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2022-23 Detroit Tigers Offseason Thread


chasfh

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55 minutes ago, alex said:

This is IMHO actually quite good. Now they have these players as depth (I believe mtutiger and others here mentioned this philosophy before as well).

FWIW, I believe they could have pulled Feliciano and/or Ibanez back if they were claimed and then just kept them on the 40, all without anyone knowing really publicly they had been claimed.

Next they can add from here another waiver claim or two and/or add via FA or trade.

Outright waivers are not revocable. 

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11 minutes ago, Tiger337 said:

I have already said I am giving Harris time and am not ready to criticize him.  I just think the volume of mostly useless players being churned is humorous.  

The way I see it, there are multiple players on last years 40 man roster (Brendon Davis, Angel De Jesus, etc.) who are no longer on the 40 man and still in the org.

It's progress, and it is a pretty big example of not being an Avila "paint by numbers" approach. Money or risk is kind of irrelevant, Avila did not do this stuff, which seems notable.

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8 minutes ago, mtutiger said:

The way I see it, there are multiple players on last years 40 man roster (Brendon Davis, Angel De Jesus, etc.) who are no longer on the 40 man and still in the org.

It's progress, and it is a pretty big example of not being an Avila "paint by numbers" approach. Money or risk is kind of irrelevant, Avila did not do this stuff, which seems notable.

It is a clear difference.  Whether or not it's a meaningful one remains to be seen.  

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I think Harris's use of the waiver wire, tedious though it may be, is a solid strategy to slowly but surely build depth not only in the system, but at the bottom of the 40-man as well. The churn is a byproduct of the process as, I imagine, the Harris team has assigned a numerical score for each player in the Organized Baseball universe, and when a player with a higher score comes available, they put the lowest score guy on waivers and let him go if claimed, and stash him if not. It is definitely your father's general managing strategy, provided your name is Alex.

I also find it humorous to see guys churned just days after being picked up.

Edited by chasfh
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Just now, Tiger337 said:

It is a clear difference.  Whether or not it's a meaningful one remains to be seen.  

I disagree, I would call it meaningful right this moment. This organization needed depth, and it increasingly has more having added players who are former prospects and / or have had previous major league experience. And it isn't Avila-esque.

There is this tendency to want to discount it because it may be low risk, but when the alternative was the previous guy who wouldn't even make these sorts of low risk decisions, it counts as progress. 

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6 minutes ago, chasfh said:

I also find it humorous to see guys churned just days after being picked up.

It's the humorous part, but it may be the most important part of what he's doing.

Guys like Mario Feliciano and Andy Ibanez are pretty solid options to have as non-40 man guys if the team gets hit with injuries at those particular positions.

With any luck, maybe it means the days of Jacob Robson or Josh Lester types getting ML ABs might be over.

Edited by mtutiger
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1 hour ago, mtutiger said:

So what? It's an example of how Harris isn't Al Avila or a "paint by numbers" approach, which was the point being made.

its the hoping someone elses scrap bin players might turn into something... the method might be different but the idea is the same

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11 minutes ago, Toddwert said:

its the hoping someone elses scrap bin players might turn into something... 

Not really, it's about building depth in the minor leagues that can be useful when injuries and attrition inevitably happen. 

Avila did not use the waiver wire like this. He just didn't. 

We all acknowledged this as an issue when Avila was GM. Now that Harris is here, it gets mocked. I dont get it.

Edited by mtutiger
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36 minutes ago, mtutiger said:

Not really, it's about building depth in the minor leagues that can be useful when injuries and attrition inevitably happen. 

Avila did not use the waiver wire like this. He just didn't. 

We all acknowledged this as an issue when Avila was GM. Now that Harris is here, it gets mocked. I dont get it.

He's not getting mocked for it.  It's the right thing to do, but it's funny. 

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55 minutes ago, Toddwert said:

its the hoping someone elses scrap bin players might turn into something... the method might be different but the idea is the same

The difference here is that the sheer rate by which Harris is increasing the churn of players through use of the waiver system versus Avila increases the chances of finding useful players, and who knows, maybe even an undiscovered gem. Even if the hit rate of getting a WAR-positive player onto the roster is one in 10, it's worth the effort, because as an example, one in 10 out of 100 is worth far more than one in 10 out of 10.

Christian Walker, Ramon Urias, and Jorge Mateo were all 3+ WAR players picked up by their current team off the waiver wire. The latter two by the Orioles, a team very much in our boat the past few seasons, and an organization we could do worse than to emulate when it comes to player acquisition.

Edited by chasfh
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40 minutes ago, Tiger337 said:

He's not getting mocked for it.  It's the right thing to do, but it's funny. 

I have seen a lot of people that have complained about his approach in terms of churning players since this offseason has began. Including on this board.

Edited by mtutiger
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38 minutes ago, Tenacious D said:

For me, this will be an interesting test of our player evaluation abilities.  They clearly see upside potential in these players that hasn’t manifested itself yet.  

They may not find much of any, but its better than sitting around and doing nothing (which was the Avila approach)

My objection is that some continually keep drawing a line between Harris and Avila when this is a clear cut example of how the two are much different.

Edited by mtutiger
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