this network... and yet they keep bringing on Kremlin Barbie to spew talking points. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtutiger Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pfife Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 11 hours ago, 1776 said: Russia imposed sanctions on President Biden and other top U.S. officials, in a move aimed at restricting travel to Russia in response to “unprecedented sanctions” preventing Russian officials from entering the U.S. Russia’s foreign ministry said on Tuesday that it also sanctioned Secretary of State Antony Blinken, Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin, CIA Director William Burns and White House press secretary Jen Psaki. The list also includes former Secretary of State Hillary Clinton and Mr. Biden’s son, Hunter Biden. The Kremlin’s latest round of travel restrictions includes 13 people, and the foreign ministry said the measures could be expanded. “In the near future, new announcements will follow to expand the sanctions list by including top U.S. officials, military, lawmakers, businessmen, experts and media people who are Russophobic or who contribute to inciting hatred against Russia and the introduction of restrictive measures,” the foreign ministry said in a statement. -WSJ don't threaten us with a good time there poot 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romad1 Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
romad1 Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 Klitchko is a Trumplican's idea of a tough guy. Too bad the Trumpies are on the wrong side of this war. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 Anyone interested in a Ukrainian backdoor entry into NATO? Zelenskyy cedes the western half of Ukraine to Poland (west of the Dnieper River, which includes current hot spots Kiev, Kherson, and Nikolaev. It is also 95% ethnic Ukrainians, as opposed to East of the Dnieper which is 95% Russian. I'm not certain of the exact numbers... but something along those lines...). Poland admits the union of western Ukraine officially into Polish control. Poland/(western Ukraine) declares war on Russian troops West of the Dnieper River. Putin sues for a peace deal. PS: Historical precedent - The Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth in the 16th century included Poland, Lithuania, and western Ukraine. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted March 16, 2022 Author Share Posted March 16, 2022 15 hours ago, romad1 said: “Civilians are going about their business in Kyiv. There is no war. Only an operation to restore peace for the people against the aggression of UkroNazi nationalists perpetrating genocide of the Russian-speaking population.” 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ewsieg Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 3 hours ago, 1984Echoes said: Anyone interested in a Ukrainian backdoor entry into NATO? Zelenskyy cedes the western half of Ukraine to Poland (west of the Dnieper River, which includes current hot spots Kiev, Kherson, and Nikolaev. It is also 95% ethnic Ukrainians, as opposed to East of the Dnieper which is 95% Russian. I'm not certain of the exact numbers... but something along those lines...). Poland admits the union of western Ukraine officially into Polish control. Poland/(western Ukraine) declares war on Russian troops West of the Dnieper River. Putin sues for a peace deal. PS: Historical precedent - The Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth in the 16th century included Poland, Lithuania, and western Ukraine. Why should Zelensky cede anything if NATO agrees to go to war with Russia? Minds well march in there without the backdoor reasoning and take all of Ukraine, including Crimea back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tigeraholic1 Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Archie Posted March 16, 2022 Share Posted March 16, 2022 16 minutes ago, Tigeraholic1 said: Its obvious this guy hasn't spent anytime in a war zone. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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