Biden's presidency

[oblong]

If someone is getting worked up it says a lot about them and not Biden. 

[Tigeraholic1]

3 minutes ago, oblong said:

If someone is getting worked up it says a lot about them and not Biden. 

So do you feel that speech last night was an attempt at uniting Americans or furthering the divide? 

[Motown Bombers]

There is no uniting with people who are trying to overturn democracy.

[smr-nj]

18 minutes ago, Tigeraholic1 said:

It's all funny and laughable but I am telling this is feeling different. The folks I know are not the MAGA J6 types. They are 10-20 year vets who served 3-4 tours. They are operators who know how to inflict damage and disappear. Biden is deff making a mistake getting these guys worked up.

Honestly, why on earth would anything he said get them “riled up”?  He spoke to people who would defend the capital police ATTACKERS being called patriots.  
Are you saying that in your experience THAT is what vets you know are thinking??

 I give veterans more credit than that.

[oblong]

10 minutes ago, Tigeraholic1 said:

So do you feel that speech last night was an attempt at uniting Americans or furthering the divide? 

When you can put fascists and similar types and people get upset… well… guilty conscience by some.  Some people don’t deserve to be united with, I don’t care how many tours they did.  

[Tigeraholic1]

4 minutes ago, oblong said:

When you can put fascists and similar types and people get upset… well… guilty conscience by some.  Some people don’t deserve to be united with, I don’t care how many tours they did.  

So you agree it was divisive. 

[RatkoVarda]

this sums it up nicely for the pearl clutchers; it's Biden's duty to confront Trump and his fascist horde

 

[VegasTiger]

Time for this again?

[ben9753]

2 minutes ago, Tigeraholic1 said:

So you agree it was divisive. 

For people who love it when someone "tells it like it is" they sure are snowflakes when their fee fees get hurt.

[VegasTiger]

[mtutiger]

33 minutes ago, Tigeraholic1 said:

So do you feel that speech last night was an attempt at uniting Americans or furthering the divide? 

The speech spent a great deal of time confronting candidates and an ideology tailor made to divide Americans. Such as candidates who do not respect the outcomes of elections.

Does that factor in at all to your assessment? 

Edited September 2, 2022 by mtutiger

[mtutiger]

22 minutes ago, ben9753 said:

For people who love it when someone "tells it like it is" they sure are snowflakes when their fee fees get hurt.

What is hilarious about this debate is how, basically, anybody who is Joe Manchin or left must submit to being called Communists or groomers or whatever. 

But God help you, have mercy on your soul, if you say anything about those candidates or supporters who do not respect the outcome of free and fair elections. That's a bridge too far.

It's such a load of crap, and it is telling that no one will speak to the double standard.

Edited September 2, 2022 by mtutiger

[romad1]

1 hour ago, Tigeraholic1 said:

So you agree it was divisive. 

In the way that a surgeon's scalpel is divisive when it removes the cancer from the body.

In the way that the Allied armies in World War II were divisive in killing nazi scum.

Edited September 2, 2022 by romad1

[gehringer_2]

18 minutes ago, romad1 said:

In the way that a surgeon's scalpel is divisive when it removes the cancer from the body.

In the way that the Allied armies in World War II were divisive in killing nazi scum.

Yup. Ukraine becoming independent is 'divisive' also come to think of it. 

[Motown Bombers]

 

[1984Echoes]

4 hours ago, Edman85 said:

Again, let's go back to 2016. We realize that a majority of America, not just backwoods ignoramuses, maybe dose on 5 minutes of current events a day, right? "Basket of Deplorables" backfired because it was able to be cast as a broad insult toward people who don't have time in their lives for political nuance. Just that picture alone of an angry President with an ominous backdrop is enough to give political fuel to that class of person. That class of person isn't MAGA: they just have a busy job, families, and don't want to be dragged into this morasse.

Right...

But in 2016 there were a lot of unknowns for the uninitiated on exactly who or what Trump was. And for those who were under financial duress in 2016, whether due to competition for high paying jobs or the evaporation of high paying jobs (manufacturing or other) or the lack of education/ ability to obtain a reasonable job that a family could be raised on... for this group of people I would give the most cause to turn to someone like Trump who, although he's been a con-artist his entire life.. the message of "Trust me, I can fix everything/ I can bring back your manufacturing jobs" well... that sounds pretty good.

But it seems you're making a statement that 2022 and beyond are no different whatsoever from 2016... and I don't think that's true. I mean obviously, enough has come to light that a "reasonable" person, even if they re not politically initiated, can still see the shit storm that is surrounding Trump. Unless someone is hiding inside the Fox News cocoon... but I don't think that is reasonable person. Someone looking to be angry, at someone, and willing to be demagogic, or to lash out, is neither uninitiated nor reasonable. The center right, center left, Independents, etc... Will not be demagogic to that degree.

So I think the extremism of MAGA SHOULD be called out for the following three reasons:

1) To the uninitiated, as you have pointed out, they are busy with their jobs and family and life, etc... so they are just going to ignore this, right? It's background noise. If Trump holding Top Secret documents illegally, whatever issues are at the southern border, Biden cheering a couple of great plans for the American people on the one hand and being angry at MAGA on the other hand... all falls to the wayside because they have more important things on their mind. This is all immaterial, right? Why would you pick out this one issue and raise it above all others? If they are busy with life, there's only ONE issue that will dominate all others: money. Do they have a job, is the economy strong, is inflation killing them? It's all about the money to support one's family. To me, "MAGA is BAD" is a non-issue with these folks. People vote their pocket book. 

2) To the center right and Independents... This is pretty black and white IMO. There's no gray here. MAGA is willing to resort to violence and fascism. If someone uses this as an excuse to run back to Trump, they were never center right or Independent to begin with. There are no excuses any more, Trump and his followers have exposed themselves as who they actually are. I think this EXACT MESSAGE needs to be shouted out loud, by Biden, the FBI, etc., etc., etc. "We see you, we see you for your lies, for your violence, your hatreds and bigotry, and we will respond accordingly". If someone is center right.. you are saying that THIS message (including Angry Biden) will make them run back to Trump? Ummm... I don't think so.

3) That exact message, and not just message but actions; domestic terrorist cells need to be investigated (Proud Boys, 3 Percenters, Oath Keepers, etc.), and charges brought to trial for their actions... and publicly. If they are not publicly called out, and that includes the political movement and the politicians who are supporting this fascism as well as the terrorist militias all across America... then they think that no one is watching them and they can get away with murder or the kidnapping and execution of a Governor (Whitmer) or the overthrow of our Democracy. I believe this MUST be called out, out loud... and maybe the opposite will happen... not center right running back to Trump... but some people who may not be 100% invested in violent fascism, even if they support MAGA, might realize that things have gone too far...

But we'll see. We'll see how people react... pretty soon in fact with midterms coming up.

[Motown Bombers]

Edited September 2, 2022 by Motown Bombers

[Motown Bombers]

Apparently this is supposed to be an attack on Biden.

 

[CMRivdogs]

Are we talking about the same "conservatives" that gave Viktor Orban a rousing ovation last month when he was the featured speaker at their most significant gathering? Now their crying because they were "insulted" by Biden.

https://www.reuters.com/world/orban-tells-cpac-conservatives-europe-us-must-align-troops-2024-votes-2022-05-19/

All this after spending the last 20 years or so calling Democrats socialists, and accusing them of "ruining" the country only to come up speechless and insulting when they are asked to give details for their belief.

I've got the world's smallest violin for them. Cry babies. 

[mtutiger]

 

[Motown Bombers]

 

[Motown Bombers]

 

[1984Echoes]

49 minutes ago, Motown Bombers said:

 

Can we add his head, on a spike, in front of the US Capitol instead?

Personal preference.

[Tigeraholic1]

14 hours ago, romad1 said:

In the way that a surgeon's scalpel is divisive when it removes the cancer from the body.

In the way that the Allied armies in World War II were divisive in killing nazi scum.

So what comes of it? Do we round up MAGA lock them up? Take their guns? Send them to reeducation camps? I am being serious, how do we move forward?

[mtutiger]

3 minutes ago, Tigeraholic1 said:

So what comes of it? Do we round up MAGA lock them up? Take their guns? Send them to reeducation camps? I am being serious, how do we move forward?

You show up in November and vote against the ideology?

That's largely what I heard in the speech, but someone correct me if they heard otherwise.