2021-22 Tigers Hot Stove League

[Scottwood]

  On 11/3/2021 at 11:24 PM, RandyMarsh said:

Buster Posey walked away from 22 million dollars, if only we would get that lucky and Cabrera would do something similar next offseason. Of course unlike Cabrera, Posey is still valuable so Im sure the Giants aren't exactly thrilled about this. 

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Posey had an equity stake in Bodyarmor- a drink company that was just acquired by Coca-Cola for $5.6 billion. It sounds like he might have made more from that deal than his total career earnings. Kobe Bryant's estate is getting $400 million from it.

Edited November 4, 2021 by Scottwood

[KL2]

  On 11/4/2021 at 2:42 AM, buddha said:

Which might say a bit about our draft strategy for a second rounder...

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Many second rounders never make the majors and the ones that do its rare to find a guy who puts up a career war above 8. So it's not so much ours, but just the way 2nd rounders work. Fun to talk about em on draft night. But by year 8 they've all become pretty meh

I mean a fun example, in 2014 and 15 the top war players out of all second round players are....Tyler Alexander and Spencer Turnbull! (well Turnbull was till Verdugio passed him in the second half). But, just goes to show what most second rounders are. 

Edited November 4, 2021 by KL2

[KL2]

On Posey, I mean I get it but I don get it, why he's this sure fire first ballot hall of famer. His counting numbers are bad, even for a catcher. 158 homers, 729 RBI, 1500 hits. One year with an OPS above .900. 

Compare that to say...Bill Freehan. 200 homers, 758 RBI and 1591 hits. and 0 years with an OPS above .900. 

Now sure Freehan played in some 400 odd games more, but its just an example to show that Posey's counting offensive stats are pretty pedestrian. (and let's not forget freehan's prime years were dead ball era 2 of 1968).

They aren't the end all be all, and i know what the saber and defense shows, but its part of the pie and I don't quite get this thought that he should get 99.72 percent of hall of fame votes on fthe first try. 

[gehringer_2]

  On 11/4/2021 at 5:35 AM, KL2 said:

On Posey, I mean I get it but I don get it, why he's this sure fire first ballot hall of famer. His counting numbers are bad, even for a catcher. 158 homers, 729 RBI, 1500 hits. One year with an OPS above .900. 

Compare that to say...Bill Freehan. 200 homers, 758 RBI and 1591 hits. and 0 years with an OPS above .900. 

Now sure Freehan played in some 400 odd games more, but its just an example to show that Posey's counting offensive stats are pretty pedestrian. (and let's not forget freehan's prime years were dead ball era 2 of 1968).

They aren't the end all be all, and i know what the saber and defense shows, but its part of the pie and I don't quite get this thought that he should get 99.72 percent of hall of fame votes on fthe first try. 

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If you compare stats to the player who may be the best in history at his position not in the HOF, you will get outcomes like that.....

Edited November 4, 2021 by gehringer_2

[gehringer_2]

BTW, the Reds also have a pitcher who was the starter in 39 of their wins in '19 and '21 and also has a '22 option they may not want to pick up.

 

[RandyMarsh]

Barnhart wasted no time photo shopping himself into a Tigers uniform for his profile pic on Twitter, between that and the letter he posted he genuinely seems excited to be here.  

[Archie]

The more I hear about Barnhart the more I like this deal especially with few catchers available.  Tigers didn't give up much to get him and it only a one year deal if it doesn't work. 

Now on to pitching help.  I know they wouldn't be looked at as starters but I wonder if Tigers would sign Daniel Norris or Shane Greene to minor deals or give nonroster ST invites?  I don't know about Norris but Greene might have some value.  Missing ST last year hurt his whole season.

[casimir]

  On 11/3/2021 at 7:40 PM, Tenacious D said:

my offseason wish list (documented yesterday on the Tweeter) is/was Correa, Stroman and Barnhart.  Don't disappoint me, Al.

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I do like this suggestion.

[casimir]

  On 11/3/2021 at 8:34 PM, Jim Cowan said:

Bravo, Al Avila.  Quintana was never going to make it to Erie, and was thrown in there to make it look like a trade. Barnhart is good defensively with a .700 OPS, LHB, from the 9th spot in the order.  This is a perfect outcome to solve the hole at catcher, could not conceivably be better.

We should acknowledge that the OPS is in the home park where Suarez hits 40 home runs.  But still, this is a brilliant personnel move.

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It does seem a pretty clever move on the Tigers' part to acquire a guy that the Reds were likely to just let walk away (sounds like they have a younger C that is about MLB ready).

Also fortunate given the timing of Buster Posey announcing his retirement.

[casimir]

  On 11/3/2021 at 11:16 PM, 1776 said:

On the topic of catchers, it appears that Buster Posey will announce his retirement tomorrow.

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Time to start floating Greiner's availability in the media.

[casimir]

  On 11/4/2021 at 4:21 AM, Jim Cowan said:

If a guy is better than most of the other catchers defensively, and hits the same as the rest of them...he's a good player, right?

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Need some sock height metrics for a full evaluation.

[Cruzer1]

Last year I had Robbie Grossman on my fantasy team, and thought he'd be a good fit for the Tigers. This year, I had Tucker Barnhardt and felt the same about him. Next year, I'll have Wander...well, I'll also have Torkelson and Greene.

[casimir]

  On 11/4/2021 at 5:59 AM, gehringer_2 said:

BTW, the Reds also have a pitcher who was the starter in 39 of their wins in '19 and '21 and also has a '22 option they may not want to pick up.

 

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Who 'dis?  I looked over bbref and it doesn't pop out at me?

P Michael Lorezen is a FA.  He wants a crack at the rotation, but I have a hard time with offering him a guaranteed spot.  But he's got a big arm, so, is this a situation where Fetter gets to call a shot?   Additionally, he could be a RHH PH/OF option.  Just kind of glancing over some of his advanced pitching ratios, he ain't far off of Funkhouser, in terms of career numerals.

[romad1]

  On 11/4/2021 at 3:07 AM, IdahoBert said:

Those people were morons. We have higher standards around here. 

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I can't wait to start the "Al for Presidente'" thread in this esteemed board. 

[casimir]

  On 11/2/2021 at 10:56 AM, romad1 said:

Just a great image

 

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Do you think they've decided where in the ballpark this statue will be?

[gehringer_2]

  On 11/4/2021 at 11:36 AM, casimir said:

Who 'dis?  I looked over bbref and it doesn't pop out at me?

 

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Miley. '22 $10M club option with $1M buyout. If the Reds are dumb enough to not want to pay him next season they save the $1M moving him to a team willing to pickup up the main option. It's probably unlikely even the Reds would dump a 14 game winner over $10M  but we can always hope!

Of course if Castellanos opts out they will save a chunk there.

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/cincinnati-reds/wade-miley-8797/

[romad1]

  On 11/4/2021 at 1:11 PM, casimir said:

Do you think they've decided where in the ballpark this statue will be?

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It should be the ballpark.  The actual playing surface will be in the baldspot on Al's head.   the scale will be enormous.  The legs of Chris Illitch will be located in Bell Isle.  Al will be somewhere around Zug Island.  AJ will be the located near the former Renaissance Center -- repurposed for the needs of the ballpark/statue. 

 

edit: as I relook at  the picture...is that Chris I on the far side of the photo or some other guy?

Edited November 4, 2021 by romad1

[Tiger337]

  On 11/4/2021 at 2:42 AM, buddha said:

right.  most catchers cant hit.  so they gave up something to pay him to not hit.

but since i dont really think they gave up anything of value, im fine with it.

which might say a bit about our draft strategy for a second rounder...

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They are probably paying him to catch.  He seems to be good at it, although it's hard to confirm because statistical evaluation of catcher defense is so incomplete.  

[Archie]

  On 11/4/2021 at 1:42 PM, romad1 said:

It should be the ballpark.  The actual playing surface will be in the baldspot on Al's head.   the scale will be enormous.  The legs of Chris Illitch will be located in Bell Isle.  Al will be somewhere around Zug Island.  AJ will be the located near the former Renaissance Center -- repurposed for the needs of the ballpark/statue. 

 

edit: as I relook at  the picture...is that Chris I on the far side of the photo or some other guy?

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Why couldn't they transform the RenCen into the statue?  Isn't it tall enough?

[chasfh]

  On 11/4/2021 at 1:33 PM, gehringer_2 said:

Miley. '22 $10M club option with $1M buyout. If the Reds are dumb enough to not want to pay him next season they save the $1M moving him to a team willing to pickup up the main option. It's probably unlikely even the Reds would dump a 14 game winner over $10M  but we can always hope!

Of course if Castellanos opts out they will save a chunk there.

https://www.spotrac.com/mlb/cincinnati-reds/wade-miley-8797/

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Looks like the Reds are burning that sucker to the ground so Wade Miley may be sprung. Maybe we can swing a Barnhart-type deal with them again. I would definitely approve a one year gamble on Miley for $10MM. Surely we have another 3B prospect we can offer up in return?

Signing Miley off the open market, though? This past season was his career year by a wide margin, so he might bamboozle some team into a 3/45. I wouldn't want the Tigers to be that team.

[1984Echoes]

  On 11/4/2021 at 1:33 PM, gehringer_2 said:

Miley. '22 $10M club option with $1M buyout..

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I think Miley is fool's gold at his age. Not interested, I'd like to find better.

Now, if that were Tyler Mahle, I'd say lets take a shot to try and get him.

Alas... tis ain't.

[sabretooth]

  On 11/3/2021 at 8:54 PM, chasfh said:

I know I wasn't a fan of signing Barnhart, mainly because of his bat, and the Tigers definitely need to improve their hitting, but he's on our team now and so I have faith in him. I pride myself and think of myself as a man of faith, as there’s a drive into deep left field by Castellanos, it will be a home run. And so that’ll make it a 4-0 ballgame.

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Yeah, Barnhart basically sucks but he fills a hole that otherwise would be filled by Greiner, so I guess that's a 0.5 WAR improvement.....yay

I guess this splash means that we don't need a SS or and OF, now, right?  /sarcasm

[sabretooth]

  On 11/3/2021 at 7:52 PM, Sports_Freak said:

I'm starting to think the Tigers won't go for an established star at SS. Not for a long term contract. I think they'll sign someone on a one year contract to see if Kreidler is the future.

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He's not.  Or, if he is, than we are doomed.

[Tiger337]

I really doubt Kreidler is going to be a significant part of their future or that he is going to enter into their thinking process this winter.  If they don't sign a shortstop, it will be because other teams outbid them.  

[gehringer_2]

  On 11/4/2021 at 3:46 PM, 1984Echoes said:

I think Miley is fool's gold at his age. Not interested, I'd like to find better.

Now, if that were Tyler Mahle, I'd say lets take a shot to try and get him.

Alas... tis ain't.

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I don't think Al is looking for long term or top of the rotation pitching so I could see a guy like Miley as a likely target. $10million might be more than they would go for Miley though. With the dollars now spent for Barnhardt you imagine there must be a remaining number for the total they are going to spend on pitching and SS. Since Chris has taken over it seems their process it to set a number and spend right to it.  If they miss on a top SS I could see them going bigger on a pitcher than they might initially be inclined to.