2021-22 Tigers Hot Stove League

[buddha]

10 minutes ago, gehringer_2 said:

right. The fans' complaint really should be that as baseball has evolved it has ended up as a cockeyed, backward way to run a major sport which has left pretty much everyone with bad incentives (at least from a fan perspective)

exactly.  the current system is great for the owners now that they've figured it out.

the other three american sports went through this same sort of debate with their employees and all came up with systems that guaranteed the players a share of the revenue and the owners a fixed ceiling on labor costs.

baseball eschews that for a variety of reasons - mostly based on a century of abuse of the players by the owners and the distrust that comes from that.  the current system was once a good thing for the players, but now they refuse to see how it should be scrapped to benefit everyone rather than just leaving open the possibility for the few mega contracts to continue to get higher.

that said, it will now be really difficult for the players to get the owners to give up the advantages of having the players locked into below market contracts for 3 to 6 years.  now that the owners have figured out how fungible players actually are.  playoff expansion only adds to that.

[sabretooth]

10 hours ago, Cruzer1 said:

I disagree, they need to go all out and win as many games as possible. This is going to be a really good division sooner than later. The Twins are better, the Royals have a load coming up, and the Guardians are the Guardians. Chicago's system is really thin, so they don't have much room to get better. That's the time to strike.

Yes!  Cruzer and I are on the same page 👍

[RatkoVarda]

Anderson to LAD.

Literally just Pineda and Cueto left, and then Minor league deals

[gehringer_2]

2 minutes ago, RatkoVarda said:

Anderson to LAD.

Literally just Pineda and Cueto left, and then Minor league deals

Cueto is probably toast.

[chasfh]

2 hours ago, oblong said:

I think there is enough complexity in accounting rules and how these teams are structured than an org can show whatever suits them in terms of a profit or not. When a team goes on sale there’s demand.  

Which probably goes a long way toward explaining why they have no interest in showing the books.

[chasfh]

18 minutes ago, RatkoVarda said:

Anderson to LAD.

Literally just Pineda and Cueto left, and then Minor league deals

Looking more and more like ride or die with whatever legit major leaguers they got.

[1776]

11 minutes ago, chasfh said:

Looking more and more like ride or die with whatever legit major leaguers they got.

No drunken sailors on this boat.

[mtutiger]

Is Brett Anderson still out there or did someone offer him a deal yet?

Edited March 18, 2022 by mtutiger

[bobrob2004]

3 hours ago, oblong said:

I think there is enough complexity in accounting rules and how these teams are structured than an org can show whatever suits them in terms of a profit or not. When a team goes on sale there’s demand.  

Just like Hollywood claims that every movie doesn't make a profit to avoid paying taxes. 

[Sports_Freak]

I totally forgot about Turnbull until they mentioned him today. When is he scheduled to return?

[mtutiger]

 

 

Edited March 19, 2022 by mtutiger

[RandyMarsh]

MLBtraderumors says that we are indeed signing Michael Pineda. 

[Tenacious D]

Tigers are reported to have signed Michael Pineda.  Very solid.

[mtutiger]

I see a lot of frustration on social media that they didn't go for Montes or Manaea, but given that those two very well could have required Manning as a piece of the package, I almost prefer this result . Good short term depth addition, gives them more flexibility with Alexander as well.

Edited March 19, 2022 by mtutiger

[Timmitch55]

MICHAEL PINEDA

[chasfh]

Pineda is a big injury risk who has outperformed his peripherals the past few years, but he’s ours now, so, go Michael. 

[alex]

3 minutes ago, chasfh said:

Pineda is a big injury risk who has outperformed his peripherals the past few years, but he’s ours now, so, go Michael. 

They still might try for another move, maybe more so for depth.

[RandyMarsh]

I like this method as well, even though I would've loved to trade for a premium pitcher I just don't know if would be wise to trade one of our top prospects or young cost controlled guys at this point. Assuming we don't go sign Correa or Story we're probably going to need alot of things to go right to have a legit chance of making the playoffs, I would hate to mortgage the future with the expectation that we are going to be contenders only for the things we need to happen not come to fruition so we end up being a mid 70s to .500 team.

I'd rather see if guys like Mize and Skubal progress, Baddoo shows he wasn't a fluke, Greene and Tork make immediate impacts etc. before making a drastic move. If June or July comes and all those things happen and we are right in the thick of things we could always make a more drastic move then.  

[mtutiger]

6 minutes ago, alex said:

They still might try for another move, maybe more so for depth.

I'm kinda working off the assumption that Alexander will still be making some starts this year. But having Pineda at least means you aren't rolling through 162 while rolling the dice on just Alexander to hold down #5.

If Pineda stays healthy (not a guarantee), he will do just fine for someone holding down a 4/5 starting slot. At the terms listed by Jon Heyman, seems like a pretty good value.

Edited March 19, 2022 by mtutiger

[Tenacious D]

He’s a 5th starter.  Very adequate, along with Peralta and Alexander to provide depth and insurance.

I’ll allow it

[chasfh]

8 minutes ago, alex said:

They still might try for another move, maybe more so for depth.

I don’t know who’s left besides Cueto. Do you think we’re going after him?

[mtutiger]

10 minutes ago, RandyMarsh said:

I like this method as well, even though I would've loved to trade for a premium pitcher I just don't know if would be wise to trade one of our top prospects or young cost controlled guys at this point. Assuming we don't go sign Correa or Story we're probably going to need alot of things to go right to have a legit chance of making the playoffs, I would hate to mortgage the future with the expectation that we are going to be contenders only for the things we need to happen not come to fruition so we end up being a mid 70s to .500 team.

I'd rather see if guys like Mize and Skubal progress, Baddoo shows he wasn't a fluke, Greene and Tork make immediate impacts etc. before making a drastic move. If June or July comes and all those things happen and we are right in the thick of things we could always make a more drastic move then.  

Also, iirc, Manaea has one year and Montes two left on their contracts. If you execute a trade for either, you are risking whatever odds they may want to test free agency.

Like you suggest, if their playoff chances weren't fringey, it would be one thing... but idk, it's risky to make that kinda move with where they are at now. Depth will serve them better at least in the short term... if they are performing better than expected in July, maybe we are having a different conversation 

Edited March 19, 2022 by mtutiger

[Tenacious D]

1 minute ago, chasfh said:

I don’t know who’s left besides Cueto. Do you think we’re going after him?

I suspect they are done, and probably justifiably.  Some combination of Manning, Alexander, Pineda, Peralta, with Wentz, Hill and Brieske waiting in the wings.

[chasfh]

2 minutes ago, Tenacious D said:

I suspect they are done, and probably justifiably.  Some combination of Manning, Alexander, Pineda, Peralta, with Wentz, Hill and Brieske waiting in the wings.

So do I. I’m glad they made even this move. I was wondering whether they were done before this.

[chasfh]

Fangraphs has the rotation with Pineda 3 above Skubal and Manning.