Useful Idiot Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 6 minutes ago, chasfh said: It's a serious question seeing how you are asking the same question of someone else here who is being hopeful. Your question suggests you won't give the team three years, so how long will you give them? I don't anticipate bailing out. (you should be so lucky) But' unlike several here, I have no intention of drinking the (Ken Kesey) Kool-aid, either Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted December 12, 2022 Author Share Posted December 12, 2022 Just now, Useful Idiot said: I don't anticipate bailing out. (you should be so lucky) But' unlike several here, I have no intention of drinking the (Ken Kesey) Kool-aid, either Yes. We know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Useful Idiot Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 8 minutes ago, Shinzaki said: To trot out an oldie...you're projecting more than Bell and Howell The prospect of being either a net payer, OR a net recipient in the revenue sharing game, is not some half baked scheme that I just dreamed up. It's very real Happy I could illuminate this dark chasm for you today Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Useful Idiot Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 4 minutes ago, chasfh said: Yes. We know. Well great, then can we please dispense with the "we hate you for not allowing us to put a ring in your nose" game that you all seem so obsessed with? I think my skin is thicker than your barbs are deep Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chasfh Posted December 12, 2022 Author Share Posted December 12, 2022 Just now, Useful Idiot said: Well great, then can we please dispense with the "we hate you for not allowing us to put a ring in your nose" game that you all seem so obsessed with? I think my skin is thicker than your barbs are deep I have no idea what any of this means. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RatkoVarda Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 simply hover over someone's avatar, and click "Ignore"; try it; it is both fun and easy! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Useful Idiot Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 Basically, I feel that the Ilitch brain trust has been rubbing it's azz in our faces, since 2017. And members here insulting me for being observant, really isn't having the effect many of you might be supposing? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Useful Idiot Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 7 minutes ago, chasfh said: I have no idea what any of this means. That's a shame, you more than some others here impress me as capable of distilling abstract metaphors Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gehringer_2 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 (edited) 43 minutes ago, Useful Idiot said: Winning requires talent, talent costs money. Ironically enough, this statement is transcendantly false in baseball. In the first 6 yrs of his career, Aaron Judge put up 26 WAR for a total cost to the Yankee's of ~18M. What is true in baseball is that *old* talent costs you money - lots of money, while young talent is unbelievably cheap. Ergo, it is quite possible to win in Baseball at lower cost than the other guy by simply having a younger team than the other guy. That is certainly what Avila was aiming for and failed to accomplish, and what Harris is also undoubtedly aiming for, and has yet to accomplish. In fact, any baseball ownership not intent on that same objective is probably not very smart (I see you, Texas Rangers!), which is why it is hard to do in the face of the active competition of 29 orther clubs (OK, 28). Still, I don't think anyone is going to stop trying. Edited December 12, 2022 by gehringer_2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 16 hours ago, Tigermojo said: Rumors! Not very exciting though... https://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2022/12/latest-on-tigers-offseason-targets.html Lugo is not exciting, but is OK. The rest are uninteresting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buddha Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 13 hours ago, Tenacious D said: If… guys hit like they have in the past (Meadows, Baez, Schoop) as well as up to their potential (Tork, Greene), things could get better much quicker. i honestly expect this to happen. i do not expect them to be that bad offensively two years in a row. 4 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shinzaki Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 (edited) 44 minutes ago, Useful Idiot said: The prospect of being either a net payer, OR a net recipient in the revenue sharing game, is not some half baked scheme that I just dreamed up. It's very real Happy I could illuminate this dark chasm for you today But the idea that we have the ability to qualify for it seems half baked. I'm glad I could spatula that for you Edited December 12, 2022 by Shinzaki Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tenacious D Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 hour ago, RatkoVarda said: simply hover over someone's avatar, and click "Ignore"; try it; it is both fun and easy! This only works effectively if everyone would stop quoting certain contrarian individuals. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 hour ago, buddha said: i honestly expect this to happen. i do not expect them to be that bad offensively two years in a row. The plexiglass principle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 hour ago, Useful Idiot said: Basically, I feel that the Ilitch brain trust has been rubbing it's azz in our faces, since 2017. And members here insulting me for being observant, really isn't having the effect many of you might be supposing? Says the guy who said last spring that Baez was the same as Neifi Perez and Reyes was ready to break out. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Useful Idiot Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 2 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: Says the guy who said last spring that Baez was the same as Neifi Perez and Reyes was ready to break out. Baez was a klinker, regardless if you are willing to admit it of not. We went for the "lower priced spread" in terms of available shortstops at the time, and, IMO, were commensurately rewarded. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 6 hours ago, mtutiger said: It's also not that far off of what the Giants had been doing the past few years, bringing in the Lamont Wade types and trying to maximize value out of them. With the team where it is at this moment, I don't see an issue with it. Next offseason, if they do beat expectations and start getting more production out of the roster, I could understand being upset with them not being in the running for bigger names. Agreed 100% Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Useful Idiot Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, gehringer_2 said: Ironically enough, this statement is transcendantly false in baseball. In the first 6 yrs of his career, Aaron Judge put up 26 WAR for a total cost to the Yankee's of ~18M. What is true in baseball is that *old* talent costs you money - lots of money, while young talent is unbelievably cheap. Ergo, it is quite possible to win in Baseball at lower cost than the other guy by simply having a younger team than the other guy. That is certainly what Avila was aiming for and failed to accomplish, and what Harris is also undoubtedly aiming for, and has yet to accomplish. In fact, any baseball ownership not intent on that same objective is probably not very smart (I see you, Texas Rangers!), which is why it is hard to do in the face of the active competition of 29 orther clubs (OK, 28). Still, I don't think anyone is going to stop trying. You alone have been willing to engage me without the slights and "sharktank" exploits that seem to fascinate so many here, so I want to return the favor. The following sarcasm is not intended as a slight to you, but rather as an indictment of the general state of the game: So, once all the general managers figure out that accomplished talent is worthless, when will the bottom fall out? There are outliers (both ways) , but the teams that seem to be in contention year after year tend to have aggregate payrolls well north of our neighborhood. Thinking we can "halve" the benchmark standard and still "have" the prize, seems like overly wishful thinking to me Edited December 12, 2022 by Useful Idiot Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiger337 Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 6 minutes ago, Useful Idiot said: You alone have been willing to engage me without the slights and "sharktank" exploits that seem to fascinate so many here, so I want to return the favor. Gehringer is definitely the most mature among us Motown Forumers (MFers?). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 2 hours ago, Useful Idiot said: I really see that as an abusive comment. Hope you found it gratifying. What I've concluded is that I'll be dead of old age before this team is ever close to dominance. So I feel the reality is more one that this team quit me. So when the Tigers are in the Playoffs in 2024... Do we need to check in on you? "UI, you still there? Hello? Hello?" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casimir Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 hour ago, buddha said: i honestly expect this to happen. i do not expect them to be that bad offensively two years in a row. I agree. Its just going to be a matter of how much of a rebound they have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Useful Idiot Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 1 hour ago, Shinzaki said: But the idea that we have the ability to qualify for it seems half baked. I'm glad I could spatula that for you It's a matter of how you look at it. In 2012 our attendance was in the top 10 of major league baseball. . We drew over 3 million paying fans in 2012...that is a robust attendance figure. Hardly "small market". We would qualify as a net payor today with such a figure But, the organization also operated at a net loss that year (2012) due in no small part to payroll expense. So Ilitch could spend his way into becoming a payor once again (by fielding a competitive roster)...or he can savor the low hanging fruit by keeping payroll low, and pocketing the revenue sharing. He is in effect "rewarded" for fielding a dud. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Useful Idiot Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 (edited) 22 minutes ago, Tiger337 said: Gehringer is definitely the most mature among us Motown Forumers (MFers?). I just don't see the value in the insults some seem to prefer to use to express their disagreement. I can only guess they envision the act as being some form of "sharktank" designed to intimidate me and bring me under control? (hence the metaphor about trying to put a ring in my nose) The fact that I was able to rechristen the sharktank, and re-brand it as the monkeycage, and elicit a response, did tickle me, I will admit that Edited December 12, 2022 by Useful Idiot 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Useful Idiot Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 10 minutes ago, 1984Echoes said: So when the Tigers are in the Playoffs in 2024... Do we need to check in on you? "UI, you still there? Hello? Hello?" LOL. Complete honesty, nothing would make me happier than to eat that crow. Here, let me make it easy for you, when that happens, feel free to post the following to me: But I believe that under the present operational strategy, there is a less than 10% chance of that happening...and even that IMO is being generous Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1984Echoes Posted December 12, 2022 Share Posted December 12, 2022 The flipside is... even before the 2024 season... If during the 2023 season the team fixes its issues with health, rotation, rookies (actually 2nd year players in 2023) performance woes/ team's hitting woes... and starts to show signs of life, and therefore... in the 2023 offseason we sign Manny Machado to the biggest offseason contract because he WANTS and MUST play for the Tigers in 2024... Does that change your narrative? PS: Eduardo and Baez decide they want to play with Machado too so they DON'T opt out... in fact, they're the two guys who talk Manny into signing with Detroit as long as he gets the BIGGEST contract which, apparently works... because.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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